Making horse racing more popular

[Cangamble]

Originally Posted by King Ritchie

Pure and simple, the problem is TAXATION. Why should the state and feds get a percentage of every dollar wagered?

The 30% withholding is mind boggling stupidity. That takes out lots of potential churn money from gambler's pockets.

[ralph_the_cat]

Originally Posted by King Ritchie

Pure and simple, the problem is TAXATION. Why should the state and feds get a percentage of every dollar wagered?

This is why people arent wagering?

[Cangamble]

Originally Posted by ralph_the_cat

This is why people arent wagering?

In Canada, we expect to get taxed for just about everything. How else do you think we get "free" healthcare.

[firstofftheclaim]

Lowering takeout will not make horseracing more popular, by more popular I think you mean mainstream. Who cares if the take on a tri is 30%. You still have to win the fucking thing first. Lowering the takeout will not bring novices in to the track. Novices don't know what a takeout is. They don't give a shit what the takeout is. Most people have a negative view towards horseracing because they feel it is cruelty to the animal, degenerate gambling etc... Nothing will change that, because, let's be honest. It kinda is for degenerates, and animals are treated pretty shitty.

[russowen77]

It is funny. Few people I know know what the takeout is on any casino game they play and can't even find out when it comes to slots. They can only find out the max it can be. As far as I can tell it is impossible to tell on slots.

Casinos take the fed money out as well on big winnings. Just like the track.

I understand that lowering takeout would attract the larger, and usually better informed bettor to the track, what I would like to see is a little outside the box thinking so we could get the less informed money back.

Peersonally, I would like to see areas where boxes had tables, video gaming displays were in the box so other games could be done while one waited for races, and the track support local resturants where decent food could be ordered and delivered to the customers without racing.

Employess with hand held devices that could take bets like other hawk food at ballparks would also be a nice thing imo. I think that if you had sports bar areas where the patrons could watch other games while being able to easily bet would be great even if one could not bet on the other games. Excited or sad fans bet more imo.

I just don't think any knee jerk response is going to get the average fan back and for those of us who have some clue it would just get better and better. It is going to take a little more strategic thinking.

Lower the takeouts too far and see what type of stock you have to bet on on all but a few major tracks. It would help the players for sure. I don't want to see player races out there, a bunch of old men trying 6 f could get real ugly.

In case no one has noticed the costs of feed, fuel, etc are sking while the purses are not going up in venues without slots. Y'all say the players pay all the bills and that is a flat lie in many venues. The horseman are charged for all kinds of things also and they have employees. How many does the average horseman have.

My take is find out how to get the sucker money back and we will all be fine. Well maybe. The next to last breeders cup if one bought beer in one area he couldn't take it to other ones where different beer is being hawked.I have never seen anything like it before or after.

[Jeff P]

If I owned a racetrack... I'd implement a master plan to grow the hell out of my business at the expense of my competitors by... I know it's unheard of... understanding my customers and giving my customers what they want.

Here's a short list:

1. The facility would be clean... the employees customer friendly... Casinos make a very good mimc-able role model for making a gambling establishment as inviiting as possible. We're not talking about rocket science here. A clean and friendly place should be a given not the exception.

2. I'd lobby the hell out of my elected representatives to allow me to drop my takeout to 10-12 pct. And I'd publicize the hell out of the fact that I was doing that. Bettors would know they have a fighting chance. And while I might have a dress code in my clubhouse, my customers would never pay for admission or parking.

3. I'd do everything in the world (even cutting back race dates) to make sure that when my racing secretary writes conditions for a race: it fills. My priorities would be CUSTOMER based not status quo based. I know my customers want competitive races and large fields. THAT's what I'd strive for. Not the opposite. And I know it's a stretch but RACING (not slots) would be the focus of my business. You'd see a beautiful saddling area/paddock. And a facility where everything is geared towards customers watching and betting on my races.

4. I'd do everything in the world to distribute my signal as widely as possible. My live track video and replays and charts would be available right from my track's website. EVERY ADW on the planet would get a chance to carry my signal. Even if, hell, especially if they offered rebates to their players. NONE of them would get exclusive rights to my signal. If there were laws standing in the way of any of this, again, I'd lobby the hell out of my elected state representatives to get those laws changed and publicize the hell out of the fact that I was doing that. Again, my philosophy would be give the CUSTOMER what they want - not the opposite of what they want.

5. I'd create a player rewards program with teeth in it. Players who came out to my facility to bet would enjoy a substantial reduced takeout vs those that stayed home. If there were laws standing in the way of that, again, I'd lobby the hell out of my elected state representatives to get things changed and publicize the hell out of the fact that I was doing that. Come out to my track and get an extra 4 pct off of a 12 pct takeout. You think I can't draw crowds back to racing?

6. Customers would find that my kitchen offered quality food & beverages at very competitive prices. Again, that should be a given not the exception.

7. I'd cut a deal with Bris or Equibase or the DRF or HDW. One of the many benefits of my player rewards card would be that my customer gets FREE pp's and results of races run at my track. Period. Again, I'm in the gambling business. I'll make up any data costs ten fold through increased handle.

8. You'd see a replay of the stretch run of my feature race every day on the sports highlights segment of the most pupular local TV channel in whatever town my track was located in. You'd also see a section every day in the sports page of my local newspaper showing overnight entries, a handicap of today's races by a trackman, and the charts of yesterday's races. How do I do that? Simple. Advertising dollars talk.

When the races are over and it's time to go home, my customers leave with a sense of "Wow - that was a really fun day. WHEN can we come back?"

Oh yeah, one more thing... give me 15 years and I'll grow my business to the point where handle and the quality of my races kicks the ass of any MEC or TrackNet track to the point where a meet at MY track is now one of the premier events in all of racing... and for one reason only: MY customers will be getting what they want.



-jp

.

[dav4463]

We need cheerleaders.

[Jeff P]

One more thing... was trying to edit my prior post and ran out of edit time...

9. My marketing director would be making calls and pounding pavement. Groups from local organizations and large employers would always find themselves being invited out to a day at the races with some special promo thrown in like - if your group can reach a consensus and pick the late double we'll donate $1000 to your group's treasury and $10,000 to your group's favorite charity. And you'd better believe that whenever my marketing dept writes an 11k check that the story makes it into the newspaper and it gets mentioned on the 10:00 news that night. After a while my track kind of finds itself entrenched/accepted by the local community and groups are jumping at the chance to come back for a day at the races when my marketing director calls them up.


-jp

.

[alysheba88]

Originally Posted by firstofftheclaim

Lowering takeout will not make horseracing more popular, by more popular I think you mean mainstream. Who cares if the take on a tri is 30%. You still have to win the fucking thing first. Lowering the takeout will not bring novices in to the track. Novices don't know what a takeout is. They don't give a shit what the takeout is. Most people have a negative view towards horseracing because they feel it is cruelty to the animal, degenerate gambling etc... Nothing will change that, because, let's be honest. It kinda is for degenerates, and animals are treated pretty shitty.

I dont agree at all. With any of this. Sure there are people who "dont notice it". But in the end the high takeout grinds them out of the game. Then they are lost forever.

The more money you return to the player the more they will bet back.

Thats why slots are so profitable.

The stuff about cruelty is pure nonsense. Sure there is a wing of horse racing critics who mention that, but is only a very very small proportion of people who dont like horse racing.

[SMOO]

Originally Posted by Jeff P

If I owned a racetrack... I'd implement a master plan to grow the hell out of my business at the expense of my competitors by... I know it's unheard of... understanding my customers and giving my customers what they want.

Here's a short list:

1. The facility would be clean... the employees customer friendly... Casinos make a very good mimc-able role model for making a gambling establishment as inviiting as possible. We're not talking about rocket science here. A clean and friendly place should be a given not the exception.

