Religious

[zico20]

Originally Posted by Actor

By that line of reasoning mass murderers are doing their victims a favor. The parents of school children killed by gunmen should thank the gunmen for providing their beloved children with a short cut to heaven.

The parents suffered the loss, not the kid killed. No parent wants their child to die before them. So no, the parents should not thank the gunman. They lost out on being with their child for the rest of their life. The parents have to suffer for the rest of their life while the child killed enjoys eternal paradise.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by zico20

Sorry Thas, I had some urgent business to attend to. What I am getting at is about your comment of little kids and a loving God. Lets say that never happens. You, and the rest of the atheists would then go on to something like "why does a loving God allow people to die so early in life." If that doesn't happen, then why do some people die in their 70s while others live to 100. If everyone lived about the same length, then the atheists would go on about why would a loving God allow some people to have disabilities while others don't.

Next it would be why do some people live in mansions while others are homeless. A loving God would not allow that. See where I am going with this. If the world was almost perfect for everyone, the atheists would come up with something else to disclaim God. Why does one person have more money than someone else. Or why does one person have a better body than others.

Atheists use this line of reasoning all the time. Frankly, I get tired of it. It doesn't prove anything. I could say that the young kid who dies before he/she turns 10 is actually the lucky one. He/she gets to Heaven before me and eternal paradise without suffering through a lifetime of heartaches and misery and hard work. I can't wait to get to Heaven one day.

No, Zico...I would never expect a "perfect world" in order to justify the existence of God. Nor would I wish that we all live in mansions. Stopping the suffering of the children would be enough. The religious point to weeping icons or crying statues as proof of miracles taking place in current times...but what kind of ridiculous "miracles" are those? How about a REAL miracle...like an end to the hunger of children in this world?

How could something like this occur in a God-supervised world?

http://rarehistoricalphotos.com/vulture-little-girl/

You want to know what I get tired of? I get tired of those Christians who don't understand the implications of what the bible statement "Nothing occurs in this world unless God wills it so" really MEANS. It means that all the injustices of this world take place because God ALLOWS them to take place. He supposedly has the foresight and the power to prevent them...but he doesn't. And when this is pointed out to these Christians...they shrug their shoulders and respond that these injustices are the work of MAN...and man alone should carry the blame for them.

The "all-powerful and benevolent God", who looks the other way when these atrocities take place, is held blameless. Or, some Christian denominations give praise to God for all the good things in life...while they blame the "devil" for all the injustices of the world. That's a nice job if you can get it, isn't it: get credit for the good things that take place under your watch...while avoiding all the blame for the bad things?

[Actor]

Originally Posted by zico20

Atheists reject the BVG Theorem without even understanding it ...

Do you understand it?

While you're at it read this
http://www.theaunicornist.com/2012/1...epresents.html
and take note of this statement.

Even Borde, Guth and Vilenkin clearly suggest that a "beginning" is merely one possibility that might correspond to the boundary condition.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by zico20

The parents suffered the loss, not the kid killed.

So you agree that the gunman did the kids a favor by killing them.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by zico20

The parents suffered the loss, not the kid killed. No parent wants their child to die before them. So no, the parents should not thank the gunman. They lost out on being with their child for the rest of their life. The parents have to suffer for the rest of their life while the child killed enjoys eternal paradise.

You guys sound so sure. And all because of reading a book...

[ReplayRandall]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

You guys sound so sure. And all because of reading a book...

I've been driving a Lincoln Town Car for 14 years. When something goes amiss with my car, I first consult the owner's manual for the best possible solutions. When living my LIFE and something is amiss, I first consult the owner's manual which I consider the Bible for the best possible solutions......It's the best manual I've found for LIFE, unless you have a better manual, Gus.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

I've been driving a Lincoln Town Car for 14 years. When something goes amiss with my car, I first consult the owner's manual for the best possible solutions. When living my LIFE and something is amiss, I first consult the owner's manual which I consider the Bible for the best possible solutions......It's the best manual I've found for LIFE, unless you have a better manual, Gus.

