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06-27-2017, 08:24 AM
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,803
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Dave Gutfreund Video says why he's had enough of horse racing. Will stick to Poker.
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06-27-2017, 08:42 AM
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#2
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Registered user
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: FALIRIKON DELTA
Posts: 4,439
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@2:09
What's wrong with the computer programmers?
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whereof one cannot speak thereof one must be silent
Ludwig Wittgenstein
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06-27-2017, 09:29 AM
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: GA
Posts: 2,860
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I always enjoyed the Starting Gate radio show he did in the late 90's. Anyone remember that?
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06-27-2017, 10:12 AM
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 361
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Need a lil context here. Before he starts in as Capt Obvious to us in this room, he states a lawsuit went wrong which is why he he soured on racing. Sup wit dat?
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06-27-2017, 10:51 AM
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 3,630
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spiketoo
Need a lil context here. Before he starts in as Capt Obvious to us in this room, he states a lawsuit went wrong which is why he he soured on racing. Sup wit dat?
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I believe Dave is part of the DerbyWars team
__________________
Check out my daily horse racing podcast The BARN at www.betamerica.com/barn
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06-27-2017, 11:44 AM
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sioux Falls, SD
Posts: 1,028
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jballscalls
I believe Dave is part of the DerbyWars team
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That's correct.
__________________
"Support Tracks That Support Players" Some Random Horseplayer-2011
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06-27-2017, 11:59 AM
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#7
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Buckle Up
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 10,614
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In the video, Gutfreund is a dead-ringer for Steely Dan's Donald Fagen...
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06-27-2017, 02:41 PM
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 8,798
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He's playing a type of poker (large field, deep stack tournaments) that is basically pure gambling for all but a tiny number of elite players (and I'm not even sure about them-- it's possible that someone like Phil Hellmuth may just have a ton of rungood, as there are a number of players who are considered highly skilled who have mediocre results in deep-stack large field tournaments).
I hope for his sake that if he actually plans to play poker full time, he focuses on playing types of poker that he can be consistently profitable in over a large sample size. If he just wants to hit a jackpot payout in in the WSOP, might as well just play the lottery. It's less work and the chances are about the same.
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06-27-2017, 03:44 PM
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 1,264
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Good job by Dave,concisely stating some of the biggest problems in horse racing, that never get addressed by horse racing columnists or commentators.
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06-27-2017, 09:32 PM
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#10
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Bombardier
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,043
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I have never heard of him, but I am glad to see him speaking out about a few of the problems in racing. He is absolutely right that the value is gone. Seems like a nice guy and well-known to some of you. As for poker, I don't know that the fact that he was interviewed during a WSOP event means that he only plays big tournaments. Many pros play both cash games and tournaments. Best of luck to him.
Small thing; did his glasses look crooked on his face?
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06-27-2017, 09:35 PM
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#11
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Bombardier
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,043
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaLover
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Delta, he said late odds changes right after computer programmers. Perhaps he is referring to those computer 'capping whales that send money in right up to (after?) the race is off. It is the concept of arbitrage; good for them, bad for most. It is similar to the Bid/Ask concept in stock trading. The retail customer gets burned while the whales have a decided advantage. This is pure speculation on my part in trying to answer your question.
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06-27-2017, 11:56 PM
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#12
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Veteran
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 1,831
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The late odds changes have been happening for decades. imo, way too much is made of it as a negative factor in anyone's game.
In order to have value , regularly, in a game with a confiscatory takeout, you need a steady and abundant supply of suckers.
Do we have that?
That said, if you do the hard work, and have loads of patience, there is still opportunity. If you want to bet every race or 20 races a day in simulcasts, you probably can't find that much edge.
Last edited by AltonKelsey; 06-27-2017 at 11:58 PM.
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06-27-2017, 11:59 PM
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#13
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tmrpots
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dilanesp
He's playing a type of poker (large field, deep stack tournaments) that is basically pure gambling for all but a tiny number of elite players (and I'm not even sure about them-- it's possible that someone like Phil Hellmuth may just have a ton of rungood, as there are a number of players who are considered highly skilled who have mediocre results in deep-stack large field tournaments).
I hope for his sake that if he actually plans to play poker full time, he focuses on playing types of poker that he can be consistently profitable in over a large sample size. If he just wants to hit a jackpot payout in in the WSOP, might as well just play the lottery. It's less work and the chances are about the same.
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The guy elected to play in a tournament for Christ sakes. Give him a ****ing break.
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06-28-2017, 02:53 AM
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 930
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dilanesp
He's playing a type of poker (large field, deep stack tournaments) that is basically pure gambling for all but a tiny number of elite players (and I'm not even sure about them-- it's possible that someone like Phil Hellmuth may just have a ton of rungood, as there are a number of players who are considered highly skilled who have mediocre results in deep-stack large field tournaments).
I hope for his sake that if he actually plans to play poker full time, he focuses on playing types of poker that he can be consistently profitable in over a large sample size. If he just wants to hit a jackpot payout in in the WSOP, might as well just play the lottery. It's less work and the chances are about the same.
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Don't worry about David Gutfreund, a very smart player and gambler, comes from a very wealthy family. I wish I was half the handicapper that he is.
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06-28-2017, 12:20 PM
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#15
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Veteran
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 1,831
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SandyW
Don't worry about David Gutfreund, a very smart player and gambler, comes from a very wealthy family. I wish I was half the handicapper that he is.
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I don't know the guy or much about him, but if that's the case, then the only skill you need is not burning through your inheritance before you croak.
Everything else is just amusement.
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