& the beat goes on...

[the little guy]

Originally Posted by ScottJ

First post on this board and just like to deal with facts in horse racing when possible. On this post, many folks know Andy's alma mater is Lehigh however few know his undergraduate major. Before questioning his mathematical training, you might want to get the background on that one.

He's a complete sycophantic clown. Literally spends his days sucking up to losers all over the internet. I called his BS so he says dumb things about me.

I'm good with it. He's a buffoon.

[the little guy]

Originally Posted by Robert Fischer

apt comparison

It's not an apt comparison. However, him thinking he could explain it might be the funniest thing ever posted on this board.

One guy claims he knows the only way to play and I claim there are numerous ways to play, and it's up to the individual to decide what is best for him and her.

That's the discussion in a nutshell.

I do think it's super nice of you to be the only person here that ever responds to Classsycophant. It really is a good deed for the day.

[MJC922]

Not sure what was said on twitter but classhandicapper is a very knowledgeable handicapper IMO. I value the opinions of several posters in this thread quite a bit fwiw.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by the little guy

He's a complete sycophantic clown. Literally spends his days sucking up to losers all over the internet. I called his BS so he says dumb things about me.

I'm good with it. He's a buffoon.

I love the sport and challenge of trying to beat this game as much as anyone. My results suggest I have something to contribute to the conversation. So I'll discuss gambling issues with anyone I think has important things to say or that loves the sport as much a I do.

There are very very few people I can't get along with. You are one of them. I'm not going to rehash what you did while I was employed at DRF and embarrass you further. I already did that. I'll give you advice instead.

If you didn't have a giant but fragile ego and actually listened to some of the criticisms of your thinking, you'd be an even better player than you are.

If you didn't attack everyone that criticizes NYRA or that disagrees with you, fewer people would dislike you.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by the little guy

It's not an apt comparison. However, him thinking he could explain it might be the funniest thing ever posted on this board.

One guy claims he knows the only way to play and I claim there are numerous ways to play, and it's up to the individual to decide what is best for him and her.

That's the discussion in a nutshell.

Most people in the industry are giving advice to players that are struggling to win that makes it more likely they'll create some combinations that are EV- and possibly even turn a small winner into a loser.

One guy is pointing to the flaws of that common way of thinking and trying to help people get over the top and win.

Admittedly, ITP does not have a great bedside manor and imo would do better to not criticize people in the industry when trying to help. That doesn't make what he's saying (if you actually listen to it) wrong.

The difference between winning and losing for some players is not their handicapping. It's their betting. There's no value logic to the pool they choose to go into or value math in how they structure their tickets. I know that because when I started to understand it better I started getting better results.

And yes, I'm no black belt guru at betting. I'll leave that to the computer guys. But I could explain a lot about pool selection and bet structure that would improve most people's results.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by MJC922

Not sure what was said on twitter but classhandicapper is a very knowledgeable handicapper IMO. I value the opinions of several posters in this thread quite a bit fwiw.

Apparently agreeing with a few people on horizontal betting that unfortunately criticize his thinking in an overly harsh way is a problem. The funniest part of it is that I typically qualify my comments by defending his thinking for Win and Exacta wagering and making it clear he obviously understands the goal.

[Robert Fischer]

wow, Hi Andy,

i understand it's a jab at Classhandicapper (and pros/cons, I consider ClassHandicapper a friend from a long time message board), but I'm sort of nervously grinning and doing some projecting here as I type this post (I've even had a coffee for this 'Fishercophant' response, how sad?)...

I have typed much dumb stuff and hopefully not unintentionally offensive stuff from time-to-time PA/Twitter/FB/Reddit/etc.... anyone playing more than occasional entertainment style has an ego and I'm not immune... Add in Trauma stuff/overwhelming life stuff (diag PTSD) has been weird on me as well as significant physical health cardiac/connective-tissue issues.
I believe you asked about my absence several years ago, when it turned otu to be a laptop breakdown. Was nice gesture that I remember with respect until you dismissed a speed horse one day that made me lose a Pick4. kidding.

Anyway, for whatever reasons, you and I have Not discussed a race probably even indirectly in a few years. I assumed someething had been offensive and you had to place me on 'Mute'.
Allowing for how busy you are, and the several hats you wear, 1000% understand that Twitter, (or even P.A.) isn't about you being my free tutor, unpaid syndicate advisor and industry insider who always finds time to reply.
( what a coffee!?)

