Religion III

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

I don't read Far Eastern Religious things for answers just like I don't read the Bible for answers.

If I have personal spiritual issues, rather than thinking about them, or looking in a book,I go within and the answers come. That is the power of meditation. The wisdom of God is within.

The wisdom of God is both within and without. True spiritual transformation begins with the mind and then works it way down to the heart to affect the rest of the faculties. (As you think, so you are.) This is why the bible speaks so much of the mind and the importance of filling it with God's Word.

This is why it is also written that the Gospel of Christ (found only in God's Word) is the power of God unto salvation. The Gospel is transformational in nature, as its message is applied to the mind and heart by the Holy Spirit.

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

The Gospel is transformational in nature, as its message is applied to the mind and heart by the Holy Spirit.

Not true. Words cannot change a person. Take a look around in church when the Gospel is read and you will find most people half asleep or bored out of their mind.

You need much deeper affectations for change. That is why we come into this world and have struggles and issues. Pain is the real teacher,not words. You must die to yourself, your ego,in order to change.

Its not a question of if, but when you will be brought to your knees.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

Not true. Words cannot change a person. Take a look around in church when the Gospel is read and you will find most people half asleep or bored out of their mind.

You need much deeper affectations for change. That is why we come into this world and have struggles and issues. Pain is the real teacher,not words. You must die to yourself, your ego,in order to change.

Its not a question of if, but when you will be brought to your knees.

No, it is true! This is why the Gospel is called the POWER of God unto salvation!!! Between the Word and the Holy Spirit, all those predestined for salvation will be transformed!!

Or why is the Word of God called "living and active" -- 'sharper than any two edged sword" (Heb 4:12)?

Or why is it said that "death and life are in the power of the tongue" (Prov 18:21)?

Or why is it written that "reckless words pierce like a sword, but the tongue of the wise brings healing"(Prov 12:18)?

And, yes, words are very, very powerful tools -- even characterized as "weapons". Why do you think, for example, leftists do all in their power to have their marxist agendas and philosophy taught in schools to kids -- younger the better?

Or why do you think left-leaning news organizations all preach their "news" from the exact same playbook repeating, repeating, repeating ad nauseam the same lies? They KNOW that if they repeat a lie often enough, many people will finally believe it.

Of why do authoritarian states rely heavily on propaganda tools to advance their ideology and agendas?

If mankind, generally, knows all this, why are you so ignorant of this universal truth? And if man can succeed in changing people's minds with the power of words, how much more can God not only change minds, but change our hearts!?

Finally, your theory about pain being transformational is not only a lie but violates the First Law of Logic -- the Law of Identity, i.e. A is A. Pain cannot change our essence! Pain cannot change who and what we are. Pain cannot make A into B! Only God Almighty can do that! Nothing on this earth can to what only God must do supernaturally to change our nature. He can make A into B! And scripture tells us that he does that by His Word and his Spirit. This is why it also written that all his born again children were brought forth by his Word and Spirit!

Jer 5:14
14 Therefore this is what the LORD God Almighty says:

"Because the people have spoken these words,
I will make my words in your mouth a fire
and these people the wood it consumes.
NIV

[Actor]

Originally Posted by Light

Yes that's what I'm asking you. We obviously didn't create ourselves.

I see no evidence for such a god or god substitute. I also see no evidence we were created at all, rather we are the product of natural selection.

[fast4522]

Originally Posted by Actor

I see no evidence for such a god or god substitute. I also see no evidence we were created at all, rather we are the product of natural selection.

Go out and buy yourself some Balance Of Nature, take the triple dose.

[porchy44]

Originally Posted by dnlgfnk

..... The representative Christian in this forum is steeped in American fundamentalism, or accepts that Christianity began with the printing press. Think you're the only one frustrated by the conversation?

Your frustrated !! My Baptist minister brother claims Jesus turned water into juice.

Dang I guess every Christian before the 1600’s had it wrong.

[Light]

Originally Posted by Actor

I see no evidence for such a god or god substitute. I also see no evidence we were created at all, rather we are the product of natural selection.

Then "natural selection" is OUR higher power if we are its product. Is it not?

[dnlgfnk]

Originally Posted by porchy44

Your frustrated !! My Baptist minister brother claims Jesus turned water into juice.

Dang I guess every Christian before the 1600’s had it wrong.

Thomas Jefferson cut and pasted his own bible. Martin Luther was reaching for the scissors, but finally only wanted to omit the book of James from being taught in schools.

