House Intel Committee

[reckless]

So far it looks like all these Trump haters ... including also all those haters of freedom and liberty: the Democrats, the media, far left kooks and the criminal elements in the FBI, DoJ, et al, all want to stop this memo from the public view. But, since they now can't, they want to discredit a hero and patriot, Nunes, from simply doing the right thing.

If the memo tells us nothing and if Nunes is a nut, the American people know better to make their own decisions about all this.

Again, why all the vitriol from those that say the memo is a nothing burger? They must know something, huh ...

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by Clocker

Hey, remember when Obama said if you like your doctor you can keep your doctor?

Attacking Nunes isn't going to change the facts. The memo says that DOJ and the FBI knowingly submitted opposition research paid for by the Democrats, but did not disclose the origin in the FISA application. If that is true, no amount of deflection with personal attacks is going to change that or make it any less serious.

I guess.

This certainly isn't a bombshell at all. If that was the sole reason for the warrant I guess it would be a big deal. I highly doubt that is the case though. Since the memo itself says it wasn't and the origin came from Papadopolous...

Quite frankly this whole thing is exhausting. I don't know why we can't just let a investigation run it's course. I'm not a huge fan of our most secret court tasked with national security being exposed by partisans.

[Clocker]

Pelosi says that if Trump uses the memo as an excuse to fire Rosenstein or Mueller, it could lead to a constitutional crisis.

"He has abdicated his responsibilities as commander in chief to protect the American people by protecting our intelligence sources and the rest," she said of Trump.

Now opposition research paid for by the DNC is part of our "intelligence sources"?

No rational person on either side of the aisle has denied that Trump has the constitutional power to fire either of those guys. So what's the constitutional crisis?

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/vi...al_crisis.html

[FantasticDan]

Originally Posted by Clocker

Attacking Nunes isn't going to change the facts. The memo says that DOJ and the FBI knowingly submitted opposition research paid for by the Democrats, but did not disclose the origin in the FISA application. If that is true, no amount of deflection with personal attacks is going to change that or make it any less serious.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...emo-fbi-russia

In July 2016, while advising the Trump campaign, Page flew to Moscow and met with Russian officials. This raised eyebrows among US intelligence officers, to say the least. So the FBI and DOJ put together an application to a Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) court — a court that approves surveillance warrants pertaining to national security and foreign intelligence — to start watching Page. The court granted the application.

The Nunes memo alleges that this surveillance was not properly vetted by the court; specifically, that it relied on the now-infamous Steele dossier, the document prepared by former British spy Christopher Steele alleging the existence of a conspiracy between Donald Trump and the Russian government. Steele’s research was, partially and indirectly, financed by the Clinton campaign — which the memo alleges is a major problem.

The Steele dossier, Nunes writes in the memo, “formed an essential part of the Carter Page application.” Nunes goes on to suggest that the application omitted several key facts about the Steele dossier that undermine its credibility, the most notable being the dossier’s financial backing from Democrats, and that Steele himself expressed opposition to Donald Trump becoming president.

There are lots of problems with the memo’s line of reasoning. For one thing, Steele is a respected investigator, and some of his dossier’s less explosive allegations have so far proven to be true. The FBI’s surveillance application may have relied on Steele’s findings, but if that’s true, it doesn’t necessarily discredit the application.

The memo’s claims are also impossible to evaluate without seeing the underlying intelligence it was based on. Nunes could have highlighted the FBI’s citation of Steele without mentioning other, more concrete sources the agency listed.

Moreover, the FBI relies on sources with axes to grind all the time — people typically don’t go to the authorities with damaging information about people they like. The key question in an application like this isn’t whether the source liked the target; it’s whether the specific claims they’re making are credible. The memo doesn’t address this at all.

Perhaps most fundamentally, the memo doesn’t ever substantiate core assertions about political bias on the FBI’s part. The memo’s overall method of argument is to imply something suspicious without asserting malfeasance outright.

For example, the memo repeatedly notes that the DOJ knew that “political actors” were involved in the financing the Steele dossier. It implies that the FBI knew they were Democrats and chose to ignore it.

But that’s never clearly stated, and for good reason. The firm that employed Steele was initially contracted by a conservative publication, the Washington Free Beacon, not any Democrats or Democratic political campaign. It’s possible the FBI knew of the Free Beacon’s involvement or was aware that some political actor was involved in funding it — but didn’t know about the Clinton campaign’s involvement. The memo never clarifies which “political actors” it means.

