Attn: f2tornado

[dballard125]

For the years that I've been a member here, I've always considered you one of the members who really understands Stanley Caris' Derby formula and puts stock in it. I unfortunately dont know how to trace bloodlines and find which horses have Buckpasser in the Y chromosome (is that right)? I imagine you have a list of which horses meet Stanley' criteria this year? Would you mind sharing it with me please? Thanks in advance sir.

[CheckMark]

I have the book on my computer and found he talked about in "Analyzing The Triple Crown" which is apparently free online if you search the title (sorry if this is not allowed advertising PA)

It's mentioned on pages for all 3 Triple Crown races and not just the Kentucky Derby

Derby: pages 45-53
Preakness: pages 75-77
Belmont: 86-88

In the Derby section, he does go on to explain how to find Buckpasser in pedigree

You can also search and see if on Pedigree Query or another pedigree cross search

Hope this helps! Tried my best here

[Longshot]

2023 Derby horses that might carry the Large Heart X:
Raise Cain
Verifying
Mage
Continuar
Cyclone Mischief

Raise A Native sire line horses are
Angel of Empire
Lord Miles
Hit Show
Confidence Game
Mage
Disarm
Reincarnate
Jace's Road
Skinner

[CheckMark]

Originally Posted by Longshot

2023 Derby horses that might carry the Large Heart X:
Raise Cain
Verifying
Mage
Continuar
Cyclone Mischief

Raise A Native sire line horses are
Angel of Empire
Lord Miles
Hit Show
Confidence Game
Mage
Disarm
Reincarnate
Jace's Road
Skinner

Mage is the Derby horse

[dballard125]

Originally Posted by Longshot

2023 Derby horses that might carry the Large Heart X:
Raise Cain
Verifying
Mage
Continuar
Cyclone Mischief

Raise A Native sire line horses are
Angel of Empire
Lord Miles
Hit Show
Confidence Game
Mage
Disarm
Reincarnate
Jace's Road
Skinner

Thank you for this!

[sovereign]

Originally Posted by Longshot

2023 Derby horses that might carry the Large Heart X:
Raise Cain
Verifying
Mage
Continuar
Cyclone Mischief

Raise A Native sire line horses are
Angel of Empire
Lord Miles
Hit Show
Confidence Game
Mage
Disarm
Reincarnate
Jace's Road
Skinner

I'm looking at Confidence Game. RAN on top and has Princequillo in the passing position visible within 5 generations. You don't see Princequillo that close up in the pedigree anymore. I will probably do baseballs adding Two Phil's and Kingsbarns. I still don't trust the imports.

[Longshot]

You are correct about Confidence Game and Princequillo possibly passing the LHeartX.
I just missed that one .

[dballard125]

Hope I didn't offend anyone by asking for this information. Thanks all.

[Fightingirish51195]

Originally Posted by Longshot

2023 Derby horses that might carry the Large Heart X:
Raise Cain
Verifying
Mage
Continuar
Cyclone Mischief

Raise A Native sire line horses are
Angel of Empire
Lord Miles
Hit Show
Confidence Game
Mage
Disarm
Reincarnate
Jace's Road
Skinner

There may be more if I am interpreting the passing position correctly. I will post later

[Fightingirish51195]

Okay I have time... basically, If i am interpreting things correctly, as long as there arent two consectutive males from buckpasser to our derby contender, it could have the large heart.

Also important to remember that if youre assigning the points, you only get points if you have buckpasser in the x passing position and have final fractions

if my interpretations are correct then forte, angel of empire, tapit trice, lord miles, hit show, skinner and mandarin hero fit that mold

Hit show and lord miles are really boarderline on final fractions, but i am counting them

[Raider]

Originally Posted by CheckMark

I have the book on my computer and found he talked about in "Analyzing The Triple Crown" which is apparently free online if you search the title (sorry if this is not allowed advertising PA)

It's mentioned on pages for all 3 Triple Crown races and not just the Kentucky Derby

Derby: pages 45-53
Preakness: pages 75-77
Belmont: 86-88

In the Derby section, he does go on to explain how to find Buckpasser in pedigree

You can also search and see if on Pedigree Query or another pedigree cross search

Hope this helps! Tried my best here

Give man a fish, feed him for a day. Teach him to fish, feed him for a lifetime. Stan taught us to fish., if a man doesn't want to learn how to fish, and comes back for more....

[ranchwest]

Originally Posted by sovereign

I'm looking at Confidence Game. RAN on top and has Princequillo in the passing position visible within 5 generations. You don't see Princequillo that close up in the pedigree anymore. I will probably do baseballs adding Two Phil's and Kingsbarns. I still don't trust the imports.

Interesting. I've always viewed Princequillo as a turf sire line.

[CheckMark]

Originally Posted by Raider

Give man a fish, feed him for a day. Teach him to fish, feed him for a lifetime. Stan taught us to fish., if a man doesn't want to learn how to fish, and comes back for more....

"It is more fitting to show people how to do a task themselves than to do it for them"

I'm presuming that is what you are saying

I was only trying to help the best I could; I was no expert on the topic so I went to the book for reference

[Raider]

Originally Posted by CheckMark

"It is more fitting to show people how to do a task themselves than to do it for them"

I'm presuming that is what you are saying

I was only trying to help the best I could; I was no expert on the topic so I went to the book for reference

You can't teach someone who doesn't want to learn. Check out Rasmussen factor. Buckpasser, RAN and ND are all getting past the five generation mark, Tracking the Sire line is easy, tracking the X factor takes work. I think I am not the only one who has taken Stan's WORK and trying to add to it.

[f2tornado]

Buckpasser in the x passing position means it goes through a daughter of Buckpasser but cannot be transmitted through back to back colts. At least that's the theory. Horses fitting this angle with fast final fractions include:

Forte (also female family 1-x)
Tapit Trice
Kingsbarns (LA Derby not a Stanley qualifying race but I don't care)
Mage
Disarm (the LA Derby again)
Skinner (if he gets one more defection)

I didn't look at anything beyond 21st spot. The following also have the Buckpasser-x but missed on certain angles:


Raise Cain* (does not qualify; 5th)
Rocket Can* (does not qualify; loss of ground)
Hit Show* (does not qualify, final 3/8th time but probably faster when adjusted)
Continuar* (in tail female line, don't know the fractions)