I'm sure your brother profits from James, and hasn't taken a scalpel to John 2 or Luke 22.

Keep the faith, Porchy. Once in a while I lapse and jump in here, instead of preparing for the next day's card or watching the Cardinals walk batters. I'm working on that.

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

No, it is true! This is why the Gospel is called the POWER of God unto salvation!!! Between the Word and the Holy Spirit, all those predestined for salvation will be transformed!!

Or why is the Word of God called "living and active" -- 'sharper than any two edged sword" (Heb 4:12)?

Or why is it said that "death and life are in the power of the tongue" (Prov 18:21)?

Or why is it written that "reckless words pierce like a sword, but the tongue of the wise brings healing"(Prov 12:18)?

And, yes, words are very, very powerful tools -- even characterized as "weapons". Why do you think, for example, leftists do all in their power to have their marxist agendas and philosophy taught in schools to kids -- younger the better?

Or why do you think left-leaning news organizations all preach their "news" from the exact same playbook repeating, repeating, repeating ad nauseam the same lies? They KNOW that if they repeat a lie often enough, many people will finally believe it.

Of why do authoritarian states rely heavily on propaganda tools to advance their ideology and agendas?

If mankind, generally, knows all this, why are you so ignorant of this universal truth? And if man can succeed in changing people's minds with the power of words, how much more can God not only change minds, but change our hearts!?

Baloney. If words can bring everyone to God, what's taking it so long.

Originally Posted by boxcar

Finally, your theory about pain being transformational is not only a lie but violates the First Law of Logic -- the Law of Identity, i.e. A is A. Pain cannot change our essence! Pain cannot change who and what we are. Pain cannot make A into B! Only God Almighty can do that! Nothing on this earth can to what only God must do supernaturally to change our nature. He can make A into B! And scripture tells us that he does that by His Word and his Spirit. This is why it also written that all his born again children were brought forth by his Word and Spirit!

LoL. I'm laughing at your ignorance. Pain is the motivator in this life. Without pain people would sit on their ass. Pain brought me to God. Pain makes you get a job. Get your tooth fixed. Tells you to take a crap. Get your life straight. Help people. Without pain we would not exist.

And without pain we would never be motivated to find our essence you mention. Because our essence is the hidden treasure in this life. Just like Jesus said,"The Kingdom of Heaven is within you". And that Kingdom IS your essence.

God and us are one. It is an illusion that we are separate from God. You'll learn that when you find your essence boxcar. And when you find your essence you will know we are all one because we all have the same essence. There is no left,or right wing. No Black or white. Another illusion. Oneness with God is reality. But you must find it for REAL within, not read about it and believe. You must know it.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by Light

Then "natural selection" is OUR higher power if we are its product. Is it not?

It is not. Natural selection is not "a superhuman, supernatural intelligence," nor is the product of natural selection "deliberately designed."

[ReplayRandall]

Originally Posted by Actor

It is not. Natural selection is not "a superhuman, supernatural intelligence," nor is the product of natural selection "deliberately designed."

Really?...Well, thank you for your opinion on the matter.

I love the "It is not" statement by you....It's hilarious.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

Really?...Well, thank you for your opinion on the matter.

You're welcome. I was asked.

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

I love the "It is not" statement by you....It's hilarious.

You are easily amused.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

Baloney. If words can bring everyone to God, what's taking it so long.

Why are you being deceptive!? Is it because your god is the Father of Lies? I never said "words can bring everyone to God". My entire last post to you dealt with the infinitely great qualitative power of God's word -- nothing to do with quantity.

LoL. I'm laughing at your ignorance. Pain is the motivator in this life. Without pain people would sit on their ass. Pain brought me to God. Pain makes you get a job. Get your tooth fixed. Tells you to take a crap. Get your life straight. Help people. Without pain we would not exist.

And without pain we would never be motivated to find our essence you mention. Because our essence is the hidden treasure in this life. Just like Jesus said,"The Kingdom of Heaven is within you". And that Kingdom IS your essence.

God and us are one. It is an illusion that we are separate from God. You'll learn that when you find your essence boxcar. And when you find your essence you will know we are all one because we all have the same essence. There is no left,or right wing. No Black or white. Another illusion. Oneness with God is reality. But you must find it for REAL within, not read about it and believe. You must know it.