This is why the early assessment from intelligence experts is that there isn’t really a lot of there there.

“If this is their evidence of ‘Worse than Watergate,’ it’s thin,” Julian Sanchez, an expert on surveillance at the libertarian Cato Institute, writes. “This reads like something you’d put together to *sound* scandalous to someone who isn’t going to parse it closely.”

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by elysiantraveller

I guess.

This certainly isn't a bombshell at all. If that was the sole reason for the warrant I guess it would be a big deal. I highly doubt that is the case though. Since the memo itself says it wasn't and the origin came from Papadopolous...

Quite frankly this whole thing is exhausting. I don't know why we can't just let a investigation run it's course. I'm not a huge fan of our most secret court tasked with national security being exposed by partisans.

Newsflash:

The dossier “formed an essential part of the Carter Page FISA application.”

https://legalinsurrection.com/2018/0...mpaign-member/

In fact, it was the only document used to obtain the warrant! That's how ESSENTIAL it was. If it wasn't the only one, the deep state would have by now produced the other documents and they won't simply because there aren't any! Try to keep up, ET and resist the great temptation of Denial. (You can ride your bike and chew gum, right?)

[JustRalph]

They formed a conspiracy to perpetrate a fraud on the FISA court.

Including 250 unmasking’s based off a document paid for by Hillary.

[davew]

Originally Posted by elysiantraveller

Quite frankly this whole thing is exhausting. I don't know why we can't just let a investigation run it's course. I'm not a huge fan of our most secret court tasked with national security being exposed by partisans.

Because the people being investigated lie or eliminate evidence to protect their 'group'. They are obstructing justice and slowing all investigations down to a crawl...

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by JustRalph

They formed a conspiracy to perpetrate a fraud on the FISA court.

Including 250 unmasking’s based off a document paid for by Hillary.

And the Steele Dossier was no more genuine intelligence than than the moon is real cheese. It was fake intelligence! It was strictly a political opposition research document for the dems' to use against their enemy Trump.

[FantasticDan]

Twitter

Twitter

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Newsflash:

The dossier “formed an essential part of the Carter Page FISA application.”

https://legalinsurrection.com/2018/0...mpaign-member/

In fact, it was the only document used to obtain the warrant! That's how ESSENTIAL it was. If it wasn't the only one, the deep state would have by now produced the other documents and they won't simply because there aren't any! Try to keep up, ET and resist the great temptation of Denial. (You can ride your bike and chew gum, right?)

We don't know that.

According to Nunes it was an essential part but then his report goes on to state that the Papadopolous memos were also integral and that the FISA on Carter Page did yield separate findings on three different occasions to extend the warrant and provide grounds for probable cause.

This was a highly partisan piece maybe to combat a partisan DOJ and investigation but we simply don't know everything. Nor do I really think the public should in these matters. Even absolute worst case this is a partisan investigation is whacking people that broke the law.

If this investigation wraps up and a couple of low hanging fruit get time for breaking the law who really cares?

We the public don't control the flow of information and the White House is putting out what they want us to see at this time.

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by davew

Because the people being investigated lie or eliminate evidence to protect their 'group'. They are obstructing justice and slowing all investigations down to a crawl...

Both sides are doing that.

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by JustRalph

They formed a conspiracy to perpetrate a fraud on the FISA court.

Including 250 unmasking’s based off a document paid for by Hillary.

What conspiracy? I'm honestly just asking.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by Show Me the Wire

This is not a party affiliation problem. This is about all American citizens.
It is about the standard used to set aside American citizens' Constitutional rights and the protection of those rights. Acquiring a warrant based on unverified political opposition research cited as probable cause is abuse of the right to privacy.

You know who else did shit like this?

Hitler
Stalin
Putin
Lil Kim
Mao


The dems are in very good company.
This is not serious because of parities - it is serious because those doing it are undermining the very fabric of our nation.
This is treason of the first degree.

[Tom]

The latest attacks on the FBI and Department of Justice serve no American interests – no party’s, no president’s, only Putin’s.

shut up, McCain and go home.
YOU serve no American interest anymore.
Thanks for your service, but

Dismissed. Don't let the hit door hit your ass on the way out.

[Tom]

This is the big point here, at least so far. The issue is the slimy process used to get the FISA warrant. It seems clear that the warrant would not have been obtained without the Steele dossier.

The dem knew it, paid for it, used it, and NOW that the cat is out of the bag, they are concerned about it.

Tough nuggies - people need to go to prison for a very long time, at best.