What Happened To The Jockey Club Gold Cup

[aaron]

Originally Posted by burnsy

Kelso won this race 5 times in a row at 2 miles. I think 3 went sub 3:20. Now people want it to be 9 furlongs? What's with these horses and NOT racing? Or getting any kind of classic distance?

Then the laugher is the "experts" and "Gurus" cutting people off and putting them down when they say: " These horses are fast, but why can't they last over 9 furlongs?" And "why can't they race more than every 5-8 weeks?"

After seeing the JCGC yesterday.....Hoppertunity comes "off the bench" from handy defeats and trumps the east.............If CC is right these guys are "appetizers" next month.......lol. It could be said the CC is a "throw back", 5 years old, just kicking ass and taking names.....that's a friggin race horse....and the way they were meant to run once upon a time. But even he takes long breaks before a "drink at the well".

It is all about owners and trainers.They are more concerned about their win % than they are about doing the right thing.If a horse can workout, he can run.In horse racing it is not a disgrace to lose a race. Years ago top horses used to always run against each other. Trainers then started pulling out of races because of weight, basically ending Handicap races and competition. Forego lost races and carried as much as 138 lbs. He is still regarded as one of the great horses.Owners who are great businessmen, don't have a clue about what is best for racing.The top trainers control the game.They have basically ruined the game with their shortsightedness.Take a look at Belmont yesterday. Was there one horse people came out to see ? How much did NYRA lose with purses that were wasted on unattractive card with short fields,

[ronsmac]

Originally Posted by burnsy

Kelso won this race 5 times in a row at 2 miles. I think 3 went sub 3:20. Now people want it to be 9 furlongs? What's with these horses and NOT racing? Or getting any kind of classic distance?

Then the laugher is the "experts" and "Gurus" cutting people off and putting them down when they say: " These horses are fast, but why can't they last over 9 furlongs?" And "why can't they race more than every 5-8 weeks?"

After seeing the JCGC yesterday.....Hoppertunity comes "off the bench" from handy defeats and trumps the east.............If CC is right these guys are "appetizers" next month.......lol. It could be said the CC is a "throw back", 5 years old, just kicking ass and taking names.....that's a friggin race horse....and the way they were meant to run once upon a time. But even he takes long breaks before a "drink at the well".

I give Chrome a pass for his break this year because of the trip to Dubai. Assuming he makes it to the classic, that will be four consecutive races in a row. Even though the spacing these days isn't what it used to be. Even some of the sprinters are skipping their respective Breeders Cup preps this year. It may be an illusion , but it seems like an inordinate number of horses will have 8-10 week layoffs coming into this years races.

[infrontby1]

Good article from espn on this topic:


http://www.espn.com/horse-racing/sto...-get-spotlight)

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by infrontby1

Good article from espn on this topic:


http://www.espn.com/horse-racing/sto...-get-spotlight)

A lot of Watchmaker's arguments were just wrong. As I noted above, New York's fall stakes were in decline before the BC came around.

And the BC was not "intended" to be as moveable as he says. It was intended to make a profit and decide championships. If you go back and look at the publicity in 1984 it was definitely intended to be in California most years because of our good weather and big crowds.

Pushing for NYRA to host BC's is pushing for the BC to risk losses and bad weather. I do think it's not a terrible idea to go there occasionally, but this is the whine of someone who doesn't understand that New York's fall decline was inevitable.

Bear in mind, Saratoga is much bigger now than it ever was in the past, so trends sometimes work in NYRA's favor too.

[CincyHorseplayer]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

A lot of Watchmaker's arguments were just wrong. As I noted above, New York's fall stakes were in decline before the BC came around.

And the BC was not "intended" to be as moveable as he says. It was intended to make a profit and decide championships. If you go back and look at the publicity in 1984 it was definitely intended to be in California most years because of our good weather and big crowds.

Pushing for NYRA to host BC's is pushing for the BC to risk losses and bad weather. I do think it's not a terrible idea to go there occasionally, but this is the whine of someone who doesn't understand that New York's fall decline was inevitable.

Bear in mind, Saratoga is much bigger now than it ever was in the past, so trends sometimes work in NYRA's favor too.

You gave yourself away as a California dreamer in your post and it is so biased it's pathetically obvious.

If the BC is NOT a movable event then it is useless. 10 times in 2 places in 11 years is BS.

Before the BC the NY races were in decline? Where and what else was taking the helm of relevance for Eclipse honors? Not buying this fiction.

There is no whine larger than a west coast whine. You invented the rivalry. The rest of us in this country could care less about that fiction too.

But by all means keep on. It's entertaining! Freedom of speech is God's gift to comedy!

[the little guy]

Originally Posted by CincyHorseplayer

You gave yourself away as a California dreamer in your post and it is so biased it's pathetically obvious.

If the BC is NOT a movable event then it is useless. 10 times in 2 places in 11 years is BS.

Before the BC the NY races were in decline? Where and what else was taking the helm of relevance for Eclipse honors? Not buying this fiction.

There is no whine larger than a west coast whine. You invented the rivalry. The rest of us in this country could care less about that fiction too.

