Pioneerof The Nile

[nads1420]

Does he have any graded stakes winners at 1 1/4? He faded down the stretch in the Derby, Social Inclusion petered out in the Preakness stretch last year, Cairo Prince couldnt even handle 1 1/8... Maybe the 1 1/4 will be American Pharoah's kryptonite

[BlueChip@DRF]

Originally Posted by nads1420

Does he have any graded stakes winners at 1 1/4? He faded down the stretch in the Derby, Social Inclusion petered out in the Preakness stretch last year, Cairo Prince couldnt even handle 1 1/8... Maybe the 1 1/4 will be American Pharoah's kryptonite

I was looking at Social Inclusion's pedigree and didn't realize he had no cross-breeding in at least the first 5 generations.

[MNslappy]

I think AP is the first winner at 1 1/8 for him as a sire. If you read the pedigree thread by Bob S., he has some interesting things to say about AP's breeding.

[tanner12oz]

You have a link for the bob s article?

[delsully]

http://regalbloodlines.com/2015/04/2...gree-profiles/

[BlueChip@DRF]

Interesting tidbit (read from part of the American Pharaoh profile):

"In the breeding shed, he only has a few stakes winners as a broodmare sire and his AWD is 6.31, which means he gives off sprinter types. This is where you need stamina to come from."

From another forum, someone coined this slot as the "power position".

[Thunder Gulch]

This is what, his 3rd crop? So only 2 crops have had a chance, and how many 10f graded stakes are there in the US? Not enough to have statistical evidence on one sire with 2 years.

[Robert Fischer]

This guy is a smooth, relaxed runner and he has the best trainer.

He's out there like an oil painting, ears flopping back and forth while cruising too fast for others to effectively press him. No wasted energy, no straining, no signs of fatigue.

[BlueChip@DRF]

Originally Posted by Robert Fischer

This guy is a smooth, relaxed runner and he has the best trainer.

He's out there like an oil painting, ears flopping back and forth while cruising too fast for others to effectively press him. No wasted energy, no straining, no signs of fatigue.

Sounds more like a Belmont horse.

[burnsy]

Originally Posted by BlueChip@DRF

Interesting tidbit (read from part of the American Pharaoh profile):

"In the breeding shed, he only has a few stakes winners as a broodmare sire and his AWD is 6.31, which means he gives off sprinter types. This is where you need stamina to come from."

From another forum, someone coined this slot as the "power position".

Great point. His mother, Littleprincessemma sprinted twice and the dam sire Yankee Gentlemen was a class sprinter. Plus, these are the type races Baffert has the toughest time lasting. Full field, early pressure, even Game on Dude and Bayern have/had problems with that. I have to agree with the writer, if this horse is chalky, let him try to beat you and lightly use him. Any one that follows breeding will tell you that the dam side is usually the most dominant for distance. I don't really care about sample size, I'm not going to take chalk hoping for a trend change. Pioneer of the Nile could not hold on, the mothers side is sprinters. Every good horses' action looks good.....until they tire. I heard the same thing about his father. There was even one jack ass on the internet guaranteeing Pioneer of the Nile would win the Triple Crown....before the derby....sound familiar? That being said there are many in here with questionable breeding for the distance so this horse could out run the rating. At first I didn't like Dortmund as much but after looking at everything I kind of think he will have a better chance than AP distance wise.

I got made fun of for liking Mubtaahij but his breeding has a large sample size of stakes winners and horses that last a long time. He is inbred to champions that won at European distances. Carpe Diem should also appreciate the 10 furlongs and has also been a winning machine. Upstart runs well every time and added distance may be a plus for him. He likes Itsaknockout who is bred well for this but just not has shown as much as others.

These 4 will most likely relish 10 furlongs that I kind of like:

1. Dortmund

2. Mubtaahij

3. Carpe Diem

4. Upstart

[minethatbird08]

Originally Posted by burnsy

Great point. His mother, Littleprincessemma sprinted twice and the dam sire Yankee Gentlemen was a class sprinter. Plus, these are the type races Baffert has the toughest time lasting. Full field, early pressure, even Game on Dude and Bayern have/had problems with that. I have to agree with the writer, if this horse is chalky, let him try to beat you and lightly use him. Any one that follows breeding will tell you that the dam side is usually the most dominant for distance. I don't really care about sample size, I'm not going to take chalk hoping for a trend change. Pioneer of the Nile could not hold on, the mothers side is sprinters. Every good horses' action looks good.....until they tire. I heard the same thing about his father. There was even one jack ass on the internet guaranteeing Pioneer of the Nile would win the Triple Crown....before the derby....sound familiar? That being said there are many in here with questionable breeding for the distance so this horse could out run the rating. At first I didn't like Dortmund as much but after looking at everything I kind of think he will have a better chance than AP distance wise.

I got made fun of for liking Mubtaahij but his breeding has a large sample size of stakes winners and horses that last a long time. He is inbred to champions that won at European distances. Carpe Diem should also appreciate the 10 furlongs and has also been a winning machine. Upstart runs well every time and added distance may be a plus for him. He likes Itsaknockout who is bred well for this but just not has shown as much as others.

These 4 will most likely relish 10 furlongs that I kind of like:

1. Dortmund

2. Mubtaahij

3. Carpe Diem

4. Upstart

Burnsy, I have your back on Mubtaahij.

[nijinski]

Originally Posted by Robert Fischer

This guy is a smooth, relaxed runner and he has the best trainer.

He's out there like an oil painting, ears flopping back and forth while cruising too fast for others to effectively press him. No wasted energy, no straining, no signs of fatigue.

You nailed his description back in April !