National horse racing oversight authority

[Nitro]

I personally think its step in the right direction. That’s probably because I’ve personally witnessed how the Hong Kong Jockey Club regulates every aspect of racing there. Granted there are only 2 tracks in HK, but the integrity and the veracity of regulating their overall product is second to none anywhere in the world.

So how would you judge the success of this type oversight and regulation? It’s very simple really! Just take a look at their annual betting handle. Would you think for a minute that their patrons would get so involved if they thought the rules and transparency were being compromised in any way?

Realistically, though I have my doubts that a new organization like this would initially be accepted by all concerned parties. I would just like to see the owners of just few U.S. tracks accept and be regulated by this organization. By setting a positive example that produces visible monetary results in terms of handle increase would I believe lead others in the industry to follow suit.

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

I can't, for the life of me, see how the Feds could screw this game up any more than it already is.

Your presumption being that ALL of the states are incompetent at regulating their racetracks.

It seems based on the opinions on this forum that any racetrack circuit willing to take the necessary steps to lock down illegal drug usage should reap the benefits of massive increases in handle. Seems like a great opportunity with seemingly no risk. I know everybody on PA will cease betting on any drug track and only bet the drug-free tracks. Aren't 90%+ of PA members betting Hong Kong exclusively right now?

[Dave Schwartz]

Originally Posted by AndyC

Your presumption being that ALL of the states are incompetent at regulating their racetracks.

It seems based on the opinions on this forum that any racetrack circuit willing to take the necessary steps to lock down illegal drug usage should reap the benefits of massive increases in handle. Seems like a great opportunity with seemingly no risk. I know everybody on PA will cease betting on any drug track and only bet the drug-free tracks. Aren't 90%+ of PA members betting Hong Kong exclusively right now?

Andy,

Respectfully, I think your opinions are way off base.
(But then, I've been wrong before.)

Which states are REALLY competent at regulation?

Please list the ones where cheaters are dealt with in such a manner that they can no longer cheat?

Hong Kong?
90%?

Seriously?

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by Dave Schwartz

Andy,

Respectfully, I think your opinions are way off base.
(But then, I've been wrong before.)

Which states are REALLY competent at regulation?

Please list the ones where cheaters are dealt with in such a manner that they can no longer cheat?

Hong Kong?
90%?

Seriously?

Sarcasm Dave. Players are bitching about the sport not being clean yet they continue to put their money up. If they were serious they would be playing HK and not the tracks where cheating exists.

According to my Googled results 32 states have horse racing. Isn't it amazing that all 32 are incompetent? So the answer to this collective incompetence is to have a legislative body with little or no knowledge of racing be in charge of writing regulations?

I have no idea which tracks deal with cheaters in a manner where they can no longer cheat. The obvious question is why wouldn't a state mandate regulations to take full advantage of this pent-up demand?

[JustRalph]

I gotta go with Thask on this one. I have seen what Ohio called racing “Investigators” back in the 90’s

I’m hoping it’s better now. But color me doubtful

[Dave Schwartz]

Originally Posted by AndyC

Sarcasm Dave. Players are bitching about the sport not being clean yet they continue to put their money up. If they were serious they would be playing HK and not the tracks where cheating exists.

According to my Googled results 32 states have horse racing. Isn't it amazing that all 32 are incompetent? So the answer to this collective incompetence is to have a legislative body with little or no knowledge of racing be in charge of writing regulations?

I have no idea which tracks deal with cheaters in a manner where they can no longer cheat. The obvious question is why wouldn't a state mandate regulations to take full advantage of this pent-up demand?

WOW.

And I thought you were serious.

[jay68802]

Originally Posted by Dave Schwartz

WOW.

And I thought you were serious.

WOW, and I thought........I cuffed on dirt roads.......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIuAQPKp4x0

[classhandicapper]

I'm generally against doing things at the Federal level when they can be done at the state level. The complicating issue here is different rules on drugs and treatments in each state.

It would be one thing if everyone knew the entire medical history of every horse (or if horses never shipped). Then you could at least theoretically have an informed view on whether a horse's performances on circuit 'a" would be duplicated on circuit 'b' with different treatments and drugs.

