Your son, what would you do?

[Lemon Drop Husker]

Originally Posted by Dave Schwartz

I come from the position of "parent" more so than "handicapper."

The short version is that I've worked to keep my children away from my involvement in horse racing. It is not that I am ashamed. As my father once said, "Gambling is one of the great joys of life."

My rationale for this is from my own experience. My father was a gambler and dedicated loser. Not a blow-the-mortgage-kind-of-guy, but a guy who lost enough money gambling on a regular basis to always keep us deeply in debt.

Every 7 years he filed bankruptcy.

To his credit, he was always sober, and was a hard worker. Always had 2 jobs and once worked 12 years without a day off. (No joke.)

It wasn't until I was a teenager that my mother and I found out he never worked Saturdays before 5pm because he took a junket to the Bahamas every week.

As a 9-year old with a precocious intellect, his quote to me was, "Someday you will play poker. I'm going to teach you how to play so that you can win instead of lose."

By the time I was 9, he and my mother gave up expecting to beat me at hearts or gin.

Age 9 was also when a guy who used to work for my dad as a blackjack dealer came to visit. (Dad owned an illegal card and horse room in Niagara Falls back in the 40s until the mob invited themselves in as partners. He promptly left town.)

After dazzling me with card tricks for about 20 minutes, the guy says to my father, "Can the kid deal?" I said, "Sure I can," and proceeded to deal cards around the table much as you'd expect any 9-yr old to do.

Then he says, "He's got the cards in the wrong hand!"

"No, that's the way I do it, see?" continuing to deal. (I am right-handed, so, logically, the deck was held in the left hand.)

My father instructed me to never deal right-handed again. It wasn't until I was 15 and dealing blackjack and poker in an illegal casino in Liberty City (Miami) that I came to understand why.

In case you don't know, it is easier for a lefty to peek at the top card, and, hence, makes for a better mechanic.

At age 13, while dad and I were in the Catskills (working as waiters at the Concord), I had to bail him out of several gin rummy games by taking on the guy who had his money. (That became an every-summer deal for 3 years.)

So, I was brought up in and around gambling. All this led me to a fascinating and, at times, exciting life... and I especially enjoy the fact that I've pretty much lived it My Way, often to my own disadvantage, but it has been a good life.

We all know people whose lives have been literally destroyed by gambling, along with many of the people they touched.

I would just never want to be that parent who taught his child something that could have such a negative impact on his future.

Of course, I have known guys whose lives were destroyed by spending 15 years trying to play Major League Baseball. Also had a business partner once who lost everything to 8 years of full-time Amway.

There are so many ways to blow up your life for a lifetime.


Just my opinion.

Dave

Fascinating. Great stuff.

Thank you for sharing Dave. That couldn't have been all that easy.

[PaceAdvantage]

Dave, let me echo the others here and thanking you for that post...good stuff.

[Dave Schwartz]

Originally Posted by whisperlunch

Dave that’s interesting reply and pretty fascinating story. My point is not to teach children bad habits. I was introduced to horse racing by my uncle. Everyone is brought in by someone. My point is I’d rather spend one on one time with my son doing this and teaching him than not spending time. My son is 22 now and he likes the races but he doesn’t spend his life playing. So each Person is different. I’ve lost a ton of $ when I was younger at this sport but you learn to keep it where u can afford it. I have no problem when I see kids at the track with their parents or family. I don’t think anything is wrong with it. To each his own. This is an interesting topic.

I agree with your perspective.

Hope my post did not sound judgmental as it was not meant to be.

I recall when my daughter, then age 19, announced that she was joining the family business (horse racing).

I asked, "What will you do?"

She said, "I'll bet on the races."

I said, "We've already got somebody to do that. Why don't you become a lawyer? We could use one of those."

Dave
PS: Thanks to all the others for their kind remarks.

[whisperlunch]

Dave your post was outstanding. Poindexter also great reply.
This topic hits close to home
I have had my friends tell me I was not doing right by taking my son to Remington Park and Gulfstream Park when he was young they really thought it was awful. I totally disagreed. People react to vices different. My son watches the triple crown and that’s it. I asked him the what he thought of gun runner winning the Pegasus and didn’t watch it. It can go both ways.

