Santa Anita Shuts Down

[Dahossdaboss]

Originally Posted by chadk66

Look there is zero evidence pointing towards drug use at this time. When that happens then I’ll be on board with that. Sure they use shit they shouldn’t but they don’t just use it in California. They use it all over. And how many of these California trainers have horses at other tracks? Quite a damn few I’d guess. And does anybody have breakdown numbers on turf vs number of races? I bet it’s not really that far off from dirt. Your going to always have slightly less in relation to dirt simply because much better and more sound horses run on grass vs dirt. Just a hunch I have.

I got my answer. You’re being obtuse on purpose.

[Jeff P]

This is not good --

I just did a Google search for the phrase "Santa Anita" (without the quotes.)

Below is a screenshot showing the very top of the search results.

[castaway01]

Originally Posted by Big Russ

I've been attending the races at Tampa for 20 years now, mostly weekends. I have no stats to back me up, so just observation and what I've heard from horseman. Tampa seems very safe, relatively speaking. If true, might it be wise to find out why? Are there any truly accurate stats available?

A database search of results charts for "DNF" finishes, then examining the individual finishes to see which horses were euthanized/vanned off vs. stumbling and losing the rider. You'd have to control for track surface as well as field size (10 breakdowns over six months at a track with an average field size of 7 horses a race vs. 5 breakdowns in a month at a track with an average field size of 10 horses a race are different situations). Of course some tracks have incredibly detailed results charts and others don't. I guess that would be a place to start and establish a baseline.

[chadk66]

Originally Posted by Big Russ

I've been attending the races at Tampa for 20 years now, mostly weekends. I have no stats to back me up, so just observation and what I've heard from horseman. Tampa seems very safe, relatively speaking. If true, might it be wise to find out why? Are there any truly accurate stats available?

i don’t know if there is. Many tracks have very few breakdowns. But my experience is they seem to run in streaks for whatever reason. Might go for a few months with none then three in a week. Probably nothing but coincidence.

[Saratoga_Mike]

Originally Posted by Big Russ

I've been attending the races at Tampa for 20 years now, mostly weekends. I have no stats to back me up, so just observation and what I've heard from horseman. Tampa seems very safe, relatively speaking. If true, might it be wise to find out why? Are there any truly accurate stats available?

Tampa has a deep, sandy surface, which is generally perceived as safer than a hard surface like the Meadowlands (t'bred meet).

On SA, the breakdowns are most likely a combination of factors, as dahoss already noted. Good to see DH back, waiting on some selections from him.

[jaxtrotter]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

While I don't endorse the concept that this is solely related to track conditions (I think the fragility of horses has something to do with it as well)

ANy necropsy results showing poor bone density, improperly healed stress fractures?

Some medical investigation could ease SA's PR quagmire at the moment. They'd still look bad for running injured animals, but at least some blame can be laid at someone else's feet when the cameras come up.

This is really terrible all around. The sheer number and frequency of fatalities isn't remotely acceptable.

[AlsoEligible]

https://www.paulickreport.com/news/t...l-race-friday/

Instead of an immediate ban on Lasix as was suggested in TSG's “Open Letter to the Thoroughbred Industry” released on Thursday by the company's chairman, Belinda Stronach, the diuretic will be eliminated beginning with 2-year-olds in 2020, or foals of 2018. Additionally, the maximum dose of Lasix allowed on race day will be immediately decreased from 10 ccs to five.

Racing at Santa Anita Park was set to resume on March 22, but that date was delayed when the TOC struggled to reach an agreement with TSG officials. Now that the deal is in place, racing will resume as scheduled on Friday.

Just to go back to Belinda's letter:

We are taking a stand and fully recognize just how disruptive this might be.

And just like that, at the first sign of disruption, TSG caves.

A "phased elimination" is just kicking the can down the road, and guaranteed it will not happen in 2020 either. Trainers and owners will make the same threats, TSG will give in again. By that point they'll just hope that the public is no longer paying attention, and won't see that their "watershed moment" amounted to absolutely nothing.

[Tom]

So now, basically, SA has done nothing to fix whatever the problem was?
And they had #22 just two days ago?

