RIP to Mongolian Groom and CA Racing

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by AndyC

For what purpose? If horses aren't racing why test them?

Basically every drug testing regime that anyone considers serious in sports tests athletes out of competition. Not all performance enhancers are given day of the race (e.g., the steroids that Big Brown was on), and out of competition testing also diminishes the effect of masking agents (including Lasix, of course), which are intended to flush any drugs out of the system before a post-competition test.

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by cj

Sure, but tracks don't want that as fields are short enough as it is. They turn a blind eye to all but the most obvious cases.

Claiming races need to go. You want to sell your horse, do it privately. If we really care about the horses, playing games with the claiming system is never going to be a good look.

Your comment implies that the problem is mostly with the claimers or low level horses. Is it true that claimers breakdown more than other types?

[cj]

Originally Posted by AndyC

Your comment implies that the problem is mostly with the claimers or low level horses. Is it true that claimers breakdown more than other types?

I don't have the data to know, but my experience would lead me to believe that is true. I wouldn't be shocked if that data proved me wrong, but I'd be surprised.

So do you think the claiming game is good for horse safety overall?

[bob60566]

Originally Posted by AndyC

For what purpose? If horses aren't racing why test them?

This should help you understand.

http://tharacing.com/medication/out-...ition-testing/

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by cj

I don't have the data to know, but my experience would lead me to believe that is true. I wouldn't be shocked if that data proved me wrong, but I'd be surprised.

So do you think the claiming game is good for horse safety overall?

I don't know but I did read where Indiana Grand had one of the lowest fatality rates of any track. Are they running claimers there? I also believe that most of the fatalities at Santa Anita were not claiming horses. I would certainly be swayed by stats showing a strong correlation between race level and fatalities.

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by bob60566

This should help you understand.

http://tharacing.com/medication/out-...ition-testing/

Thanks for posting the link.

My comments were made from a viewpoint of whether or not a horse is physically sound enough to withstand the rigors of racing on raceday. While out-of-competition testing might be a good (albeit expensive) step for racing to take it still doesn't answer the question of whether a horse is physically sound enough to race.

[bob60566]

Originally Posted by AndyC

Thanks for posting the link.

My comments were made from a viewpoint of whether or not a horse is physically sound enough to withstand the rigors of racing on raceday. While out-of-competition testing might be a good (albeit expensive) step for racing to take it still doesn't answer the question of whether a horse is physically sound enough to race.

This should help for that

Official veterinarians, employed by the racetrack or the state racing commission, determine much of a horse’s race-day routine. These veterinarians are in charge of confirming that all horses are sound to race, and to do that they examine horses several times on race day.

https://thehorse.com/171178/the-race-day-routine/

[TonyK@HSH]

Originally Posted by bob60566

Would it be to much trouble to implement out of competition testing at major tracks in 2020.?

Already happening in Pa

[AskinHaskin]

Originally Posted by AndyC

I also believe that most of the fatalities at Santa Anita were not claiming horses.

16 of the first 30 were claimers.

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by bob60566

This should help for that

Official veterinarians, employed by the racetrack or the state racing commission, determine much of a horse’s race-day routine. These veterinarians are in charge of confirming that all horses are sound to race, and to do that they examine horses several times on race day.

https://thehorse.com/171178/the-race-day-routine/

Thanks again. It makes one wonder how a hurt horse could ever make it to the starting gate.

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by AskinHaskin

16 of the first 30 were claimers.

Thanks. The second half of the equation would be the number of starters that were claimers and non-claimers.

[bob60566]

Originally Posted by AndyC

Thanks again. It makes one wonder how a hurt horse could ever make it to the starting gate.

Uncontrolled drug use goes long way.

[AskinHaskin]

Of the post-Mongolian Groom list of 37

now 20 were claiming horses. Not necessarily entered in a claiming race on the fateful day.


And wild speculation would suggest that considerably more than 54% of all starters at SA during the same time period would qualify under this broad umbrella of claiming horses.

(the only way to qualify for some starter allowance races is to have at some point been a claiming horse, etc.)



Just 12 of the 37 last raced on a SA main track labeled "fast"

(Same was true of just two of the initial 17 to die at SA from Dec. 26 through the end of March)

[Fager Fan]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

Basically every drug testing regime that anyone considers serious in sports tests athletes out of competition. Not all performance enhancers are given day of the race (e.g., the steroids that Big Brown was on), and out of competition testing also diminishes the effect of masking agents (including Lasix, of course), which are intended to flush any drugs out of the system before a post-competition test.

First, steroids were legal then, and second, Lasix doesn’t mask. Please go read up on it instead of continuing to put out this misinformed opinion.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by Fager Fan

First, steroids were legal then, and second, Lasix doesn’t mask. Please go read up on it instead of continuing to put out this misinformed opinion.

Fager, THE WORLD ANTI-DOPING AGENCY SAYS LASIX MASKS. They have credibility. You are some anonymous person on the Internet. So I am going to repeat the TRUTH as long as there are deniers like you out there.

As for steroids, they are illegal now, and it's perfectly obvious that you would need out of competition testing to enforce the ban. Which was my point.