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Old 09-16-2022, 02:43 PM   #1
Boomer
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Aqueduct Race 2

Aqueduct



Pacesetter, firm turf, other likely speed in race



goes a 28.3 first 1/4


Freehold Race 2


Lowest level Pacers in the world


Pacesetter goes a 27.4 querter


Both win
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Old 09-16-2022, 03:16 PM   #2
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FAQ?

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Old 09-16-2022, 07:49 PM   #3
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All times, fraction and final, are probably about three seconds slow. I'm guessing the clock started early. I'm skeptical of the time in the chart ( 2:13.16 ) but will defer to CJ. I'm guessing the final time was closer to 2:14.
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Old 09-16-2022, 09:40 PM   #4
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All times, fraction and final, are probably about three seconds slow. I'm guessing the clock started early. I'm skeptical of the time in the chart ( 2:13.16 ) but will defer to CJ. I'm guessing the final time was closer to 2:14.
I will time it for figures and it also gets passed on to the Beyer team. Whether the times will ever make the official chart is a different story as the NYSGC Steward is the one that makes that decision and usually does not authorize a change to whatever wrong time is in the chart. Maybe the fact it is listed as a track record will change his mind.

Side note: Why are hand timed races eligible to be track records? That makes no sense.
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Old 09-16-2022, 10:05 PM   #5
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The first part of timing a race is finding one you can trust was correct. On turf, that involves matching the temporary rail setting, and hopefully run up too but that isn't necessary. The last race I could find to match was the 2020 G3 Red Smith Stakes. It was run on the same course (not the outer), 18 foot temp rail.

The run up was listed as 81 feet that day as compared to 240 today, but that 81 is way, way off. The time of the run up that day 6.38 seconds. I could still run 81 feet in that time I'm pretty sure. Looking at the replay, I'm confident the run up was the same for both of these races. It isn't like there are a lot of spots to bring the gate on the turf course. For these races, I'd guess the run up is really about 260 feet. This shouldn't be that hard to measure and know the distances, but that is what we get from the tracks.

Using that info, I was able to time the race and for the final time I get 2:13.93 for this race. That is exactly 3 seconds faster (that is a coincidence) than the posted time during the race. Just because the final time is off a certain amount doesn't mean the fractions which also be off the same amount, it depends on what the problem was. But in this case, it looks like it was just an early start and you can deduct 3.00 from each call for much better times.

Last edited by cj; 09-16-2022 at 10:36 PM.
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Old 09-17-2022, 09:27 AM   #6
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In this day and age is it really this difficult to time races correctly? NYRA should be embarrassed by this.
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Old 09-17-2022, 10:44 AM   #7
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It's not just NYRA, the entire industry should be embarrassed.
They can't even get run ups right, or even GELDING right.
OMG, ROCKEY SCIENCE.

How about the NY Stewatd,who seems to be nothing more a speed bump, go to the paddock each race and ckeck each hores for gelding status?

Here is the bottom line, if the tracks wanted most of these problems fixed, they would be fixed. Timing included, because if CJ, ONE GUY can do it with video, then tracks have no excuses.

Thanks to CJ and Andy for at least reporting these things when they happen so we can be warned.
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Old 09-17-2022, 11:29 AM   #8
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If tracks would have the timer start when the gates open (like the rest of the world) many of these problems would disappear. No run up - no birds flying by and tripping the timing beam etc etc...
Then all we would have to worry about is the placement of the gate
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Old 09-17-2022, 11:34 AM   #9
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It's not just NYRA, the entire industry should be embarrassed.
They can't even get run ups right, or even GELDING right.
OMG, ROCKEY SCIENCE.

How about the NY Stewatd,who seems to be nothing more a speed bump, go to the paddock each race and ckeck each hores for gelding status?

Here is the bottom line, if the tracks wanted most of these problems fixed, they would be fixed. Timing included, because if CJ, ONE GUY can do it with video, then tracks have no excuses.

Thanks to CJ and Andy for at least reporting these things when they happen so we can be warned.
Yep, the industry as a whole does not care and it shows. Only being propped up by CAW$ and slot welfare.
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Old 09-17-2022, 12:39 PM   #10
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It'w not just NYRA......but Bris still gave the race pace figures!

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Old 09-17-2022, 01:17 PM   #11
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If tracks would have the timer start when the gates open (like the rest of the world) many of these problems would disappear. No run up - no birds flying by and tripping the timing beam etc etc...
Then all we would have to worry about is the placement of the gate
This would cause a lot of short term pain but it would be worth it in the long run. On turf, there are only so many places to bring the gate onto the course. And those won't be exact distances as currently constructed. On dirt, the gate would have to placed in the same spot each time. Good luck with that one.

Two things should be a given to be reported accurately for a horse race, the time and the distance. We don't know the distance the vast majority of the time because run up isn't taken seriously by racetracks. What we get is the time for a specified distance. When there are timing problems in addition to the poor distance reporting, things get exponentially worse.
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Old 09-17-2022, 01:31 PM   #12
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This would cause a lot of short term pain but it would be worth it in the long run. On turf, there are only so many places to bring the gate onto the course. And those won't be exact distances as currently constructed. On dirt, the gate would have to placed in the same spot each time. Good luck with that one.

Two things should be a given to be reported accurately for a horse race, the time and the distance. We don't know the distance the vast majority of the time because run up isn't taken seriously by racetracks. What we get is the time for a specified distance. When there are timing problems in addition to the poor distance reporting, things get exponentially worse.
That is the reason I quit making numbers for Gulfstream. They would have different runups for the same distance on the same card.
Became too much of a headache.
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Old 09-17-2022, 01:37 PM   #13
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That is the reason I quit making numbers for Gulfstream. They would have different runups for the same distance on the same card.
Became too much of a headache.
The run ups also weren't accurate.

Unfortunately, for the most part, the people the make decisions like that don't understand the repercussions and also don't bother asking people that would know.
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