Here you go...and you can get it in hardcover for only 2 pennies plus shipping. Highly recommended!

http://www.amazon.com/Five-Stages-So...es+of+the+soul

[ReplayRandall]

Here you go...and you can get it in hardcover for only 2 pennies plus shipping. Highly recommended!

http://www.amazon.com/Five-Stages-S...ges+of+the+soul

Already read it, a thought provoking compilation.....

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

Already read it, a thought provoking compilation.....

Another great "life manual" that's available for only a penny.

http://www.amazon.com/Happiness-Unex...9183671&sr=1-1

[ReplayRandall]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

Another great "life manual" that's available for only a penny.

http://www.amazon.com/Happiness-Unex...9183671&sr=1-1

I like "Genuine" parts for my car, that goes for books as well. I don't care for "aftermarket" parts/books......Thanks anyway.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

I like "Genuine" parts for my car, that goes for books as well. I don't care for "aftermarket" parts/books......Thanks anyway.

No problem. Good luck to you on your spiritual journey.

[TJDave]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

How about a REAL miracle...like an end to the hunger of children in this world?

How could something like this occur in a God-supervised world?

Crickets

[dnlgfnk]

Originally Posted by TJDave

Crickets

Plenty of crickets for everybody, TJ.


http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...ostcount=19947

[dnlgfnk]

From the Grey Lady...

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com...-reasons/?_r=0

Bottom line...

There are all kinds of impressive fellows with letters behind their names who rationalize their way to secular morality. In the West, it's borrowing from the Judeo-Christian ethic. If I'm demoting God to buck private, there is no reason why I should care about that little girl half a world away, who doesn't threaten my existence, in the blink of an eye that is my average life expectancy of 76 years. I need to be about self-gratification just enough to stay ahead of the authorities.

So, another 600 posts until the photo resurfaces again?

[hcap]

Originally Posted by zico20

Even if I concede the idiotic assumption that matter can create itself, it most definitely can't destroy itself. Logically therefore, the Higgs Boson really didn't create itself since it then also destroyed itself when it popped out of existence.

According to Ian Sample, the Higgs field "switched on" a trillionth of a second after the big bang. So, first you would need the singularity to even allow the universe to come into existence. Once again, something from nothing is a total fraud. But you seemed to imply that the Higgs Boson created itself from nothing, which is totally false.

The Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle changed classical physics and although yes the Higgs Boson may exist for a very short period of time in classical physics, energy and momentum are always conserved---Heisenberg spotted a loophole in this rule.

In the quantum realm, energy and momentum don’t have to be conserved.

Therefore virtual particles my pop in and out of existence without requiring a transformation of energy into matter or vice versa. Apparently now these particles need only empty space. So the question is are "virtual particles "real"

http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...particles-rea/

"Gordon Kane, director of the Michigan Center for Theoretical Physics at the University of Michigan at Ann Arbor, provides this answer.

Virtual particles are indeed real particles. Quantum theory predicts that every particle spends some time as a combination of other particles in all possible ways. These predictions are very well understood and tested.

Quantum mechanics allows, and indeed requires, temporary violations of conservation of energy, so one particle can become a pair of heavier particles (the so-called virtual particles), which quickly rejoin into the original particle as if they had never been there. If that were all that occurred we would still be confident that it was a real effect because it is an intrinsic part of quantum mechanics, which is extremely well tested, and is a complete and tightly woven theory--if any part of it were wrong the whole structure would collapse. But while the virtual particles are briefly part of our world they can interact with other particles, and that leads to a number of tests of the quantum-mechanical predictions about virtual particles. The first test was understood in the late 1940s. In a hydrogen atom an electron and a proton are bound together by photons (the quanta of the electromagnetic field). Every photon will spend some time as a virtual electron plus its antiparticle, the virtual positron

So even if the time frame of the quantum level is tiny, this sub atomic realm constitutes a reality just as real as the rules and order of the macroscopic world first described by Newtonian physics.
[YT="Casimir"]qR37JMQw08Y[/YT]

Curiously the bible theoretically written by an anthropomorphic deity declared the process of the creation of the world already as done in 6 days, today we are finding out that a good portion of reality of the universe is in a constant flux of creation and destruction.