I hope I've stated it clearly that I have respect for you. During the slow(er) part of the year, I would greatly enjoy some racing discussion of the basics as well as juicy horseplayer stuff. Beneath the awkward slow sounding discussion voice, and the mutant 6'9" 195lbs basketball disguise, I have a few opinions, and horse racing mental model stuff, and no need to have my name as the author be it book or media.
Well this is getting weird, but I thought you had me on eternal mute. I met Claudio Gonzales a few days ago and almost asked him to tone down the LOUD speakerphone cellphone act before I realized who he was. Similar shy/embarrass.

As far as the 'debate' or the shots taken on Twitter - Some of these guys have a misery-loves-company 'VIBE'... and before I get to the heart of the debates, there's often misrepresentation/misunderstanding of what you've said (twisted purposefully or ignorantly?, or both).

// getting used to this pat of butter, and a dash of coconut oil that my uncle turned me on to...

Side Comment = Not teaching Andy or most of PA anything here = but if you're playing a Multi for a profit

Originally Posted by the little guy;2818438[B

It's not an apt comparison. However, him thinking he could explain it might be the funniest thing ever posted on this board.[/B][/B][/B]

One guy claims he knows the only way to play and I claim there are numerous ways to play, and it's up to the individual to decide what is best for him and her.

That's the discussion in a nutshell.

I do think it's super nice of you to be the only person here that ever responds to Classsycophant. It really is a good deed for the day.

Community service?

[the little guy]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

There are very very few people I can't get along with. You are one of them. I'm not going to rehash what you did while I was employed at DRF and embarrass you further. I already did that. I'll give you advice instead.

I'm not going to address the rest of the BS you spew here, and the very idea that you could give me advice is amusing, but so is most of what you post, but I will address this outright lie.

I did nothing to you when you worked at DRF. The very idea that I even could is laughable. I get that you and various other creeps think you can lie about me all you want, and even get a few other losers to believe it, but since this message board is a theoretical community, it's a little more reprehensible that you would choose to do it here. But, I guess you have seen so many others do it in the corners of the internet that you inhabit, that you thought it would be acceptable here. It isn't. You're even worse than I realized.

I'm proud of the number of good people I have helped in various ways in this industry. I'm not going to let detritus like you try to smear my good name.

[Bustin Stones]

I'm not sure which side of this debate I fall on, if any, but here goes:
First a caveat: I do not have a degree in math.
I believe that if one is good enough handicapping to make a profit flat betting, then they can supercharge their returns with ticket construction.
I also believe that if one cannot turn a profit flat betting that no amount of ticket construction will turn that into profit.
I'd be interested in anyone's ability to mathematically prove that it can be done.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by the little guy

I'm not going to address the rest of the BS you spew here, and the very idea that you could give me advice is amusing, but so is most of what you post, but I will address this outright lie.

So now you are saying I am lying when I say I worked at DRF and got called into my boss's office for posts I was making here at PA?

At the time, my job was to help develop and test new versions of Formulator. I was helping people here use Formulator functionality better.

One day my boss called me into his office and said someone sent a critical email to management about me related to my posts on PA and specifically about Formulator. He asked to see what I was writing. I showed him the posts. Fortunately, he laughed, said it was you, and told me to continue. Maybe you don't remember that, but I do and even discussed it with a couple of other employees we both know at the time.

Why would anyone mess with a man's job like that and try to get him into trouble?

Look, we've had disagreements for a long time, but there's a reason I went from respectful disagreement to having the problem with you I have now. It has nothing to do with handicapping, betting, NYRA, or anything else on these dumb message boards. If you are going to insist it wasn't you or you don't even remember it, so be it. It probably meant nothing to you. But I am 100% sure I am not lying and 100% sure what my boss said. I remember it very well.

I might disagree with you on betting or on a race, but I'd never in a million years try to sabotage you at work. Truth be told, I'd rather put that incident behind me too. I'm comfortably retired. I prefer getting along with people. But you make that impossible. You are a public person that can't handle disagreement or criticism of you or NYRA and lash out at people instead.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by Bustin Stones

I'd be interested in anyone's ability to mathematically prove that it can be done.

I will reveal the magic formula you need,

Let X = $$$ bet
Let Y = $$$ returned

If Y>X, you got it!