2. I'd lobby the hell out of my elected representatives to allow me to drop my takeout to 10-12 pct. And I'd publicize the hell out of the fact that I was doing that. Bettors would know they have a fighting chance. And while I might have a dress code in my clubhouse, my customers would never pay for admission or parking.

3. I'd do everything in the world (even cutting back race dates) to make sure that when my racing secretary writes conditions for a race: it fills. My priorities would be CUSTOMER based not status quo based. I know my customers want competitive races and large fields. THAT's what I'd strive for. Not the opposite. And I know it's a stretch but RACING (not slots) would be the focus of my business. You'd see a beautiful saddling area/paddock. And a facility where everything is geared towards customers watching and betting on my races.

4. I'd do everything in the world to distribute my signal as widely as possible. My live track video and replays and charts would be available right from my track's website. EVERY ADW on the planet would get a chance to carry my signal. Even if, hell, especially if they offered rebates to their players. NONE of them would get exclusive rights to my signal. If there were laws standing in the way of any of this, again, I'd lobby the hell out of my elected state representatives to get those laws changed and publicize the hell out of the fact that I was doing that. Again, my philosophy would be give the CUSTOMER what they want - not the opposite of what they want.

5. I'd create a player rewards program with teeth in it. Players who came out to my facility to bet would enjoy a substantial reduced takeout vs those that stayed home. If there were laws standing in the way of that, again, I'd lobby the hell out of my elected state representatives to get things changed and publicize the hell out of the fact that I was doing that. Come out to my track and get an extra 4 pct off of a 12 pct takeout. You think I can't draw crowds back to racing?

6. Customers would find that my kitchen offered quality food & beverages at very competitive prices. Again, that should be a given not the exception.

7. I'd cut a deal with Bris or Equibase or the DRF or HDW. One of the many benefits of my player rewards card would be that my customer gets FREE pp's and results of races run at my track. Period. Again, I'm in the gambling business. I'll make up any data costs ten fold through increased handle.

8. You'd see a replay of the stretch run of my feature race every day on the sports highlights segment of the most pupular local TV channel in whatever town my track was located in. You'd also see a section every day in the sports page of my local newspaper showing overnight entries, a handicap of today's races by a trackman, and the charts of yesterday's races. How do I do that? Simple. Advertising dollars talk.

When the races are over and it's time to go home, my customers leave with a sense of "Wow - that was a really fun day. WHEN can we come back?"

Oh yeah, one more thing... give me 15 years and I'll grow my business to the point where handle and the quality of my races kicks the ass of any MEC or TrackNet track to the point where a meet at MY track is now one of the premier events in all of racing... and for one reason only: MY customers will be getting what they want.



-jp

.

[ny0707ny]

I agree with the signal part!

I sure wish ESPN would show more horse racing rather than cheerleading all the time. I don't get no horse racing channels so I have no idea what is going on the country unless I read about it online.

This is a major problem in that no channels show it on TV hardly. Only leading up to the Derby. What about the rest of the year?

[russowen77]

Originally Posted by Jeff P

If I owned a racetrack... I'd implement a master plan to grow the hell out of my business at the expense of my competitors by... I know it's unheard of... understanding my customers and giving my customers what they want.

Here's a short list:

1. The facility would be clean... the employees customer friendly... Casinos make a very good mimc-able role model for making a gambling establishment as inviiting as possible. We're not talking about rocket science here. A clean and friendly place should be a given not the exception.

2. I'd lobby the hell out of my elected representatives to allow me to drop my takeout to 10-12 pct. And I'd publicize the hell out of the fact that I was doing that. Bettors would know they have a fighting chance. And while I might have a dress code in my clubhouse, my customers would never pay for admission or parking.

3. I'd do everything in the world (even cutting back race dates) to make sure that when my racing secretary writes conditions for a race: it fills. My priorities would be CUSTOMER based not status quo based. I know my customers want competitive races and large fields. THAT's what I'd strive for. Not the opposite. And I know it's a stretch but RACING (not slots) would be the focus of my business. You'd see a beautiful saddling area/paddock. And a facility where everything is geared towards customers watching and betting on my races.