Since your other god is Pain, permit to say that you should be looking very forward to Hell since in the visible, eternal kingdom of God there will be no pain. You'd be like a fish out of water in heaven.

For you info, pain more often than not drives people away from God not to him. This is due to man's evil nature, which man cannot change, nor can pain change it.

Rev 9:20-21
20 The rest of mankind that were not killed by these plagues still did not repent of the work of their hands; they did not stop worshiping demons, and idols of gold, silver, bronze, stone and wood — idols that cannot see or hear or walk. 21 Nor did they repent of their murders, their magic arts, their sexual immorality or their thefts.
NIV

And,

Rev 16:8-11
9 They were seared by the intense heat and they cursed the name of God, who had control over these plagues, but they refused to repent and glorify him.

10 The fifth angel poured out his bowl on the throne of the beast, and his kingdom was plunged into darkness. Men gnawed their tongues in agony 11 and cursed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, but they refused to repent of what they had done.
NIV

And God and man are NOT one in essence! Again, your foolish theory would violate the Law of Identity, since God (A) is Holy in his essence and man (B) is profane in his. A cannot be B. A can only be A, and B can only be B. This is the fundamental First Law of Logic. And this law is actually found in scripture, which shouldn't surprise anyone since God is the Source of Logic.

Jer 13:23
23 Can the Ethiopian change his skin
or the leopard its spots?
Neither can you do good
who are accustomed to doing evil.
NIV

Contrast the above with this text about the essence of God -- from your "best friend" who you never believe, no less. (By the way, the above text is a rhetorical question, lest you misunderstand.)

Luke 18:19
19 "Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good — except God alone.
NIV

Therefore, Good and Evil are like oil and water. They just can't mix!

So, not only are you a liar, but it's very obvious that you also love being deceived.

And by the way, since your god Pain is infinitely good for mankind, I cannot understand for the life of me why you railed against Trump's handling of the invasion of illegal aliens to this country and how he "locked kids up in cages", as one example, or why you have railed against Israel whenever they shoot back in self defense at Hamas, as another. It seems to me you should glory in all the pain that anyone can bring to anyone else because it is so spiritually beneficial.

Methinks you suffer from chronic cognitive dissonance. Your circuit board is in desperate need of repair.

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Why are you being deceptive!? Is it because your god is the Father of Lies? I never said "words can bring everyone to God". My entire last post to you dealt with the infinitely great qualitative power of God's word -- nothing to do with quantity.

Then you are confused. "God's word" is not a word.It is a power.

Originally Posted by boxcar

For you info, pain more often than not drives people away from God not to him. This is due to man's evil nature, which man cannot change, nor can pain change it.

Ego drives man away from God. Didn't you learn that from the Adam & Eve story? The forbidden fruit was the "tree of knowledge" or in today's language,"ego".

Originally Posted by boxcar

And God and man are NOT one in essence! Again, your foolish theory would violate the Law of Identity, since God (A) is Holy in his essence and man (B) is profane in his. A cannot be B. A can only be A, and B can only be B. This is the fundamental First Law of Logic. And this law is actually found in scripture, which shouldn't surprise anyone since God is the Source of Logic.

When you find yourself, you'll know you are wrong. Because who you are is a child of God.

Originally Posted by boxcar

Contrast the above with this text about the essence of God -- from your "best friend"

Luke 18:19
19 "Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good — except God alone.

Of course. God has no ego,man does. That doesn't mean we are not good enough for God to love us. He loves us more because we are imperfect and need him.

Originally Posted by boxcar

So, not only are you a liar, but it's very obvious that you also love being deceived.

And by the way, since your god Pain is infinitely good for mankind, I cannot understand for the life of me why you railed against Trump's handling of the invasion of illegal aliens to this country and how he "locked kids up in cages", as one example, or why you have railed against Israel whenever they shoot back in self defense at Hamas, as another. It seems to me you should glory in all the pain that anyone can bring to anyone else because it is so spiritually beneficial.

Methinks you suffer from chronic cognitive dissonance. Your circuit board is in desperate need of repair.

You are either really dumb or have major comprehension problems.

[Light]

Originally Posted by Actor

It is not. Natural selection is not "a superhuman, supernatural intelligence," nor is the product of natural selection "deliberately designed."

But you said we are a "product of natural selection". Why wouldn't that make "natural selection" a superhuman intelligence to us?

Do you take the creation of human beings as something other natural processes could have produced that you minimize the power of natural selection as a higher power?