The coronavirus

[clicknow]

Tom, glad to hear you are assymptomatic. I'm sure you are bringing a lot of joy and laughter to the HCWs there with your gifted sense of humor.

ElKabong, sorry to hear about your MIL. If she is as strong as you say hopefully she will beat this thing.

Classhandicapper, glad to hear about the success of the bridge club members...and yes of course, not an automatic death sentence. Nobody knows, it's unpredictable.


Unforntuately I am in same situation.

My mom who is 93 and fell down and broke her hip over Thanksgiving, had to have emergency surgery with titanium plates, screws and rods and I was actually surprised she survived that given her advanced COPD. Of course had to go to a PT rehab facility (I assume similar to what Tom is in). Things are not looking good but hip breaks in the elderly are never real good outcomes. Its a hard thing that in order to keep our loved ones safe we have to leave them alone....but it would be hard anyway.

Buncha tough old birds in our midst I guess.

[PaceAdvantage]

Imagine if somebody had a bad heart in 2019...then caught the flu....

Then imagine their heart couldn't cope with the stress the flu is putting on their body and they died of a heart attack...would the official cause of death be the flu?

Nope.

Imagine how inflated the COVID death count is in the USA....imagine....

[lamboguy]

Originally Posted by lamboguy

for Saturday December 12,2020


220,000 new cases

2300 deaths

for Sunday, December 13,2020


188,000 cases

1400 deaths

[clicknow]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

Imagine if somebody had a bad heart in 2019...then caught the flu....

Then imagine their heart couldn't cope with the stress the flu is putting on their body and they died of a heart attack...would the official cause of death be the flu?

Nope.

Imagine how inflated the COVID death count is in the USA....imagine....

How do you think the world compilies "snake bite deaths"?


You are admitted to the hospital due to a poisionous snake bite. Unfortunately, it is too progressed to recieve antivenom.

Your blood starts to throw clots. Then you're in Rhabdomyolysis which causes irreversible kidney failure, and then your breathing stops because the neurotoxins from the snake have parlyzed your diafragm.

What is the cause of death?

[tucker6]

Originally Posted by clicknow

Tom, glad to hear you are assymptomatic. I'm sure you are bringing a lot of joy and laughter to the HCWs there with your gifted sense of humor.

ElKabong, sorry to hear about your MIL. If she is as strong as you say hopefully she will beat this thing.

Classhandicapper, glad to hear about the success of the bridge club members...and yes of course, not an automatic death sentence. Nobody knows, it's unpredictable.


Unforntuately I am in same situation.

My mom who is 93 and fell down and broke her hip over Thanksgiving, had to have emergency surgery with titanium plates, screws and rods and I was actually surprised she survived that given her advanced COPD. Of course had to go to a PT rehab facility (I assume similar to what Tom is in). Things are not looking good but hip breaks in the elderly are never real good outcomes. Its a hard thing that in order to keep our loved ones safe we have to leave them alone....but it would be hard anyway.

Buncha tough old birds in our midst I guess.

Sorry to hear about your MIL. Falls at that age are tough. It’s not necessarily the fall itself that poses the greatest risk, but the effects the upset condition has on the elder’s other body parts and functions. We had a 92 year old client who fell on her knee and cracked the knee cap. Relatively minor situation. As best as we could tell, the pain caused appetite and fluid intake changed which causes changes in her blood levels levels that caused organ problems. The hospital could never stabilize her situation. Went from one crisis to the next.

Your MIL will be in my thoughts.

[tucker6]

Originally Posted by clicknow

How do you think the world compilies "snake bite deaths"?


You are admitted to the hospital due to a poisionous snake bite. Unfortunately, it is too progressed to recieve antivenom.

Your blood starts to throw clots. Then you're in Rhabdomyolysis which causes irreversible kidney failure, and then your breathing stops because the neurotoxins from the snake have parlyzed your diafragm.

What is the cause of death?

You’re mixing apples and peas. A snake bite is not a disease any more than an auto accident or any more than a drug overdose. These events have one thing in common. They are external actions which cause death. Viruses and bacteria grow inside the body through internal processes. How much growth of the virus and the impact on the patient is most often enabled by the current health of the patient. You have stage 4 cancer? Better not get pneumonia. Have congestive heart failure? Better not get the flu. In both cases, the cause of death is cancer and heart disease, respectively. Always. If no underlying conditions, then flu is the cause of death.

There is a gray area in the middle. A person with only high blood pressure who dies of covid should be a covid death. Why can’t we agree to these simple delineations?

[woodtoo]

Originally Posted by clicknow

Hopefully then that means that higher capcity will serve to "un-do" Trump's mistake of not ordering enough for our nation and they may allow the U.S. to renegotiate a new amouont?

I imagine that Canada was one of the other nations leapfrogged ahead of us when they saw an opportunity to get doses which Trump foolishly turned down. But I'm glad to hear they will have their citizens vaccinated since we share a border.

The reason I bring this up is because you already know that any shortages will later be blamed on Biden, when it's been all over AP news and elsewhere this week about how Trump foolishly turned down gettting an adequate amount of the BioNtech/Pfizer vaccine for our nation.

100 million doses is not even close to enough, as that only vaccinate 50million people.

I think this might end up delaying our vaccination program, unfortunately.


Just want to put those reports here a a place-holder:

https://www.wkyc.com/article/news/he...a-2dd78256ffcf

https://www.msn.com/en-us/video/news...ne/vi-BB1bQJ3e

https://news.yahoo.com/white-house-r...223400287.html

https://www.axios.com/pfizer-vaccine...00090c91a.html

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020...-vaccine-offer

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/07/u...ne-pfizer.html

All your links are the exact same story repeated by the same jackass Trump hating media just because they all crow at the same story at the same time does not make the story stronger.
You know jack what is planned with the many other easier to store and ship vaccines in the pipeline.
Just a dumbass post by a underwhelming wannabe.
People are tired of many medical pros and medical kooks.

[rastajenk]

Originally Posted by woodtoo

You know jack what is planned with the many other easier to store and ship vaccines in the pipeline.
Just a dumbass post by a underwhelming wannabe.
People are tired of many medical pros and medical kooks.

One item in Trump's list of accomplishments will be turning everyone into expert epidemiologists. Oh, and Voting Analysis experts, too.

[woodtoo]

Originally Posted by rastajenk

One item in Trump's list of accomplishments will be turning everyone into expert epidemiologists. Oh, and Voting Analysis experts, too.

Yes he has educated the public like never before and we are better off with the truth than the pack of lies we were being fed for many years. If the truth about the Bidens had gotten out Trump would have won in a landslide instead of winning and the being cheated out in this election.

[tucker6]

Originally Posted by rastajenk

One item in Trump's list of accomplishments will be turning everyone into expert epidemiologists. Oh, and Voting Analysis experts, too.

No. His number one accomplishment has been to show the media in general is fake and biased. Hands down this is true. Just by existing, Trump has blown a whole in the media façade of impartiality. Quite a feat in four years.

[sammy the sage]

another casualty....one could even call it a cov9(84) death because that's what caused lack of treatment....and he didn't even have it....this is JUST one case in thousands and thousands....

https://www.yahoo.com/news/father-be...163319583.html

[tucker6]

Originally Posted by sammy the sage

another casualty....one could even call it a cov9(84) death because that's what caused lack of treatment....and he didn't even have it....this is JUST one case in thousands and thousands....

https://www.yahoo.com/news/father-be...163319583.html

HCAP would tell the wife to shut up and accept the loss in the name of COVID protocol. If you didn't know better, you'd think Covid was deadlier than cancer. Cancer often wins the battle in the near term, but rarely loses the war long term.

[PaceAdvantage]

Originally Posted by clicknow

How do you think the world compilies "snake bite deaths"?


You are admitted to the hospital due to a poisionous snake bite. Unfortunately, it is too progressed to recieve antivenom.

Your blood starts to throw clots. Then you're in Rhabdomyolysis which causes irreversible kidney failure, and then your breathing stops because the neurotoxins from the snake have parlyzed your diafragm.

What is the cause of death?

SNAKE BITE

Next question?

That was a nice try...but doesn't even come close to what I wrote.

Unless you're going to tell me my 2019 hypothetical example would have been recorded as a FLU DEATH...then that means we've CHANGED THE WAY THE GAME IS PLAYED IN 2020.

(there's a fantastic chance my 2019 example wouldn't have even been tested for the flu...)

[clicknow]

Originally Posted by tucker6

You’re mixing apples and peas. A snake bite is not a disease any more than an auto accident or any more than a drug overdose. These events have one thing in common. They are external actions which cause death. Viruses and bacteria grow inside the body through internal processes. How much growth of the virus and the impact on the patient is most often enabled by the current health of the patient. You have stage 4 cancer? Better not get pneumonia. Have congestive heart failure? Better not get the flu. In both cases, the cause of death is cancer and heart disease, respectively. Always. If no underlying conditions, then flu is the cause of death.

** handbook for how medical examiners and coroners report deaths in the US here: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/misc/hb_me.pdf

It covers what you are staying. .

There's often a part I and part II. Therefore, in the case of the cancer and heart disease you speak of, there would still be a "due to" or "following" on the death certificate probably in part II. The word "covid" would not disappear from the death report entirely. That is made clear in the handbook.

At any rate, I would be interested to know how other *developed* nations who do not have the kind of numbers we have are "counting" covid deaths.

PA seems to imply that it's somehow different, and I'd like to see proof of that.

And thank you for the well wishes for my mom.

Always interesting to see who blows by those things and who does not.

[clicknow]

Originally Posted by tucker6

Sorry to hear about your MIL.

BTW, it's not my MIL. It's my actual mother.

But thank you just the same. I know you meant it.