4. I'd do everything in the world to distribute my signal as widely as possible. My live track video and replays and charts would be available right from my track's website. EVERY ADW on the planet would get a chance to carry my signal. Even if, hell, especially if they offered rebates to their players. NONE of them would get exclusive rights to my signal. If there were laws standing in the way of any of this, again, I'd lobby the hell out of my elected state representatives to get those laws changed and publicize the hell out of the fact that I was doing that. Again, my philosophy would be give the CUSTOMER what they want - not the opposite of what they want.

5. I'd create a player rewards program with teeth in it. Players who came out to my facility to bet would enjoy a substantial reduced takeout vs those that stayed home. If there were laws standing in the way of that, again, I'd lobby the hell out of my elected state representatives to get things changed and publicize the hell out of the fact that I was doing that. Come out to my track and get an extra 4 pct off of a 12 pct takeout. You think I can't draw crowds back to racing?

6. Customers would find that my kitchen offered quality food & beverages at very competitive prices. Again, that should be a given not the exception.

7. I'd cut a deal with Bris or Equibase or the DRF or HDW. One of the many benefits of my player rewards card would be that my customer gets FREE pp's and results of races run at my track. Period. Again, I'm in the gambling business. I'll make up any data costs ten fold through increased handle.

8. You'd see a replay of the stretch run of my feature race every day on the sports highlights segment of the most pupular local TV channel in whatever town my track was located in. You'd also see a section every day in the sports page of my local newspaper showing overnight entries, a handicap of today's races by a trackman, and the charts of yesterday's races. How do I do that? Simple. Advertising dollars talk.

When the races are over and it's time to go home, my customers leave with a sense of "Wow - that was a really fun day. WHEN can we come back?"

Oh yeah, one more thing... give me 15 years and I'll grow my business to the point where handle and the quality of my races kicks the ass of any MEC or TrackNet track to the point where a meet at MY track is now one of the premier events in all of racing... and for one reason only: MY customers will be getting what they want.



-jp

.

Since none of your suggestions involve helping horseman where is your stock going to come from. It sounds like a good recipie for a really nice plant with Blue Ribbon Down stock to me.

I understand that the players would be very happy. HOwever, who else?

Lord knows the salary structrure for the track employees would surely suck. I am sure the legislature would gladly allow you to lower the take out as long as their % stays the same.

[Cangamble]

Originally Posted by firstofftheclaim

Lowering takeout will not make horseracing more popular, by more popular I think you mean mainstream. Who cares if the take on a tri is 30%. You still have to win the fucking thing first. Lowering the takeout will not bring novices in to the track. Novices don't know what a takeout is. They don't give a shit what the takeout is. Most people have a negative view towards horseracing because they feel it is cruelty to the animal, degenerate gambling etc... Nothing will change that, because, let's be honest. It kinda is for degenerates, and animals are treated pretty shitty.

Most people don't have a clue about the takeout, but that doesn't mean lowering the takeout won't have drastic affects on increasing the bottom line for tracks.
People will churn more, and most importantly winners and near winners will be created. This will create a buzz which will bring in new players.
It will also kill off the offshore rebate shops in most instances, bringing much of the money that is lost offshore to the mainland and to race tracks, which will cause higher profits for the tracks and better purses.

[Cangamble]

Who cares if the take on a tri is 30%
******************************
We need more players like you feeding the pools.
Why not make the take on tris 50% using your logic?

[DeanT]

Originally Posted by russowen77

Since none of your suggestions involve helping horseman where is your stock going to come from. It sounds like a good recipie for a really nice plant with Blue Ribbon Down stock to me.

I understand that the players would be very happy. HOwever, who else?

Lord knows the salary structrure for the track employees would surely suck. I am sure the legislature would gladly allow you to lower the take out as long as their % stays the same.

Huh?

His plans grows the game. Growing the game = more dollars for purses.

Every study done forever says if takeout is lowered revenue goes up. That is why slot machines were 30% takeouts in the 1960's and were lowered to the inflection point of 8% or so.