Andy Beyer chimes in on the Derby DQ

[thaskalos]

https://newsvire.com/andy-beyer-the-...was-a-bad-one/

[Dream_Police]

Amen, Andy !!!!

[Saratoga_Mike]

How often is a jockey fined (for a racing infraction) when no DQ took place (his suggested remedy)?

[NJDfan1711]

Very well said, particularly the last part where he says they could have hit Saez with a suspension. Essentially that's what it boils down to - there was a foul during the race, but it did not warrant complete disqualification - I believe there were better consequences to impose on the jockey/horse/owner as a result of the action, and if there wasn't/isn't, then there should be.

[PowerUpPaynter]

Very well said!

Maximum Security, although he has no clue based on the fact he is a horse, deserved to be placed in history as the best horse in the 145th Kentucky derby and the bettors who identified that deserved to cash their tickets. Case closed! Amen Andy!

I coulda been catastrophic, it wasnt. This is not a maiden claiming race on a a tuesday with 7 horses and you screwed a lot of people and tarnished the 145th Kentucky Derby. Its just a damn shame.

[burnsy]

Thank you !

[AMPHAR]

A lot of good points.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by Saratoga_Mike

How often is a jockey fined (for a racing infraction) when no DQ took place (his suggested remedy)?

I don't agree with Beyer's position, but this literally happens all pthe time.

[FenceBored]

The other two colts who were involved in the chain reaction after Maximum Security’s infraction, 54-to-1 Long Range Toddy and 71-to-1 Bodexpress, were going nowhere when the incident occurred. The trouble they encountered surely cost them a higher placing, but as they finished 14th and 17th, they weren’t going to be contenders under any circumstances.

That's right, it's crazy to think that a horse with odds above 50-1 is going to finish in the top five of the Derby when they're in that position nearing the quarter pole. Never happened in the history of the race.

[FenceBored]

What purpose was served by disqualifying the winner? If it was to make a statement about the importance of safety in race-riding, the stewards could slap jockey Luis Saez with a significant suspension. But Maximum Security was the best horse in the field and he deserved to have his name inscribed in the record books.

The statement of the importance of safety in race-riding is to say that you don't deserve to have your name inscribed in the record books if you seriously endangered other horses in the race in the process of winning it.

[bobphilo]

And the whining continues. Beyer cannot be more wrong. His claim that since Saez was not fined for his horses' infraction does not mean his horse did not commit an infraction is incorrect. Even if Saez did not intentionally foul the other horses he still was unable to control his horse. The possibility that he may have been unable to may be relevant in clearing him from blame but it doesn't change the fact that his horse was unable to maintain his path and caused other horses to lose their chance. That's ground for a DQ in any race.
I can't believe that he thinks that this interference only cost the involved horses 1 length. Apparently he's forgotten that when a half ton thoroughbred at racing speed losses all this momentum he is being severely disadvantaged, to put it mildly. On a tiring sloppy track at a late stage when a horses energy reserves are lowest, it is virtually impossible to rebuild it.
He admits that the foul could have caused but didn't so it doesn't matter. The fact that we didn't witness a disaster was due to the grace of God and the ability of War of Will and Take Charge Boddy's riders to keep their horses upright. Max Sec was the one responsible for creating this situation. I don't want to hear that the reason was the large field as West claims. Yes, the field is too large but that does not excuse fouling.
Actually the best horse does not always win the Derby. The winner is actually the one who 1st crosses the wire without having fouled any other horses and diminished their chances of winning or placing. That horse was Country House.
Anyone not understanding that has horse racing confused with ancient Roman chariot racing where all that mattered was crossing the wire first, no matter how they did that. That's why there were more deaths in the races in the Circus Maximus than in the gladiatorial games in the Colosseum.

[Saratoga_Mike]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

I don't agree with Beyer's position, but this literally happens all pthe time.

I understand it can happen if neither of the horses earned a check, but have you observed a lot of cases where the horse wins (isn't DQ'd) and then the jock is levied a big fine for interfering with another horse? If it happens all the time, please provide a few examples. I'd like to check out the replays. Thanks.

[burnsy]

There is no way to deter what happened. Fine, take down, suspension does nothing if the horse spooked. It’s an uncontrolled happening. They can do whatever they want . The next time the track is wet and 160000 people are screaming. A horse will spook and do the same thing. The entire notion that any of this crap prevents something is dumb

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by Saratoga_Mike

I understand it can happen if neither of the horses earned a check, but have you observed a lot of cases where the horse wins (isn't DQ'd) and then the jock is levied a big fine for interfering with another horse? If it happens all the time, please provide a few examples. I'd like to check out the replays. Thanks.

I don't have examples handy, but I know they have happened in California when a horse was left up because the interference didn't cost anyone a placing.

[classhandicapper]

The point he made about other sports is the one I made in another thread. There's kind of an unwritten rule in basketball playoffs that you don't call the game as tight. "Let them play". The derby is our playoffs and we've generally had an unwritten rule that they get more leeway. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but it's understandable and what's at issue is consistency. For better or worse, the start, first turn, and every other part of these big races is going to scrutinized a lot more closely now.