Epidemiologist: Why Lockdowns Are The Wrong Policy

[PaceAdvantage]

hcap now puts APNEWS into his FAKE NEWS BLENDER

[Tom]

Originally Posted by hcap

Many counties did better than Sweden. In order to fairly judge Sweden should be compared to other Scandinavian countries with similar environments, culture and health care systems.

No!
That is NOT the criteria YOU use when you trash the USA every other post, you pathetic commie.

You are manipulating the data, as usual.

[hcap]

Originally Posted by Tom

No!
That is NOT the criteria YOU use when you trash the USA every other post, you pathetic commie.

You are manipulating the data, as usual.

The history of Sweden compared to the other countries history are valid comparisons.

At the moment, there are at least 50 or more countries that have zero or lower fatalities than Sweden.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

Canada and Australia had 2 yesterday. Singapore, Norway, Denmark, New Zealand and dozens of others had zero yesterday

[Tom]

Originally Posted by hcap

The history of Sweden compared to the other countries history are valid comparisons.

At the moment, there are at least 50 or more countries that have zero or lower fatalities than Sweden.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

Canada and Australia had 2 yesterday. Singapore, Norway, Denmark, New Zealand and dozens of others had zero yesterday

And the USA is not like ANY other country, period. But YOU insist that it be compared to countries less the size of many US cities.

Nice try bozo, your schitck is showing.

[hcap]

Originally Posted by Tom

And the USA is not like ANY other country, period. But YOU insist that it be compared to countries less the size of many US cities.

Nice try bozo, your schitck is showing.

The European Union has a greater population than the US, and they did many times better historically than we have. However both are beginning to experience either a second wave or substantial spikes in the first.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by hcap

The European Union has a greater population than the US, and they have many times better than we have. However both are experiencing either a second wave or substantial spkes in the first.

The entire world needs to go into lock-down mode immediately if not sooner.

[hcap]

Originally Posted by boxcar

The entire world needs to go into lock-down mode immediately if not sooner.

A coronavirus models projects deaths due to the virus in the United States will top 400,000 by the end of the year, with 410,000 projected by January 1, according to new data. That would more than double the current U.S. death toll, which stood at more than 188,000 as of Saturday, according to Johns Hopkins University.



However mitigation like social distancing and wearing masks could reduce that dramatically.
Know anyone who needs a mask?

[tucker6]

Originally Posted by hcap

A coronavirus models projects deaths due to the virus in the United States will top 400,000 by the end of the year, with 410,000 projected by January 1, according to new data. That would more than double the current U.S. death toll, which stood at more than 188,000 as of Saturday, according to Johns Hopkins University.



However mitigation like social distancing and wearing masks could reduce that dramatically.
Know anyone who needs a mask?

Reminds me of the time the epidemiologists gave Trump a dire warning that inaction would kill 2.2M Americans. Trump immediately stopped air travel with China, followed by air travel with Europe, and then he imposed a flatten-the-curve shutdown of the economy. It WORKED. So far we've only suffered 188k deaths instead of 2.2M. That's a reduction of 91.5% thanks to Trump listening to the scientists. I think he deserves a nomination for the Nobel Peace Prize. Again.

In all seriousness, he actually did a good job with the virus. If it wasn't for the blue state governors being stupid about nursing homes, the death toll would be at 100,000 at this point.

[classhandicapper]

Sweden knew going in they would get more cases and probably more deaths than their neighbors UP FRONT. That was the tradeoff for trying to limit the economic damage from more severe lockdowns all while moving towards greater immunity in the population much faster.

As we stand now, Sweden has more deaths, but a much higher percentage of their population has been exposed and is now immune (estimated at 12.6% of the country) compared to other countries in the region. Denmark 2.9%, Netherlands 7.9%, Finland 1.5%, Norway 1.3%,

Just today there was a report that the virus is starting to spread rapidly in Netherlands now. That's because they locked down harder and only 7.9% of their population was infected. So when they opened a little, it started spreading faster. They are in catchup mode.

All locking down does is delay the inevitable spike in infections. It makes sense from a hospital/ICU perspective to keep the growth under control. It also makes sense to try to protect the most vulnerable like Sweden did once it became apparent what the risks were. But in the end, it's coming for everyone that's not immune until we reach that elusive herd immunity level.....sooner or later.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

Sweden knew going in they would get more cases and probably more deaths than their neighbors UP FRONT. That was the tradeoff for trying to limit the economic damage from more severe lockdowns all while moving towards greater immunity in the population much faster.

As we stand now, Sweden has more deaths, but a much higher percentage of their population has been exposed and is now immune (estimated at 12.6% of the country) compared to other countries in the region. Denmark 2.9%, Netherlands 7.9%, Finland 1.5%, Norway 1.3%,

Just today there was a report that the virus is starting to spread rapidly in Netherlands now. That's because they locked down harder and only 7.9% of their population is infected. So when they opened a little, it started spreading faster. They are in catchup mode.

