Should police go into "black" areas? - Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com

GMB@BP · 09-13-2020, 05:13 PM

This seems like a really stupid question but it seems like there are many outcomes to answer a call for help and most of them are possible negative outcomes.

These officers messed up and were in their car in Compton.

https://ktla.com/news/local-news/l-a...n-agency-says/

Seems like you show up and do your job and maybe nothing happens. If you get caught into a resist or deadly force situation with threat of your life if you defend yourself, even when video supports your actions, its going to be a problem.

Then there is this whole ambush thing, that seems to be supported in some circles.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/naacp-tal...-no-such-thing

I mean should there be black only parts of the force that responds to those calls?

Why even go to those calls in the current political climate, especially if your are white? I dont pretend to know what should be done but where this is going seems like a very violent ending.

jay68802 · 09-13-2020, 05:23 PM

Sort of nailed the main reason for the BLM movement. For decades local and state governments have came up with ways to increase activity in "high crime" areas. This also put police into highly "black" or minority areas. The training of our officers then showed. I do not want to disrespect our officers, but when they seemed to be trained to go around peoples rights, the results have given us what we are seeing now.

JustRalph · 09-13-2020, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay68802

Sort of nailed the main reason for the BLM movement. For decades local and state governments have came up with ways to increase activity in "high crime" areas. This also put police into highly "black" or minority areas. The training of our officers then showed. I do not want to disrespect our officers, but when they seemed to be trained to go around peoples rights, the results have given us what we are seeing now.

There is nothing wrong with Police training. It’s the best practices in 50 years.

George Floyd et al were results of stupid cops being stupid. Add to that the unseen circumstances (Floyd is full of drugs) and you get a very bad outcome. Btw, the knee on the neck was an approved hold and was part of the training in Minneapolis.

Cops aren’t Doctors and nurses. They very often cannot tell when a suspect is in medical distress. I was a hospital cop for a couple of years early in my career. It gave me a huge advantage over other officers.

“Going around peoples rights?” Give me an example? Rights decisions are pretty easy for cops.....they are made early in a contact with a suspect. They can become complicated later in an event, but usually cops know where they stand early on.

jay68802 · 09-13-2020, 05:42 PM

The question "Do you have any drugs or weapons in the car?"

Next question is "Do you mind if I search your car?"

Answer to the first question does not matter.

jay68802 · 09-13-2020, 05:45 PM

And, the George Floyd result was not from the cops being stupid. He was the only one of three people in the car that acted in a manner to draw attention to himself.

MONEY · 09-13-2020, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay68802

The question "Do you have any drugs or weapons in the car?"

Next question is "Do you mind if I search your car?"

Answer to the first question does not matter.

I never asked those questions when I was a cop, but on more than one occassion I have been asked those questions by cops. Answering NO to both questions didn't matter. My car was searched anyway.

MONEY · 09-13-2020, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay68802

And, the George Floyd result was not from the cops being stupid. He was the only one of three people in the car that acted in a manner to draw attention to himself.

To my knowlege there is no first aid book in circulation that suggest or recommends kneeling on someones neck when they complain about having trouble breathing.

jay68802 · 09-13-2020, 05:59 PM

To my knowledge there is there is no book in circulation that recommends resisting arrest.

PaceAdvantage · 09-13-2020, 06:09 PM

Money & Ralph...what stopped those cops from just getting him in the car by force?

From the videos I remember seeing, he was halfway in the police car at one point...would it have been all that difficult to just shove the rest of him in there and shut the door?

This is the part I have a hard time reconciling....I don't get why they took/let him out of the car and back on the street again...as if they really cared that he was claiming to be claustrophobic?

MONEY · 09-13-2020, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jay68802

To my knowledge there is there is no book in circulation that recommends resisting arrest.

It is also illegal to pass bad checks, drive without a license or commit murder.
This is not about the illegal actions of the perpetrator.
It's about the improper actions of the cop after the criminal was under control.

GMB@BP · 09-13-2020, 06:34 PM

The Floyd issues has been well discussed.

I am just trying to figure out if you are an officer why even deal with it anymore.

It also seems on some levels these ambush tactics of pure cold blooded murder are hardly even getting attention.

CNN doesnt even have it on their page, not sure they ever did.

Tom · 09-13-2020, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MONEY

It is also illegal to pass bad checks, drive without a license or commit murder.
This is not about the illegal actions of the perpetrator.
It's about the improper actions of the cop after the criminal was under control.

Its not improper if it was part of their training, as Ralph posted.

thaskalos · 09-13-2020, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JustRalph

There is nothing wrong with Police training. It’s the best practices in 50 years.

George Floyd et al were results of stupid cops being stupid. Add to that the unseen circumstances (Floyd is full of drugs) and you get a very bad outcome. Btw, the knee on the neck was an approved hold and was part of the training in Minneapolis.

If the knee on the neck is an approved part of Police training in Minneapolis...isn't this an indication that there might be something wrong with the Police training in some places?

MONEY · 09-13-2020, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

Money & Ralph...what stopped those cops from just getting him in the car by force?

From the videos I remember seeing, he was halfway in the police car at one point...would it have been all that difficult to just shove the rest of him in there and shut the door?

This is the part I have a hard time reconciling....I don't get why they took/let him out of the car and back on the street again...as if they really cared that he was claiming to be claustrophobic?

George Floyd was big and tall, it would have been easy for him to brace himself
on one side of the car and kick the windows out on the other side. Also Floyd was resisting. When transporting someone in a police car it is required to seat belt them in. His resisting made that impossible.

It doesn't look like he was throwing punches or trying to injure the cops.
Believe it or not, his behavior should've been expected because his type of resistance happens all of the time.

Floyd was in cuffs, so as soon as he stopped resisting and exclaimed "I can't breath" the cops should have sat him up and called for an ambulance.

boxcar · 09-13-2020, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thaskalos

If the knee on the neck is an approved part of Police training in Minneapolis...isn't this an indication that there might be something wrong with the Police training in some places?

How many deaths have been caused by the "knee on the neck" maneuver? Find that out and that will answer your question.