But this industry can't even time races correctly yet.

It's crazy to think fans are going to start looking through medical records to see which drugs and treatments a horse has been receiving or that all that info is going be provided in the PPs (let alone the public understand it). We are lucky we even get Lasix info.

IMHO, this is one of the exceptions where I think some kind of national policy on drugs and treatments makes some sense. How much further beyond that you want to take it is questionable, but the drug issue from state to state has long been a problem.

[elhelmete]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

I can't, for the life of me, see how the Feds could screw this game up any more than it already is.

"Hold my beer..."

[Nitro]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

I'm generally against doing things at the Federal level when they can be done at the state level. The complicating issue here is different rules on drugs and treatments in each state.

It would be one thing if everyone knew the entire medical history of every horse (or if horses never shipped). Then you could at least theoretically have an informed view on whether a horse's performances on circuit 'a" would be duplicated on circuit 'b' with different treatments and drugs.

But this industry can't even time races correctly yet.

It's crazy to think fans are going to start looking through medical records to see which drugs and treatments a horse has been receiving or that all that info is going be provided in the PPs (let alone the public understand it). We are lucky we even get Lasix info.

IMHO, this is one of the exceptions where I think some kind of national policy on drugs and treatments makes some sense. How much further beyond that you want to take it is questionable, but the drug issue from state to state has long been a problem.

You mean something like this?
https://racing.hkjc.com/racing/infor...OveRecord.aspx
or this:
https://racing.hkjc.com/racing/infor...EDatabase.aspx
or this
https://racing.hkjc.com/racing/infor...se=ST&RaceNo=1
and there’s so much more info available.

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

I'm generally against doing things at the Federal level when they can be done at the state level. The complicating issue here is different rules on drugs and treatments in each state.

It would be one thing if everyone knew the entire medical history of every horse (or if horses never shipped). Then you could at least theoretically have an informed view on whether a horse's performances on circuit 'a" would be duplicated on circuit 'b' with different treatments and drugs.

But this industry can't even time races correctly yet.

It's crazy to think fans are going to start looking through medical records to see which drugs and treatments a horse has been receiving or that all that info is going be provided in the PPs (let alone the public understand it). We are lucky we even get Lasix info.

IMHO, this is one of the exceptions where I think some kind of national policy on drugs and treatments makes some sense. How much further beyond that you want to take it is questionable, but the drug issue from state to state has long been a problem.

How about starting with the BC? If there were a policy in place that all participants must have certifications of lifetime drug status to run then wouldn't that get the ball rolling? To be fair it would have to be phased in. The triple crown races could implement the same mandate. At that point what owner or trainer would risk a shot at the ultimate races with any horse that has potential?

After transitioning to drug-free big races the mandates could then be implemented to lower level races.

[ubercapper]

Similar Federal legislation authorized USADA over 20 years ago. No only is complaining about how they get things done today.

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by ubercapper

Similar Federal legislation authorized USADA over 20 years ago. No only is complaining about how they get things done today.

There is a big difference from authorizing the formation of the USADA and mandating regulations. In 2000 there was unanimous agreement about screening athletes. It is hardly unanimous in racing as to which drugs should or shouldn't be allowed. This is not question about the USADA, I don't doubt that they would do a good job. It's defining the job that I don't want the Feds to determine what the job is.

Racing is not like a league where rules need to be uniform throughout. Each track or jurisdiction should be able to make their own rules. Olympic qualifying events need to be run using the same rules everywhere or else participants would have an unfair advantage or disadvantage. The results of a horse race in Louisiana is not affected by the results of a race in California.

[Dave Schwartz]

Racing is not like a league where rules need to be uniform throughout. Each track or jurisdiction should be able to make their own rules.

Andy,

That's kind of the point, isn't it?

Racing has not done it via the states, so now the feds are stepping in.

Not convinced the outcome will be a good one, but change has been needed for a long time.

[jay68802]

Originally Posted by Dave Schwartz

Andy,

That's kind of the point, isn't it?

Racing has not done it via the states, so now the feds are stepping in.

Not convinced the outcome will be a good one, but change has been needed for a long time.

Agree with your point. Problem is that there has been no input from the horsemen or the customers.