But by all means keep on. It's entertaining! Freedom of speech is God's gift to comedy!

Post of the day.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by CincyHorseplayer

You gave yourself away as a California dreamer in your post and it is so biased it's pathetically obvious.

If the BC is NOT a movable event then it is useless. 10 times in 2 places in 11 years is BS.

Before the BC the NY races were in decline? Where and what else was taking the helm of relevance for Eclipse honors? Not buying this fiction.

There is no whine larger than a west coast whine. You invented the rivalry. The rest of us in this country could care less about that fiction too.

But by all means keep on. It's entertaining! Freedom of speech is God's gift to comedy!

Cincy, NYRA's attendance was way down IN THE 1970's, and Oak Tree was pulling good horses out of their stakes. That all predates the BC.

The BC certainly can move around and does, somewhat. But it happens they make more money when they stage it in California and Kentucky and may even take a loss, or make much less, in New York. Plus there's the weather.

That's reality. New York is never going to recapture its glory in the fall. There are too many other options. As I said, though, Saratoga is bigger than ever. So the trends work both ways.

[EMD4ME]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

Cincy, NYRA's attendance was way down IN THE 1970's, and Oak Tree was pulling good horses out of their stakes. That all predates the BC.

The BC certainly can move around and does, somewhat. But it happens they make more money when they stage it in California and Kentucky and may even take a loss, or make much less, in New York. Plus there's the weather.

That's reality. New York is never going to recapture its glory in the fall. There are too many other options. As I said, though, Saratoga is bigger than ever. So the trends work both ways.

I hope Repole combined with some slot money create a BC OLD SCHOOL STYLE: FALL CHAMPIONSHIP MEET.

Run all "copies" of BC at Belmont 1 week before the BC and make the purses are 50% higher.

Make NYRA preps for the races throughout the year for free births AND destroy, water down the BC product.

You CALI people/BC people need a dose in reality.

Finally, nothing personal Dilan, I kinda like your posts

[cj]

Originally Posted by EMD4ME

I hope Repole combined with some slot money create a BC OLD SCHOOL STYLE: FALL CHAMPIONSHIP MEET.

Run all "copies" of BC at Belmont 1 week before the BC and make the purses 50% higher.

Make NYRA preps for the races throughout the year for free births AND destroy, water down the BC product.

You CALI people/BC people need a dose in reality.

Finally, nothing personal Dilan, I kinda like your posts

Actually surprised this hasn't happened yet. It could be done, no doubt. The money is there.

[horses4courses]

Originally Posted by EMD4ME

Run all "copies" of BC at Belmont 1 week before the BC and make the purses are 50% higher.

It certainly would make a lot of connections of Euro turf horses very happy.

[EMD4ME]

Originally Posted by cj

Actually surprised this hasn't happened yet. It could be done, no doubt. The money is there.

They should do it. I personally am sick of watching Turf horses run on tight turns and astroturf. I'm sick of a speed biased dirt track and turf course.

Real Turf, is the Belmont turf of yesteryear. Wide turns and turf that is more than 1 inch deep.

I think I am one of the higher (higher than the median) players in the country and I handle almost nothing on BC day. It's just not a good place to hold a Championship race (SA).

[EMD4ME]

Originally Posted by horses4courses

It certainly would make a lot of connections of Euro turf horses very happy.

I agree.


Plus, I don't see why Cuomo can't allow just 5-10 million of the money he siphons away from Capitol Expenditures to go for lights at Belmont.

It's so repulsive. (How much he hates NYRA and horse racing)

[ronsmac]

Originally Posted by EMD4ME

I hope Repole combined with some slot money create a BC OLD SCHOOL STYLE: FALL CHAMPIONSHIP MEET.

Run all "copies" of BC at Belmont 1 week before the BC and make the purses are 50% higher.

Make NYRA preps for the races throughout the year for free births AND destroy, water down the BC product.

You CALI people/BC people need a dose in reality.

Finally, nothing personal Dilan, I kinda like your posts

That might work for the grass races but the way the California dirt horses have been winning the last few years, they would just raid New York and take all the money back to California. It was really bad this year when Songbird came east and just stole easy money. The same with Drefong and Arrogate. I'm not sure why the dirt horses have been so much better in California since they ditched the synthetics.

[EMD4ME]

Originally Posted by ronsmac

That might work for the grass races but the way the California dirt horses have been winning the last few years, they would just raid New York and take all the money back to California. It was really bad this year when Songbird came east and just stole easy money. The same with Drefong and Arrogate. I'm not sure why the dirt horses have been so much better in California since they ditched the synthetics.

Hey, I don't care if the Cali horses come here and kill the NY horses. I just care that the BC people get their producted diluted and destroyed. They deserve it.

The BC was created to be a rotating event. Not a stupid yearly SA event.

Why should NYRA have their entire fall Graded Stakes schedule compromised to a near non important meet? All for what? So that the fat boys at the BC eat more?

F em

[rsetup]

Originally Posted by cj

Actually surprised this hasn't happened yet. It could be done, no doubt. The money is there.

Where are the horses?