Religious

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

Again? Why read it at all? As I've pointed out repeatedly, scripture proves nothing!

Just as none of your posts do.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

John the baptist did not contradict himself, but you did.

You're a liar. The only time I made the case for present tense verbs was in the Lukian passage.

Scripture's source is suspect so to take it as "the word of God" especially literally can be foolish.

But it's content isn't.

Ps 19:7-11

7 The law of the Lord is perfect, restoring the soul;
The testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple.
8 The precepts of the Lord are right, rejoicing the heart;
The commandment of the Lord is pure, enlightening the eyes.
9 The fear of the Lord is clean, enduring forever;
The judgments of the Lord are true; they are righteous altogether.
10 They are more desirable than gold, yes, than much fine gold;
Sweeter also than honey and the drippings of the honeycomb.
11 Moreover, by them Thy servant is warned;
In keeping them there is great reward.
NASB

I experience God directly through his internal love. You don't because you don't believe in that. You think you have to wait till you are dead. Good luck with that.

You no more have the love of God within you than did the Pharisees. Like the Pharisees, you ignore virtually all of Jesus' teachings.

quote]If it is God's sovereignty that chose to withhold his love from the pharisees then it is God's responsibility for their blindness. But the truth is God gives us free will. The Pharisees chose only up to their ability to see the truth.[/quote]

God is not responsible for their sin of "blindness" (lack of faith). God is under no moral obligation to save them from their sin. Why is God morally obligated to bestow his grace on any undeserving person?

I have had many experiences of Christ in my life as I have repeatedly told you. You don't believe it because I don't follow the scriptures and don't take them literally. You are close minded on this and that is your prerogative.

Except the passages that tickle ears, you mean? Like the one that says "God is love." That you take literally, don't you?

But an infinite being does not limit how one comes to experience him from a book written 2000 years ago whose authors didn't even know the atom exists. A book that was edited by a murderer (Constantine). Is it any wonder so much bloodshed occurred as a result of of these rigid beliefs. The result is the opposite of the original message of peace and love. It is no wonder to me that you reject when I speak of experiencing peace and love with God in the here and now. Because you look at the dark side of the Bible written by dark souls. Your dark righteousness blinds you to your own truth. You are so superficial, you consider a book about God, more substantial than one's actual experience of God. You need help.

How would you know what an infinite being does? Especially an infinitely holy and just being? Who told you what such a being does? Or do you just appeal to your creative but dark imagination?

And now you call my righteousness which is Christ's imputed righteousness "dark"? Nice bit of blasphemy.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

Do you suppose that the Almighty also helped Constantine to kill his wife and son too? Wake up, Boxcar. Heinous murderers cannot be entrusted to do the "Work of God". You put murderers in JAIL...you don't glorify them by turning them into "Saints". And you don't put trust into the documents that they've left behind. Who entrusts the work of a MANIAC?

Did not God harden Pharaoh's heart? You're the one that needs to wake up! The more God removes even his common grace from fallen mankind, the more evil man becomes.

But again...Constantine had very little say over the canon. That decision was left to church councils under God's supervision.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by boxcar

But again...Constantine had very little say over the canon. That decision was left to church councils under God's supervision.

CONSTANTINE demanded the assembly of the bible...not God. Don't forget that.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by Hank

But of course,"God" intervened with Constantine to ensure the proper editing of "His" book but he can't be bothered to change the "heart" of Hitler or his ilk to prevent the slaughter of millions.

To be honest...we can't criticize God for his occasional oversights. After all...he is partly human...so, he is allowed his share of mistakes.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Just as none of your posts do.

Argumentum ad hominem.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

CONSTANTINE demanded the assembly of the bible...not God. Don't forget that.

What part of Pr 21:1 don't you understand? Maybe this one will help:

Prov 20:24
24 Man's steps are ordained by the Lord,
How then can man understand his way?
NASB

You should also get up to speed on Aristotle's FOUR CAUSES. I strongly suspect you have an overly simplistic view of causation. There are causes and then there are causes behind those.

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

And also, Jesus (the one whom you rarely believe)

Yeah, right, I've only told you at least 20 times I've had Jesus answer my prayers.

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Like the Pharisees, you ignore virtually all of Jesus' teachings.

You only need to know one teaching of Jesus and that is love. If you know all the rest of his teachings and the Buddha's and Krishna and Mohamed and Lao Tsu put together you know nothing if you don't know love within.


There is a difference between believing in God and believing in a book. When you believe in God and there is a spiritual interaction within between you and your source (God), there is truth. There is real experience. When you believe in a book, you know nothing because all true wisdom is imparted via the language of love.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

Yeah, right, I've only told you at least 20 times I've had Jesus answer my prayers.

How could Jesus answer your prayers? Only God can do that. Further, how could God who is impersonal, amoral, irrational energy answer prayers? How can trees, rocks, grass, water, etc. answer prayers?

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

You only need to know one teaching of Jesus and that is love. If you know all the rest of his teachings and the Buddha's and Krishna and Mohamed and Lao Tsu put together you know nothing if you don't know love within.


There is a difference between believing in God and believing in a book. When you believe in God and there is a spiritual interaction within between you and your source (God), there is truth. There is real experience. When you believe in a book, you know nothing because all true wisdom is imparted via the language of love.

But there is no difference in believing what inspired revelation says and believing God because inspired revelation is of God.

And, yes, fallen man certainly has "love within". This Jesus in whom you say you believes said that the kind of love sinners have is for darkness because their deeds are evil. Sinners love the darkness.

The prophet Hosea taught that evil rulers love their own shame (Hos 4:18).

The prophet Jeremiah also taught that sinners "greatly love to wander..." (Jer 14:10).

So, yes...sinners have very much "love within" but none of it biblical, none of it for God. Sinners don't believe in returning God's love to Him. Religious people think love is a one-way street.

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

How could Jesus answer your prayers? Only God can do that. Further, how could God who is impersonal, amoral, irrational energy answer prayers? How can trees, rocks, grass, water, etc. answer prayers?

You speak gibberish

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by boxcar

How could Jesus answer your prayers? Only God can do that. Further, how could God who is impersonal, amoral, irrational energy answer prayers? How can trees, rocks, grass, water, etc. answer prayers?

And then you ask to be taken seriously.

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

So, yes...sinners have very much "love within" but none of it biblical, none of it for God. Sinners don't believe in returning God's love to Him. Religious people think love is a one-way street.

Sinners and saints all have "love within". The difference is the "awakening". As I said b4, I am awakened in that I finally became aware of the gift that is already within: love. I am not "enlightened" b/c only after becoming "awakened" can I be a student of "love". And "God is Love" 1 John 4:8.

As Bob Dylan once said You have many contacts among the lumberjacks To get you facts when someone attacks your imagination

What doesn't fit your concept of how God works according to a book that has been manipulated by man over and over again, you try to discredit with these half ass arguments of how it cannot be from God. I think you are an offense to God b/c you don't have any respect for those who acknowledge him.

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Sinners don't believe in returning God's love to Him.

Then that is NOT the divine love I am talking about. That is love that is here today and gone with divorce tomorrow. As I said b4, the love that one awakens to is not connected to a person, place, or thing. In that case it can only be divine and an interaction between the divine and the blessed is automatic.