[Dave Schwartz]

I see nothing wrong with taking kids to the track. The issue is what they learn from us if we take them.

Of course, this is from a guy who took his 12-year old adopted son to the track many times back in the early '80s. To my knowledge, he's never gone to the track since.

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by whisperlunch

Andy you make it sound as if we want to bond with our kids so bad then let’s shoot up drugs together just to spend time.

Come on. I agree it’s different betting at home now. But take the kid to the track and teach him what to avoid. Jeez.

There is a difference between taking a kid to the track and encouraging them to
gamble. I've took my daughter to Del Mar years ago when she was 8 or 9 years old. There is a lot to experience at the track without taking a deep dive into the gambling.

[Sunday Silence]

I've always avoided it. I coached my son in baseball, encourage him to golf with me etc. The family knows I like horses and will have TVG on etc but I don't want to introduce them to the sport. It's too easy to get hooked. For me I've always played well beneath my means. That's not the case at the local establishment I go to. People that make 5% of what I do are betting way more than me and are always a bet away from being broke. It would kill me if one of my kids ended up like that and I was the one who introduced them to gambling. I take my wife to SA or DM once in awhile but never the kids (all young adults now).

Separation of church and state.

[Dave Schwartz]

Originally Posted by Sunday Silence

I've always avoided it. I coached my son in baseball, encourage him to golf with me etc. The family knows I like horses and will have TVG on etc but I don't want to introduce them to the sport. It's too easy to get hooked. For me I've always played well beneath my means. That's not the case at the local establishment I go to. People that make 5% of what I do are betting way more than me and are always a bet away from being broke. It would kill me if one of my kids ended up like that and I was the one who introduced them to gambling. I take my wife to SA or DM once in awhile but never the kids (all young adults now).

Separation of church and state.

It would kill me to watch my kids faces if we lived like that!

[Redboard]

Explain how difficult it is to “break even,” let alone profit. Tell him to start off with a mythical $500 and place bets every day in the Selections forum here. Buy him all the forms, sheets and charts he wants. It is a good math exercise and, at least, he may learn odds, percentages, probabilities, etc.

Much better losing play money than real money. And hey, if he turns out to be a handicapping prodigy, maybe he'll buy you a vacation home near gulfstream.

[Baron Star Gregg]

I took my son to the track once when he was young but he was much more interested in eating pizza than watching horses.

[LemonSoupKid]

Before I ask other questions, why would you prohibit your children from doing things you actively do? Please read that carefully.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by LemonSoupKid

Before I ask other questions, why would you prohibit your children from doing things you actively do? Please read that carefully.

Some of the things that adults do should not be attempted by children.

[GMB@BP]

Originally Posted by LemonSoupKid

Before I ask other questions, why would you prohibit your children from doing things you actively do? Please read that carefully.

I wouldn't.

That being said, if you know something is not a great idea, long term, then I do think its being responsible to let them know the pitfalls.

I am not talking about gambling, I am talking about gambling on a sport that takes 25% of the pools in many of the bets.

[LemonSoupKid]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

Some of the things that adults do should not be attempted by children.

Of course I agree with this, but there are already legal restrictions. I think you know where I'm going with this --- if it's that bad, you yourself should throw in
the towel. Or should have, long ago. Otherwise, it's not that bad.

[LemonSoupKid]

Originally Posted by GMB@BP

I wouldn't.

That being said, if you know something is not a great idea, long term, then I do think its being responsible to let them know the pitfalls.

I am not talking about gambling, I am talking about gambling on a sport that takes 25% of the pools in many of the bets.

I appreciate this answer, and it's the same reason I said above or in other threads why I only play big racing days, and I can afford it. Being a year round (depending on the season of course) sports bettor, at the take tracks have, you can't really take horse racing seriously as a weekly or daily venture. If you know any math, you'll instantly find that. It's hard enough for people to hit 52.38% winners in sports games, ha.