Sate needs to step in force them to not run.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by AlsoEligible

https://www.paulickreport.com/news/t...l-race-friday/



Just to go back to Belinda's letter:



And just like that, at the first sign of disruption, TSG caves.

A "phased elimination" is just kicking the can down the road, and guaranteed it will not happen in 2020 either. Trainers and owners will make the same threats, TSG will give in again. By that point they'll just hope that the public is no longer paying attention, and won't see that their "watershed moment" amounted to absolutely nothing.

Yep.

The only way Lasix gets banned is by federal or state statute.

[Redboard]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

Yep.

The only way Lasix gets banned is by federal or state statute.

The state wouldn't have to go that far they could simply threaten to put THE question on the next ballot. We all know how that would go.

But even if they banned all race-day drugs, installed a synthetic surface, and came up with state-of-the-art drug testing including out-of-competition, would that cut the deaths in half? Maybe. Would that be enough? Probably not. We’d still be stuck with a breed that cares so little for its welfare that it runs so fast that blood starts pouring out of its mouth. They would have to get control of the breed, get Mr. Prospector out of it, etc.

[ultracapper]

Be interesting to know how many of the breakdowns came after a horse ran on a sealed track.

If they ran or trained over a sealed track recently prior to breaking down, then whether the breakdown on dirt or turf would be meaningless. Some one brought up monitoring horses shipping out of SA and being alert for breakdowns of those runners.

Picture may be coming into a little better focus.

Of all the knee jerk reactions SA is going through, maybe they just need to quit the practice of sealing the track after heavy rains. So they run 1:15 and change for 3 or 4 cards. The 1:09s will return eventually.

[sammy the sage]

Originally Posted by Jeff P

Part III --

by Natalie Voss | 03.01.2018 | 5:13pm
Bramlage: ‘Price To Pay’ For Bisphosphonate Use Is Delayed Healing:
https://www.paulickreport.com/horse-...layed-healing/




--and:




-jp

.

Thanks for posting this...although the absence of responses to it are sad...cause you really just confirmed what I posted earlier with the analogy....it's THE STINKING drugs....

[castaway01]

Originally Posted by jaxtrotter

ANy necropsy results showing poor bone density, improperly healed stress fractures?

Some medical investigation could ease SA's PR quagmire at the moment. They'd still look bad for running injured animals, but at least some blame can be laid at someone else's feet when the cameras come up.

This is really terrible all around. The sheer number and frequency of fatalities isn't remotely acceptable.

Showing that the trainers are running unhealthy or injured horses would in no way ease their PR problems. In fact, it would make them worse, which is why no one rushed to do those investigations in the first place. The best-case scenario would be that it was some unfortunate problem below the track surface from all the times they sealed it because at least that's (potentially) quickly fixable.

[chadk66]

Originally Posted by ultracapper

Be interesting to know how many of the breakdowns came after a horse ran on a sealed track.

If they ran or trained over a sealed track recently prior to breaking down, then whether the breakdown on dirt or turf would be meaningless. Some one brought up monitoring horses shipping out of SA and being alert for breakdowns of those runners.

Picture may be coming into a little better focus.

Of all the knee jerk reactions SA is going through, maybe they just need to quit the practice of sealing the track after heavy rains. So they run 1:15 and change for 3 or 4 cards. The 1:09s will return eventually.

I keep reading statements about sealed tracks. What is your issue or feeling regarding that

[Jeff P]

Originally Posted by chadk66

I keep reading statements about sealed tracks. What is your issue or feeling regarding that

Six of the 22 horses (27.3%) suffering fatal breakdowns at Santa Anita had previously raced on a sealed surface within a few weeks of their fatal breakdown.

The chart below was originally posted by Pyshcotic Parakeet here:
http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...&postcount=164

Originally Posted by Psychotic Parakeet

I'm pretty certain the reason why they did not find anything wrong with the surface is because the damage was already done to some of these horses long ago from either racing or training on a sealed surface. It is like running on concrete with legs built like broomsticks, with little rest in-between, or at least a break from running on such a hard surface. It more likely caused micro-fractures, which led to the undoing on most of these horses. I made this chart (attachment below) to show the correlation: