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03-30-2021, 07:14 PM
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 5,789
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PETA Survey Takes Aim at Horse Racing Subsidies in New York
Certain people in the business decided to give Peta a seat at the Table. Especially in California. Bunch of emmer effin jerkoffs
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03-30-2021, 07:56 PM
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,390
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This isn't just a PETA or a New York issue...this is a nationwide concern which leaves our favorite sport on very shaky ground, IMO. As the other gambling options gain stronger footholds in this country, it will be mighty difficult to justify such a massive financial subsidy for a gambling game with such a small (and continuously shrinking) fanbase. Throw in all the negative press that our game keeps getting...and this doesn't look like it will have a good ending for horse racing and its participants.
I wish the horse racing industry could somehow come together and address this issue in a persuasive way some time soon.
__________________
Live to play another day.
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03-30-2021, 08:18 PM
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#3
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Registered Wacko
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Belmont-ish
Posts: 2,242
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thaskalos
I wish the horse racing industry could somehow come together and address this issue in a persuasive way some time soon.
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Don’t hold your breath. Horse racing has been its own worst enemy since the 1970’s and has shown very little desire to market itself (with some exceptions such as in New York with the new TV contract.) Instead they have been more than happy to live off of casino handouts.
Horse racing will have to contract more, much more, for people to finally wake up and lose the feeling of entitlement.
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03-30-2021, 09:09 PM
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 518
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This problem isn’t going away without major structural changes to the game. There’s no incentive for any of the parties involved to change
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04-01-2021, 11:29 AM
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queens, NY
Posts: 20,528
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I'm no fan of PETA, but if you couldn't see this coming when the industry first started using casino subsidies you probably shouldn't be a decision maker. It's one thing to take the money while you are trying to turn the ship and create a sustainable long term business model. It's another to make the casino money part of the business model on the assumption it's always going to be there.
__________________
"Unlearning is the highest form of learning"
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04-01-2021, 11:56 AM
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 7,325
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Like so many things in racing, and frequently around here, inaccuracies are passed around as truths, and commonly accepted as such for whatever reasons. NYRA does not receive "subsidies" from the Casino. These payments are provided through State Law and the NYRA franchise agreement. NYRA conveyed its land and intellectual property in 2008 to the State in exchange for VLT payments to be made annually as compensation.
Just the facts.
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04-01-2021, 12:57 PM
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Clarksville, AR
Posts: 1,206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the little guy
Like so many things in racing, and frequently around here, inaccuracies are passed around as truths, and commonly accepted as such for whatever reasons. NYRA does not receive "subsidies" from the Casino. These payments are provided through State Law and the NYRA franchise agreement. NYRA conveyed its land and intellectual property in 2008 to the State in exchange for VLT payments to be made annually as compensation.
Just the facts.
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Is there any kind of timeframe, e.g. a sunset date, a payment adjustment calculation date, etc. in those agreements that might be a cause for concern?
__________________
Tom in NW Arkansas
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”Past performances are no guarantee of future results.” - Why isn't this disclaimer printed in the Daily Racing Form?
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04-01-2021, 03:07 PM
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#8
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Just another Facist
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Now in Houston
Posts: 52,619
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarchCapper
Is there any kind of timeframe, e.g. a sunset date, a payment adjustment calculation date, etc. in those agreements that might be a cause for concern?
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25 yrs if I remember right. There’s stuff online about it. Do a search
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04-01-2021, 03:12 PM
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Clarksville, AR
Posts: 1,206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustRalph
25 yrs if I remember right. There’s stuff online about it. Do a search
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Yes, it's a 25 year franchise (should be through 2033, if I remember right) - but sometimes there are other clauses in those agreements that come into play. I'm not quite ready to read through the franchise agreement!
__________________
Tom in NW Arkansas
——————
”Past performances are no guarantee of future results.” - Why isn't this disclaimer printed in the Daily Racing Form?
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04-01-2021, 03:58 PM
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#10
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clean money
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 23,513
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PETA trying to 'Tax' the Fox Sports deal w/ a weak collection racket.
__________________
Preparation. Discipline. Patience. Decisiveness.
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04-02-2021, 10:07 AM
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queens, NY
Posts: 20,528
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the little guy
Like so many things in racing, and frequently around here, inaccuracies are passed around as truths, and commonly accepted as such for whatever reasons. NYRA does not receive "subsidies" from the Casino. These payments are provided through State Law and the NYRA franchise agreement. NYRA conveyed its land and intellectual property in 2008 to the State in exchange for VLT payments to be made annually as compensation.
Just the facts.
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It doesn't matter what you call the money some tracks receive via the casinos. A lot of current track business models around the country are built on casino money. All of those tracks have some kind of "deal" in place as the reason they get the payments. The problem is someone was eventually going to ask why casino money is being used for horse racing instead of education and healthcare and why a business that would otherwise be unprofitable is on extremely valuable land that could be used for profitable development. It's a bad model and imo was/is unlikely to be sustainable long term due to politics. It was also not hard to see coming.
__________________
"Unlearning is the highest form of learning"
Last edited by classhandicapper; 04-02-2021 at 10:16 AM.
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04-02-2021, 10:39 AM
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 7,325
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Quote:
Originally Posted by classhandicapper
It doesn't matter what you call the money some tracks receive via the casinos.
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While I am sure I read more of this post than most, if not all, there was no reason to read anymore.
Of course it matters. It gets to the absolute heart of the issue.
As an aside....less is more.
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04-02-2021, 11:20 AM
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queens, NY
Posts: 20,528
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the little guy
While I am sure I read more of this post than most, if not all, there was no reason to read anymore.
Of course it matters. It gets to the absolute heart of the issue.
As an aside....less is more.
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What you seem to be saying is that NYRA has a legal deal in place related to the land that entitles it to the money. So technically it is not a "subsidy".
Sounds good to me.
What I am saying is that in an era of blown out budgets and massive social needs, casino money going to horse racing instead of more urgent things and valuable land not being used effectively, the politics might change. Politicians have a way of getting what they want.
IMO, the casino model was/is flawed. I've been saying that from the start.
It creates zombi tracks that simply draw handle away from stronger tracks.
If you are legally entitled to the money you obviously take it, but I think the industry has to try to become less dependent on it. Pressure for change was/is surely to come (as this article suggests is beginning).
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"Unlearning is the highest form of learning"
Last edited by classhandicapper; 04-02-2021 at 11:33 AM.
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