Penna Needs a Fair Start Rule

[RaceTrackDaddy]

Race 14
July 14, 2015
Meadows Racetrack and Casino or known on tv here, MEADOWS CASINO with no mention of a racetrack.

This race is a prime example of the lack of action by the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania and its Harness Racing Commission to institute a "Fair Start Rule" like other reputable organizations. Heck, track announcer did not even know the (# 7) was racing as someone had to remind of a horse that was not within a quarter mile of the start when he first ran through the field of trotters as they approached the first quarter pole. Fair Start Rule would have deemed this horse, "Shut Up And Dance" as a Non Starter thereby protecting the public's money. In PA, no one cares about the person who wagers their hard earn money as the lack of a rule shows neglect on those political appointed positions in Harrisburg.

https://youtu.be/KGZiI7FkRCs

[LottaKash]

Originally Posted by RaceTrackDaddy

Race 14
July 14, 2015
Meadows Racetrack and Casino or known on tv here, MEADOWS CASINO with no mention of a racetrack.

This race is a prime example of the lack of action by the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania and its Harness Racing Commission to institute a "Fair Start Rule" like other reputable organizations. Heck, track announcer did not even know the (# 7) was racing as someone had to remind of a horse that was not within a quarter mile of the start when he first ran through the field of trotters as they approached the first quarter pole. Fair Start Rule would have deemed this horse, "Shut Up And Dance" as a Non Starter thereby protecting the public's money. In PA, no one cares about the person who wagers their hard earn money as the lack of a rule shows neglect on those political appointed positions in Harrisburg.

https://youtu.be/KGZiI7FkRCs

You are so right Bobby...

Good luck with a fair anything, from that state....

Pa horseracing, be it S-bred or T-breds, have shown that they just don't give a chit about the bettor any longer...It is so evident by their ridiculous exotic wager takeouts, and their unwillingness to keep out the horsemen who give racing a bad name and steal, with impunity, from us...frigem..

[RaceTrackDaddy]

Originally Posted by LottaKash

You are so right Bobby...

Good luck with a fair anything, from that state....

Pa horseracing, be it S-bred or T-breds, have shown that they just don't give a chit about the bettor any longer...It is so evident by their ridiculous exotic wager takeouts, and their unwillingness to keep out the horsemen who give racing a bad name and steal, with impunity, from us...frigem..

I totally agree with you Kash. Seen it all in PA.

Thinking back of all the stupid things that have happened to me personally, the one that hurts the most could have had a happy ending (pun intended as I will explain later) for all concerned. (why is it things like bring out the old stories?).

Anyway, back in the early 80's. We got steam (inside info) of a shipper coming to the Meadows that had a huge shot to win at a price. I bet $30 to win and $20 to place on Southampton Henry. In a tough stretch battle, the winner had to be decided by the photo finish camera. I stand at the finish line watching the race live or at least as close to the line on the apron. I really thought that Youngwood Flash (JC Miller Sr in the bike) won the race.

They posted SH instead of YF as the winner. Some ran to the windows to collect while I walked. SH paid $28.20 to win and $6.20 to place. By the time I got in line there were two people in front of me. Just when the guy in front got his cash, the judges or the mutual room shut the machines down. They announced that no further tickets will be cashed. The judges posted the wrong order and made it official on the tote.

I never got my win money, the $62 for the place. The thing the Meadows should have done was to pay both as if they won it. Sure it might cost a couple grand back then but it was during the fall or early winter and right before simulcasting.

In Pa, don't believe them when they say the Judges Decision is FINAL as they can change it on a dime.

[RaceTrackDaddy]

Originally Posted by RaceTrackDaddy

I totally agree with you Kash. Seen it all in PA.

Thinking back of all the stupid things that have happened to me personally, the one that hurts the most could have had a happy ending (pun intended as I will explain later) for all concerned. (why is it things like bring out the old stories?).

Anyway, back in the early 80's. We got steam (inside info) of a shipper coming to the Meadows that had a huge shot to win at a price. I bet $30 to win and $20 to place on Southampton Henry. In a tough stretch battle, the winner had to be decided by the photo finish camera. I stand at the finish line watching the race live or at least as close to the line on the apron. I really thought that Youngwood Flash (JC Miller Sr in the bike) won the race.

They posted SH instead of YF as the winner. Some ran to the windows to collect while I walked. SH paid $28.20 to win and $6.20 to place. By the time I got in line there were two people in front of me. Just when the guy in front got his cash, the judges or the mutual room shut the machines down. They announced that no further tickets will be cashed. The judges posted the wrong order and made it official on the tote.

I never got my win money, the $62 for the place. The thing the Meadows should have done was to pay both as if they won it. Sure it might cost a couple grand back then but it was during the fall or early winter and right before simulcasting.

In Pa, don't believe them when they say the Judges Decision is FINAL as they can change it on a dime.

Dam, reading this post I forgot to tie in the "Happy Ending" comment above as a pun. Back then we had two warnings. One is a Liquor Warning is when someone wins a ticket that pays a hundred bucks, that person buys a round of big green beers for the guys. Now, when it crosses the $200 barrier, we call it a Hooker Warning so that if there was enough for a the guys there to buy one, we would mention it though never forced them to buy us a hooker, it was just a happy ending to the gambling day.

[LottaKash]

Originally Posted by RaceTrackDaddy

IThe judges posted the wrong order and made it official on the tote.

I never got my win money, the $62 for the place. The thing the Meadows should have done was to pay both as if they won it. Sure it might cost a couple grand back then but it was during the fall or early winter and right before simulcasting.

