California Chrome 4YO campaign total disaster

[BIGTKLO]

I agree that the venture to England seems strange, but Perry believes he is a turf horse. I have heard that The Arlington Million is a major goal, and that Chicago is where all the horses go into quarantine. He didn't attract much, if any, attention from American breeders, so who can fault his connections. California Chrome is a real good dirt horse, and now that Shared Belief is out with his year ending injury, hopefully he will be back this fall for the Classic.

[DeltaLover]

Originally Posted by BIGTKLO

I agree that the venture to England seems strange, but Perry believes he is a turf horse. I have heard that The Arlington Million is a major goal, and that Chicago is where all the horses go into quarantine. He didn't attract much, if any, attention from American breeders, so who can fault his connections. California Chrome is a real good dirt horse, and now that Shared Belief is out with his year ending injury, hopefully he will be back this fall for the Classic.

I do not think he was beaten by SB in last year's BCC!

[BIGTKLO]

CC went to Dubai to AVOID SB in the Big Cap.

[Lemon Drop Husker]

Personally, I think California Chrome and their owners had a lot to gain by going international, be it synthetic or turf.

Chrome's pedigree in the states will never be respected. Unless he had won the Triple Crown and or Breeder's Cup last year, his numbers were what they were after his Preakness victory.

And those aren't going to be all that fantastic given his breeding lines.

Soo...., if you own the horse, what will be your main objective?

Winning money? Likely, and also putting your horse on an international stage to impress international breeders along with even impressing those state-side with wins on multiple continents, multiple surfaces, and against some of the world's best.

I haven't been CC's biggest fan (heck, actually no fan at all), but I have no problem with what the connections have done with him. I thought the Dubai trip was a bit aggressive, but a 2nd place finish there shows it worthy.

Ascot? We'll see.

In the end...; #BringChromeHome

[biggestal99]

Originally Posted by mostpost

How is it that Art Sherman has suddenly turned into a god. Before California Chrome, I never heard of Art Sherman. Now, suddenly, he is the ultimate authority on everything.

The Shermans are comfortable in California. They are not comfortable anywhere else. That is why they object to sending him overseas.

Well i am a horseplayer and i heard of art sherman before cc, decent trainer, no stock
That he took cc with that pedigree to train, pletcher would have laughed messers colburn and perry outta the barn, speaks volumes.

Sherman is an old fashioned trainer with old fashioned ideas.

The game is played internationally these days.

Same with hollendorfer. You'll never see one of his horses racing internationally.

Give me a trainer like wesley ward everytime over these old phogies

Allan

[nijinski]

[QUOTE=biggestal99]Well i am a horseplayer and i heard of art sherman before cc, decent trainer, no stock
That he took cc with that pedigree to train, pletcher would have laughed messers colburn and perry outta the barn, speaks volumes.

Sherman is an old fashioned trainer with old fashioned ideas.

The game is played internationally these days.

Same with hollendorfer. You'll never see one of his horses racing internationally.

Give me a trainer like wesley ward everytime over these old phogies

Allan[/Q

Lost some respect for him when " Strike The Tiger " was dropped into
a 10,000 claimer .
This horse gave him headlines . His very first Ascot winner ! co bred
by him. Could have bought him from the owners at that point .





"

[Fager Fan]

Originally Posted by Lemon Drop Husker

Personally, I think California Chrome and their owners had a lot to gain by going international, be it synthetic or turf.

Chrome's pedigree in the states will never be respected. Unless he had won the Triple Crown and or Breeder's Cup last year, his numbers were what they were after his Preakness victory.

And those aren't going to be all that fantastic given his breeding lines.

Soo...., if you own the horse, what will be your main objective?

Winning money? Likely, and also putting your horse on an international stage to impress international breeders along with even impressing those state-side with wins on multiple continents, multiple surfaces, and against some of the world's best.

I haven't been CC's biggest fan (heck, actually no fan at all), but I have no problem with what the connections have done with him. I thought the Dubai trip was a bit aggressive, but a 2nd place finish there shows it worthy.

Ascot? We'll see.

