Tongue Ties - a betting edge?

[Jeff P]

posted by Suff-

Tack changes.... and by tack I mean the whole setup.. Bridle, Bit , Yoke, Blinkers, wraps, shoes, saddle etc etc... needs to be more transparent.

posted by parlay-

One of the great benefits of being at the track is being able to attend the paddock.IF YOU ARE OBSERVANT YOU WILL CATCH SOME UNREPORTED EQUIPMENT CHANGES.

Every horse has a story. A few years ago a friend of mine who owns six or seven horses was complaining to a group of us about one of his fillies who would lose all interest in running every time she reached the top of the stretch. He said she had the ability to outwork other horses in the morning but in the afternoon would turn her head toward the stands and pay attention to the crowd instead. He'd run her in blinkers and still get the same result. Mornings - just fine. Afternoons - turn and focus on the stands.

So now I kind of know the story behind this filly and one day she shows up in the post parade with her ears stuffed full of cotton. I put two and two together and realize she'd been curious about crowd noise which isn't there in the mornings. That day she won by open lengths.

Little things like that can and do make a difference and you'll never see something like "Equipment Change: Ears stuffed with cotton today" at the bottom of the program.

-jp

[Tom]

My friend's horse in the 70's finally won with a closed LH blinker cup, tongue tie, ear plugs, and some kind of special bit to make sure she turned her head the right way.

[Figman]

One thing you can't find out is "how much lasix was injected today?" There are often set parameters but no set amount of administration from start to start. The current parameters in NY are anywhere from 5 to 10 ccs - four to four and one-half hours prior to racetime. Some states have no limits and don't post race test for lasix. Others have no limits but you'd better not ring the bell with over 100 ng lasix per ml/plasma in the test from the post race sample.

And what would you do if you did know this information? Often less is better!

[turfbar]

very interesting talk. 10-12 years ago at Fort Erie i did keep a diary of T.T. information The OJC was the only racing authority that made that information available, i always wanted to start a grassroot group to get the tracks to divulge this data, for some mysterious reason they just stopped providing that info. I always thought that when the trainer entersY his horse he could devulge this info as well.Yes i did have some good scores keeping this info,and I also had a phone dicussion with Mr.Selvidge and he told me how vital he thought this information was,i mean if the can tell the authority about blinker change why not about
a T.T. change?
No one includes that disclosure anymore not even Fort Erie, like someone said you must be in the paddock to observe this.
I do believe I have a wealth of data on this subject and have devised some theories that have proved been beneficial (T.T.-tongue tie)

[so.cal.fan]

turfbar?
I am curious as to Mr. Selvidge's opinion on tongue ties.
Did he believe the trainers/and/or help was adding some substance to the tongue tie?
This is what I thought he was implying.
Paddock observation is the most underated handicapping factor there is.
I have a very strong opinion on this subject based on over 40 years of daily attendance at the racetrack.
There are so many things one misses if you are not there watching.

[turfbar]

No I don't think he was implying any added substance
,he did add ,let me say, this conversation we had was from the early 1990's,
about the addition of stickers in turf races that the public was not exposed to,
this also was at the time of the legal addition of lasix was introduced in NY and Canada, his term stickers was funny because i had never really heard of them
and he is from the west coast and I am from the East, but i do think if the racing form or equibase would publish T.T. information it would help "some " handicappers, back in the day i recorded every blinker change and TT change that there was
and like i said b4 there were some terriffic payouts based on that information
really pisses me off that have swept it under the rug for all these years.
TURFBAR

[toetoe]

Ken,

You can say THAT again.

[kenwoodallpromos]

Sorry about that!
But a search says AAEP was never mentioned before on this forum; I think AAEP is worth a mention on this thread (or 2!)- they have a lot of good information.

[toetoe]

Ken,
That's the lobby for Etired People, am I right?

[kenwoodallpromos]

American Assoctioan of Equine Pickers.

[bdhsheets]

Tongue ties are far more important than people think. You can dirty up a horses PP's fairly quick, return the t.t. and the pony wins at boxcar odds.

In Great Britain, they list todays tongue ties on a daily basis. Why do that if its a minor matter?

[turfbar]

hey zappi
you asked a question about tongue ties 'you received plenty of info about it but you never responded.Whatz up with dat? Hey anybody interested in trying to get DRF to publish that info or getting NYRA to acknowledge that the racing publicshould know. Anyone interested????

TURFBAR

[Observer]

Lasix rules recently changed. See the following link:
Minimum Lasix in NY is Now 3cc

And how is it up to DRF or NYRA to make tongue ties public information? It'd likely need to be a group effort from the entire industry to keep track of that info for the database .. held by Equibase?? No??

[turfbar]

let me ask, they inform or ask permission when they change blinkers
right, and DRF and Equibase both give that information correct?
Logically that if they can keep that information and print it what is so
difficult about about releasing the tongue tie information.Again to my knowledge all equipment changes must be asked for, they never get refused,but I think in the
rules of racing that it is one of the rules.

So i think is it laziness on the part of the industry or is it a conspircy!!!!!!!

[Observer]

turfbar,

I understand what you're saying .. and it seems fitting to once again point out how BRIS does not feel it's needed to use steeplechase symbols in a horse's PP lines .. but does use turf & off-the-turf symbols. Steeplechase races in a horse's PPs, however, are left as a guessing game.

Sure, it can be argued that because of the distance, or because of the weight carried, or because there are no internal fractions .. it has got to be a steeplechase race .. but why does it have to be so involved when it should be just be a quick no-question-about-it glance .. especially considering the information is out there .. since everyone else uses it???!!!