In Pa, don't believe them when they say the Judges Decision is FINAL as they can change it on a dime.

Ya shoulda ran to the window...haha...

Seriously tho, the track should have ate their mistake in that instance, as it was posted as "official"....

[RaceTrackDaddy]

Originally Posted by LottaKash

Ya shoulda ran to the window...haha...

Seriously tho, the track should have ate their mistake in that instance, as it was posted as "official"....

That is what the guy that cashed his ticket in front of me said..lol

While we are at it. it was about two years later (still before time of simulcasting) that 14 mutual tellers were fired on the bottom floor of the grandstand. Could have been 15 tellers but he was in the can answering nature's call.

I bet a few bucks on Tom Davis's horse Neros Valentine who was 9/1 at the 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 and across the line as the winner. Something funny was happening. The toteboard now was changing money figures and odds. It was about five minutes later the odds dropped down to 9/2 and posted $11 winner.

I didn't cash my ticket but 14 guys at the mutual line were all smiles. Yes, the ground floor mutual line never shut off the machines for the race so these guys were punching their own winning tickets. A smart fan saw this and was giving them the wrong order of racing as they were punching their tickets while the race was live. Not until the track announcer (Roger) said the Nero's Valentine won did they all start punching win tickets. A few people went up to cash before it was official and gave them the correct order of finish.

True story. The Meadows is the Mecca of statistical anomalies in happen stance.

[LottaKash]

Originally Posted by RaceTrackDaddy

That is what the guy that cashed his ticket in front of me said..lol

While we are at it. it was about two years later (still before time of simulcasting) that 14 mutual tellers were fired on the bottom floor of the grandstand. Could have been 15 tellers but he was in the can answering nature's call.

INot until the track announcer (Roger) said the Nero's Valentine won did they all start punching win tickets. A few people went up to cash before it was official and gave them the correct order of finish.

True story. The Meadows is the Mecca of statistical anomalies in happen stance.

Wow, I always dreamed of getting in on a thing like that...haha..

[EMD4ME]

Originally Posted by RaceTrackDaddy

That is what the guy that cashed his ticket in front of me said..lol

While we are at it. it was about two years later (still before time of simulcasting) that 14 mutual tellers were fired on the bottom floor of the grandstand. Could have been 15 tellers but he was in the can answering nature's call.

I bet a few bucks on Tom Davis's horse Neros Valentine who was 9/1 at the 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 and across the line as the winner. Something funny was happening. The toteboard now was changing money figures and odds. It was about five minutes later the odds dropped down to 9/2 and posted $11 winner.

I didn't cash my ticket but 14 guys at the mutual line were all smiles. Yes, the ground floor mutual line never shut off the machines for the race so these guys were punching their own winning tickets. A smart fan saw this and was giving them the wrong order of racing as they were punching their tickets while the race was live. Not until the track announcer (Roger) said the Nero's Valentine won did they all start punching win tickets. A few people went up to cash before it was official and gave them the correct order of finish.

True story. The Meadows is the Mecca of statistical anomalies in happen stance.

After reading all these stories, all I can say is WOW! Thank god I don't live in PA Loved visiting Penn for many many many years but those days are gone.

Love the stories, keep em coming.

[Stillriledup]

I won't play Canada because of this bad rule. I respect your opinions RTD but I'm not a fan of this rule. If I see a 2yo filly trotter at 3-5 limping in the warmups and my main position is to bet against her, I don't need her being refunded because while you say it's 'fair' to the people who bet on her, how is that fair to me that I'm stuck w bets I don't want after she comes out of the pools? I want a refund too.

[LottaKash]

Originally Posted by Stillriledup

I won't play Canada because of this bad rule. I respect your opinions RTD but I'm not a fan of this rule. If I see a 2yo filly trotter at 3-5 limping in the warmups and my main position is to bet against her, I don't need her being refunded because while you say it's 'fair' to the people who bet on her, how is that fair to me that I'm stuck w bets I don't want after she comes out of the pools? I want a refund too.

SRU, I can quite agree with your position, when spotting something in the warmups that others may not see, so in that case, the rule wouldn't help you in that regard...

But, on the other hand, especially these days with me and so many others, being able to only bet online at any particular track, and not getting to see those warmups as one could while ontrack, so I like that rule...

More than a few times, I had made wagers on horses that I thought were very good plays, only to find that they weren't up to it, nor the gate, and thankfully those that played that horse were rewarded with a refund, rather than a loss on a horse that couldn't make the grade on that nite...

Thus, I like that rule, for the most part....

I can't count the times that I bet and lost on horses that couldn't make the fair start pole in their races....I wish they had that rule back then, for 52 years at that, for sure...

[RaceTrackDaddy]

Originally Posted by Stillriledup

I won't play Canada because of this bad rule. I respect your opinions RTD but I'm not a fan of this rule. If I see a 2yo filly trotter at 3-5 limping in the warmups and my main position is to bet against her, I don't need her being refunded because while you say it's 'fair' to the people who bet on her, how is that fair to me that I'm stuck w bets I don't want after she comes out of the pools? I want a refund too.

I can see your point Stillrileup. I being a gambler and follower of Stanley's Law used to clock the warm up miles, check equipment, etc. But today's game most of the cash is out of sight of the main players. If we want this sport to succeed, all movement in rules should be to keep the game for them and not for out benefit because we see things no else does. I find it akin to insider trading.

In fact, I do believe it has helped their handle rather hurt it.

If for my own betting purposes and my ability to see things that others can't, I would too use it to my advantage. But what is good for is that good for the sport overall?