In the end...; #BringChromeHome

Martin is misguided. It doesn't matter what the horse does in Europe. His pedigree and looks will never make him into a big time stallion prospect. He clearly doesn't understand that with good management, the horse could win more on the track than he could ever earn by an increase his stallion value. It's really just that simple.

[Fager Fan]

Originally Posted by biggestal99

Well i am a horseplayer and i heard of art sherman before cc, decent trainer, no stock
That he took cc with that pedigree to train, pletcher would have laughed messers colburn and perry outta the barn, speaks volumes.

Sherman is an old fashioned trainer with old fashioned ideas.

The game is played internationally these days.

Same with hollendorfer. You'll never see one of his horses racing internationally.

Give me a trainer like wesley ward everytime over these old phogies

Allan

What's so great about racing a horse in Europe? Have you seen the purses over there? They're attrocious. So unless it's worth the purse difference just for the experience (of which will cost the owner many more thousands in shipping and travel expenses for all the connections), I don't see the value.

[castaway01]

Originally Posted by Fager Fan

Martin is misguided. It doesn't matter what the horse does in Europe. His pedigree and looks will never make him into a big time stallion prospect. He clearly doesn't understand that with good management, the horse could win more on the track than he could ever earn by an increase his stallion value. It's really just that simple.

Well, that's not true at all. Even an increase of $10,000 in his stud fee, if he's with 100 mares a year, is $1 million a year. A conservative 15 years at stud, that's $15 million. Which he obviously isn't winning on the track.

The crazy move was Ascot because I don't believe he's good enough to beat a Group I field there. That's what he'd have to beat to really change breeders' view of him as a stud. Now we'll see if he even races again. A waste of time and effort and money all around.

[Fager Fan]

Originally Posted by castaway01

Well, that's not true at all. Even an increase of $10,000 in his stud fee, if he's with 100 mares a year, is $1 million a year. A conservative 15 years at stud, that's $15 million. Which he obviously isn't winning on the track.

That's not how it works. It's about his stallion prospect value and how much someone will pay to purchase him. The stallion either makes it or doesn't in the first four years (they may even give less time). The popularity of the stallion determines the stud fee they think they can get multiplied by the number of paying mares they think they can get over that time frame. The farm isn't paying the owners for what the horse could generate in years 5-15 because that's the income THEY hope to finally be making on the horse. In addition, the horse could be worth zero by that time as well.

Winning a turf race at Ascot isn't going to raise the horse's value a nickle in my opinion, but let's say it raised it by a million. He could more easily raise a million by running here, on dirt, in races over this year and next. There should be no timeline on this horse retiring (Perry is ill-advised again) as he has more to gain on the track than he will in the shed as long as he's healthy and running at the top level. Remember, he is by a dud stallion by a giveaway mare with mediocre looks at best.

[biggestal99]

Originally Posted by Fager Fan

What's so great about racing a horse in Europe? Have you seen the purses over there? They're attrocious. So unless it's worth the purse difference just for the experience (of which will cost the owner many more thousands in shipping and travel expenses for all the connections), I don't see the value.

The big races in europe, asia, mideast all carry great purses, they pay the owners/connections money to race good horses, now if you talk everyday purses in the uk, well they are terrible, but big races, nice purses.

Allan

[Fager Fan]

Originally Posted by biggestal99

The big races in europe, asia, mideast all carry great purses, they pay the owners/connections money to race good horses, now if you talk everyday purses in the uk, well they are terrible, but big races, nice purses.

Allan

W have nice purses here too, and without all the expenses of traveling for the horse and connections. The only races with any real upside normally are the DWC due to the huge purses.

[nads1420]

Originally Posted by BIGTKLO

CC went to Dubai to AVOID SB in the Big Cap.

[GaryG]

If he ever does run in Europe I seriously doubt that he will enhance his reputation. Then he comes home to face AP? The fat lady is in the wings. Just a shame to see a good horse managed like that.

[Mystic]

I wonder if they will still run him in the Arlington Million if he loses the next "planned" race, the Coral Eclipse on July 4th.