Can Sports Betting on Track and Satellite Save Racing?

[cj]

The basic take on sports is 10%, but if you shop around you can get as low as 5%, at least on football.

[Cangamble]

Originally Posted by Jeff P

Allow me to suggest something completely out there.

Why should racing have to even think about resorting to gambling games other than racing to save racing?

Do gambling games other than racing have the ability to kick racing's ass when it comes to creating new customers and growing handle?

If so, why?

Hint: takeout.

Slots are immensely popular. But then aren't most slot machines in this day and age programmed to return more than 90 cents for every dollar wagered? And that equates to (what?) less than 10 percent takeout, right?

The vig (house edge) on the line at a typical footbal game at Pinnacle was (what?) 10 percent? Again, that equates to 10 percent takeout, right?

Instead of using other forms of gambling (that offer lower takeout than racing) to "save" racing...

Is it too much of a stretch to think maybe it's time for racing to stand up and COMPETE with the other forms of low takeout gambling that have been kicking racing's ass for more than a decade?

Color me blind deaf and dumb if you want. But I happen to think that racing offered at 9 to 10 percent takeout every pool everywhere every day (marketed as the best gambling game on the planet) very quickly turns things around and finds itself kicking the collective asses of every other gambling game known to man.



-jp

.

Actually the takeout on football is much less than 10%. Two people match $100 bets, one takes the fave, the other the dog, $200 is bet and only $10 goes to the house.

[Irish Boy]

It would help, but it's not that easy. There are 32 NFL teams. There are 120 college football teams, and people tend to follow the 10-12 in their conference and a handful of other top teams. Same in college basketball. These are the big three betting games. Sports bettors get sucked into a false sense of knowledge because of the familiarity, and this leads to betting accessibility and a belief that they can beat the game. For most- almost all, in fact- this is absolutely untrue.

There are how many thousands of thoroughbreds in the US? It's impossible to follow them all; it's tough to even keep up on all the 3 year olds during the Derby chase. Granted, you can get PPs and study those for any race, but that involves a level of unfamiliarity that football does not. People watch football, learn football, and think they can beat it. Horse racing just doesn't have the same dynamic, and never will. Marginally lower takeouts will help- I don't deny that- but not nearly as much as current horse players think.

[Relwob Owner]

Originally Posted by Jeff P

Allow me to suggest something completely out there.

Why should racing have to even think about resorting to gambling games other than racing to save racing?

Do gambling games other than racing have the ability to kick racing's ass when it comes to creating new customers and growing handle?

If so, why?

Hint: takeout.

Slots are immensely popular. But then aren't most slot machines in this day and age programmed to return more than 90 cents for every dollar wagered? And that equates to (what?) less than 10 percent takeout, right?

The vig (house edge) on the line at a typical footbal game at Pinnacle was (what?) 10 percent? Again, that equates to 10 percent takeout, right?

Instead of using other forms of gambling (that offer lower takeout than racing) to "save" racing...

Is it too much of a stretch to think maybe it's time for racing to stand up and COMPETE with the other forms of low takeout gambling that have been kicking racing's ass for more than a decade?

Color me blind deaf and dumb if you want. But I happen to think that racing offered at 9 to 10 percent takeout every pool everywhere every day (marketed as the best gambling game on the planet) very quickly turns things around and finds itself kicking the collective asses of every other gambling game known to man.



-jp

.

Question for you or anyone else.....what percentage of money do most tracks get from money bet with ADW's......seems to be that tracks sold their signals a long time ago before they realized people would be betting at home....I have heard the ADW's get a huge and somewhat disproportionate slice of the pie and I always wonder if the tracks could have a lower takeout if they could figure out a way to get rid of the ADW's....maybe logistically impossible....the only thing I could think of would be tracks getting together and having the own joint ADW and market their own track, signal and features individually....I know this would be tough but just an idea....

[Relwob Owner]

Originally Posted by cj

The basic take on sports is 10%, but if you shop around you can get as low as 5%, at least on football.

Where?

[andymays]

Originally Posted by Jeff P

Allow me to suggest something completely out there.

Why should racing have to even think about resorting to gambling games other than racing to save racing?

Do gambling games other than racing have the ability to kick racing's ass when it comes to creating new customers and growing handle?

If so, why?

Hint: takeout.

Slots are immensely popular. But then aren't most slot machines in this day and age programmed to return more than 90 cents for every dollar wagered? And that equates to (what?) less than 10 percent takeout, right?

The vig (house edge) on the line at a typical footbal game at Pinnacle was (what?) 10 percent? Again, that equates to 10 percent takeout, right?

Instead of using other forms of gambling (that offer lower takeout than racing) to "save" racing...

Is it too much of a stretch to think maybe it's time for racing to stand up and COMPETE with the other forms of low takeout gambling that have been kicking racing's ass for more than a decade?

Color me blind deaf and dumb if you want. But I happen to think that racing offered at 9 to 10 percent takeout every pool everywhere every day (marketed as the best gambling game on the planet) very quickly turns things around and finds itself kicking the collective asses of every other gambling game known to man.-jp

.

At 9 to 10 percent Racing becomes the best bet on the planet!

I was with Barry Abrams (Ca Trainer and Breeder of Unusual Heat) yesterday morning at Del Mar. He is responsible for over 140 Horses. The expense is insane and unless purses are increased dramatically in California it is going under sooner than people think.