All locking down does is delay the inevitable spike in infections. It makes sense from a hospital/ICU perspective to keep the growth under control. It also makes sense to try to protect the most vulnerable like Sweden did once it became apparent what the risks were. But in the end, it's coming for everyone that's not immune until we reach that elusive herd immunity level.....sooner or later.

Exactly right! Been saying this stuff from the beginning.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by tucker6

If it wasn't for the blue state governors being stupid about nursing homes, the death toll would be at 100,000 at this point.

It's laughable how the media treats Cuomo when he is single handedly responsible for so many deaths. Then they give him credit for getting it under control when NYC and the surrounding suburbs have a 30-35% infection rate. He already killed a lot of the most vulnerable and a large percentage of the rest of us has already been exposed or is immune. That's why it slowed. The media is full of pinheads or liars. Take your pick. I'll also grant you it could be both.

[tucker6]

More than 40% of all deaths across the USA are nursing home related. That's 80,000+. An interesting fact is that NY is the only state that refuses to publish nursing home covid death data. If a republican did that, there would literally be riots in the streets over it. I don't know how some of the lefties on here sleep at night being a silent partner to genocide.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by tucker6

I don't know how some of the lefties on here sleep at night being a silent partner to genocide.

I'm forgiving of the general public. Most people believe what they are told by the mainstream media. Very few will search for unbiased or primary sources, look at the data for themselves etc..

It's the media that's feeding all the spins and lies to people. Then people get all riled up over things that aren't even true or that are wildly exaggerated.

How media people can sleep at night when they are contributing to riots, looting, fear, panic, life ruining economic losses etc.. is beyond me. These are not all people that simply have different values and priorities or people that are mistaken or ignorant. Many are flat out evil human beings willing to do damage to others just to advance their personal political agenda. To me, watching mainstream media is like watching a horror movie, except it's real.

[hcap]

Originally Posted by tucker6

Reminds me of the time the epidemiologists gave Trump a dire warning that inaction would kill 2.2M Americans. Trump immediately stopped air travel with China, followed by air travel with Europe, and then he imposed a flatten-the-curve shutdown of the economy. It WORKED. So far we've only suffered 188k deaths instead of 2.2M. That's a reduction of 91.5% thanks to Trump listening to the scientists. I think he deserves a nomination for the Nobel Peace Prize. Again.

In all seriousness, he actually did a good job with the virus. If it wasn't for the blue state governors being stupid about nursing homes, the death toll would be at 100,000 at this point.

NYT:Nearly 40k flew to U.S. from China after Trump's coronavirus travel ban
https://www.axios.com/coronavirus-tr...deb1ce0b3.html

His so-called ban did diddly squat

No we suffered 200,000 deaths out of 2.2 million if we did absolutely nothing.
Even your moron had to do something. But it was not enough. If he had started earlier and set up a national plan instead of passing the buck to the states, estimates are at least one half of the fatalities could have been avoided

WHOOP-DI-DO Go Trump!

[hcap]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

Sweden knew going in they would get more cases and probably more deaths than their neighbors UP FRONT. That was the tradeoff for trying to limit the economic damage from more severe lockdowns all while moving towards greater immunity in the population much faster.

As we stand now, Sweden has more deaths, but a much higher percentage of their population has been exposed and is now immune (estimated at 12.6% of the country) compared to other countries in the region. Denmark 2.9%, Netherlands 7.9%, Finland 1.5%, Norway 1.3%,

Just today there was a report that the virus is starting to spread rapidly in Netherlands now. That's because they locked down harder and only 7.9% of their population was infected. So when they opened a little, it started spreading faster. They are in catchup mode.

All locking down does is delay the inevitable spike in infections. It makes sense from a hospital/ICU perspective to keep the growth under control. It also makes sense to try to protect the most vulnerable like Sweden did once it became apparent what the risks were. But in the end, it's coming for everyone that's not immune until we reach that elusive herd immunity level.....sooner or later.

We have already discussed this. There is no evidence "herd immunity" happens at low level percentage of the population being infected. Sweden did not achieve herd immunity in any way. Their top epidemiologists deny that was their goal.

The Scandanavian countries primarily had the advantage of other relevant factors. Mostly a low population density and predominance of single occupant homes. Compared to other Scandinavian counties who instituted tighter mitigation measures, Sweden suffered 10 times as many fatalities.
And compared to other European counties, not a major reduction in historical outcomes over the entire pandemic

"All locking down does is delay the inevitable spike in infections"

Aren't you aware of the thousands of deaths avoided by many countries particularly the Asian ones and Australia and New Zealand? That's the same faulty reasoning maintaining mitigation measures only prevent overwhelming hospitals.

I have pointed out to you, you are a "day trader" You ignore larger epidemiological trends. Spikes in the first wave are expected as well as a second wave. That distinction between spike and wave is not yet clear, 7 months in.