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03-12-2015, 11:02 AM
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,678
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Tax Question
In race 8 at GP on 3/11/15 the $1 trifecta paid $1196.60. If one had a 50 cent tri ($598.30) would that generate a W2G?
__________________
“Man is a slow, sloppy, and brilliant thinker; computers are fast, accurate, and stupid.”
― John Pfeiffer
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03-12-2015, 11:06 AM
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Houston Tx.
Posts: 3,130
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From my limited experience with signers, it should but it doesn't.
__________________
Laboratory rats are susceptible to drug addiction, obesity, diabetes, heart disease and cancer.
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03-12-2015, 11:14 AM
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#3
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,844
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No, not a signer. That is one of the benefits of betting smaller denominations.
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03-12-2015, 11:52 AM
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#4
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intus habes, quem poscis
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Brooklyn NY
Posts: 9,776
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by cj
No, not a signer. That is one of the benefits of betting smaller denominations.
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If you only bought one .50 tri from your ADW, then not a signer. If you hit that ticket a couple times though, they will group it as a like bet and you will have to file.
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03-12-2015, 11:56 AM
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#5
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Grinding at a Poker Table
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 4,904
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The relevant criteria in this case is:
" $600 or more in gambling winnings (except winnings from bingo, keno, slot machines, and poker tournaments) and the payout is at least 300 times the amount of the wager".
You missed the W-2G generation threshold by $1.70. 
...
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03-12-2015, 12:04 PM
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#6
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Grinding at a Poker Table
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 4,904
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by OTM Al
If you only bought one .50 tri from your ADW, then not a signer. If you hit that ticket a couple times though, they will group it as a like bet and you will have to file.
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OTM Al correctly mentions a condition that I did not consider.
I "think" this multiple grouping also applies when tickets are purchased at the track/otb, but I don't know if it is enforced, and regardless, the player can get around it then by cashing at multiple windows. ADWs on the other hand, where individual ticket transactions are all recorded and subject to review, will wisely do their best to comply with all reporting requirements.
Last edited by Track Collector; 03-12-2015 at 12:14 PM.
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03-12-2015, 04:34 PM
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 7,510
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Track Collector
OTM Al correctly mentions a condition that I did not consider.
I "think" this multiple grouping also applies when tickets are purchased at the track/otb, but I don't know if it is enforced, and regardless, the player can get around it then by cashing at multiple windows. ADWs on the other hand, where individual ticket transactions are all recorded and subject to review, will wisely do their best to comply with all reporting requirements.
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Yes. That is correct. If several say $0.50 trifecta bets on the same combination on the same ticket, it is treated for tax purposes as one bet.
If the bests are made on separate tickets or better separate windows, they are considered individual bets.
My friend's late grandfather taught us that trick some time ago....
As far as I am aware, the same applies today.
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03-12-2015, 07:42 PM
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#8
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Out-of-town Jasper
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,364
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by thespaah
Yes. That is correct. If several say $0.50 trifecta bets on the same combination on the same ticket, it is treated for tax purposes as one bet.
If the bests are made on separate tickets or better separate windows, they are considered individual bets.
My friend's late grandfather taught us that trick some time ago....
As far as I am aware, the same applies today.
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Technically you are supposed to group all bets. Different tickets or different windows has nothing to do with it, but there is no way that law can be enforced unless you present the tickets all at once when you cash. Even then you may get away without signing, depends on the training the cashiers receive.
__________________
“If you want to outwit the devil, it is extremely important that you don't give him advanced notice."
~Alan Watts
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03-13-2015, 12:05 AM
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 7,510
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by therussmeister
Technically you are supposed to group all bets. Different tickets or different windows has nothing to do with it, but there is no way that law can be enforced unless you present the tickets all at once when you cash. Even then you may get away without signing, depends on the training the cashiers receive.
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Understood. But there is no way to actually compel an individual to cash in all of their winners at one time.
And of course, "supposed to" in the case of smart people who are looking to avoid what are considered confiscatory taxes, means "thanks for the info, but I'm not going to volunteer my money"....
Trust me when I tell you this. If I had two 50 cent tri winners that if they were a one dollar bet, rest assured I would do what I needed to in order to keep Uncle Sam's grubby paws off my winnings.
If that means cashing one at one window and cashing the other at another window, I would do that. Or cash them on different days. Or cash one and mail in the other...Whatever it takes.
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03-13-2015, 01:25 AM
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#10
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,678
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Thanks to all for the great information.
__________________
“Man is a slow, sloppy, and brilliant thinker; computers are fast, accurate, and stupid.”
― John Pfeiffer
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03-21-2015, 07:11 PM
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 57
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If I bet a 20 cent pick 4 that paid $700, I should expect a w2 form coming, right?
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03-21-2015, 08:05 PM
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#12
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broken-down horseplayer
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Portland, OR area
Posts: 2,090
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by happy camper
If I bet a 20 cent pick 4 that paid $700, I should expect a w2 form coming, right?
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Correct. Some ADWs mail them to you, others will only have it online for you to download.
__________________
Playing SRU Downs - home of the "no sweat" inquiries...
Defying the "laws" of statistics with every wager.
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03-22-2015, 07:55 AM
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Etobicoke, ON, CANADA
Posts: 1,022
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Better yet come to Woodbine for your horseplayer vacations. Canada doesn't tax windfalls. No signers on live or simo.
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03-22-2015, 12:15 PM
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 930
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When you cash these tickets in a SAM machine, you will get a voucher that is untaxed.
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03-22-2015, 08:56 PM
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#15
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broken-down horseplayer
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Portland, OR area
Posts: 2,090
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by SandyW
When you cash these tickets in a SAM machine, you will get a voucher that is untaxed.
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Maybe at Woodbine.
At American tracks, you'll get your ticket back with a message to "see a teller...." At least that's what's happened to me.
__________________
Playing SRU Downs - home of the "no sweat" inquiries...
Defying the "laws" of statistics with every wager.
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