How do you get to 9 or 10 percent take in the real world?

Having Sports Betting at the Track or Satellite is a natural fit in my opinion!

[cj]

Originally Posted by Relwob Owner

Where?

I'm not doing all the work here!

But, as cangamble showed, it is lower anyway.

[Relwob Owner]

Originally Posted by cj

I'm not doing all the work here!

But, as cangamble showed, it is lower anyway.

Gotcha.....thanks for the lead and I will try to find that 5%! Will still bet horses though

[DeanT]

I don't think it would help. Whenever a new game is added to a track area the bet goes down. In Canada we have the sports betting system with parlays and they are located right at the slots area. People will pop some cash in there, but will not look at the track.

I sit in the books in Vegas and playing the Meadowlands from 4:30 onwards I would watch the bettors to see how many came over from the sports book for racing and I did not see one. I was not really amazed. High takeout, a tough game to learn and why bet it when you can sit and have a beer or two with your friends watching the game on a big screen with a Benjamin on it?

Regardless, one way or another we will find out. Woodbine Entertainment is lobbying hard to get that added to the racino menu here in Canada. I put the odds on them getting single game betting passed at less than even money. I bet we'll see it within five years and we will have a good case study for racing. There is oodles of bettors in the Toronto area that would be more than a big enough sample.

[Cangamble]

Originally Posted by andymays

At 9 to 10 percent Racing becomes the best bet on the planet!

I was with Barry Abrams (Ca Trainer and Breeder of Unusual Heat) yesterday morning at Del Mar. He is responsible for over 140 Horses. The expense is insane and unless purses are increased dramatically in California it is going under sooner than people think.

How do you get to 9 or 10 percent take in the real world?

Having Sports Betting at the Track or Satellite is a natural fit in my opinion!

If takeouts were reduced to 10%, I wouldn't be surprised if handle triples.
Again, lower takeouts equals more handle, it also means more people will last longer and will wind up involving more friends and family to participate in the game, or at least get exposed to it.
Also, the winners created will give horse racing tremendous advertising. Gamblers who bet on other things will go after this carrot.

[andymays]

Originally Posted by Cangamble

If takeouts were reduced to 10%, I wouldn't be surprised if handle triples.
Again, lower takeouts equals more handle, it also means more people will last longer and will wind up involving more friends and family to participate in the game, or at least get exposed to it.
Also, the winners created will give horse racing tremendous advertising. Gamblers who bet on other things will go after this carrot.

To do that we need less Race Tracks. If we only had 2 Race Tracks to bet at any given time the handle at those Tracks would more than triple. The problem is that that's not reality. Sports Betting on Track or Satellite will work!

[andymays]

Originally Posted by DeanT

I don't think it would help. Whenever a new game is added to a track area the bet goes down. In Canada we have the sports betting system with parlays and they are located right at the slots area. People will pop some cash in there, but will not look at the track.

I sit in the books in Vegas and playing the Meadowlands from 4:30 onwards I would watch the bettors to see how many came over from the sports book for racing and I did not see one. I was not really amazed. High takeout, a tough game to learn and why bet it when you can sit and have a beer or two with your friends watching the game on a big screen with a Benjamin on it?

Regardless, one way or another we will find out. Woodbine Entertainment is lobbying hard to get that added to the racino menu here in Canada. I put the odds on them getting single game betting passed at less than even money. I bet we'll see it within five years and we will have a good case study for racing. There is oodles of bettors in the Toronto area that would be more than a big enough sample.

In California it would be huge. Remember, no Casinos can have sports betting and it has to be on Track or Satellite not online!

[proximity]

Originally Posted by andymays

To do that we need less Race Tracks. If we only had 2 Race Tracks to bet at any given time the handle at those Tracks would more than triple. The problem is that that's not reality. Sports Betting on Track or Satellite will work!

i actually think we need "more" tracks..... as in some kind of worldwide simulcasting network. we need to get these people from hong kong wagering into our pools.

[DeanT]

Originally Posted by andymays

In California it would be huge. Remember, no Casinos can have sports betting and it has to be on Track or Satellite not online!

Would not a likely scenario be: Sports bettor comes to track, bets football game. Wins half his bets, breaks about even. Goes home but stops and bets two races on the way out. Loses. Next week, wins his two football games and makes money. Bets a couple races, loses. The following week, bets football, breaks even, but this time goes right to his car because he is tired of losing at racing.

I think with it at tracks, more and more people who bet racing would play football, because it is easier to churn at only having to have a 52.4% hit rate, and they have been tired of betting racing and losing at 22% takeouts all these years.

I think handle would go down. It always does when we put ourselves against low vig games.

[andymays]

Originally Posted by DeanT

Would not a likely scenario be: Sports bettor comes to track, bets football game. Wins half his bets, breaks about even. Goes home but stops and bets two races on the way out. Loses. Next week, wins his two football games and makes money. Bets a couple races, loses. The following week, bets football, breaks even, but this time goes right to his car because he is tired of losing at racing.

I think with it at tracks, more and more people who bet racing would play football, because it is easier to churn at and they have been tired of betting racing and losing at 22% takeouts.

I think handle would go down. It always does when we put ourselves against low vig games.

Most Gamblers want action. They are not disciplined people in general. Most people that bet on sports do it because they want some competition that involves skill. Sports Betting and Horse Racing are a natural much more so than slots.

Why do we want slot players at the Track?