Your Experience Betting Horses

[Inner Dirt]

First trip to the track was the quarter horses with my step dad at Los Alamitos when I was 14 in 1975. Bet the Harness horses at Hollywood Park, Fairplex Park, Los Alamitos from 1979-1987, or whenever the last So Cal harness meet was held. Also was betting the Southern Cal Thoroughbred circuit at that same time although it seemed harness racing was profitable for me while I lost it back on the Thoroughbreds. In 1986 became a disciple of Andrew Beyer and made my own figures until 1993 when he put them in the Racing Form.

Oddly enough other than a speed biased few weeks at Santa Anita in late 1986 and early 1987, didn't have any good scores till the early 2000's well after all the information I painstakingly complied myself was all right in the form (speed figures, situational trainer statistics, etc).

My biggest failure is lack of patience as I love action. I am at least even or slightly ahead over my life time. If I just bet the tracks and situations where I had an advantage or played small in the bad situations I probably could have banked $10,000 a year for the last 30 years. At 53 I am getting better at control, but still aren't there. My worst habit was setting a minimum amount I wanted to win. I had a win big or go home even attitude. As an example could be $400 up going into the last race. Even if the last race was a mess, instead of playing $20-$50 of exactas or trifectas I would try to make a bet to get over $1,000, even if it meant making a win bet on a shaky 8-5 favorite that if he was in race #1 would not have bet if he was 7-2.

I could ramble on but just on more thing, I am basically pace handicapper who has developed a great method to predict pace no matter if the participants are locals or shippers. I love fishing out the $20 and up horse who wires the field even though he or she appears 10 or more points short of the highest Beyer figure in the race.
My name reflects my favorite track, Aqueduct Inner Dirt as it is usually kind to speed. Any other speed players and what tracks do you like? I think poly tracks suck and am glad they are getting rid of them.

[thaskalos]

I am also 53 years old...and this is the toughest game that I've ever seriously attempted to "master". In order to have a chance at winning, I have to play as perfect a game as I am capable of playing...and I don't want any disturbances around me at any time during my gambling activity. I firmly believe that distractions are the anathema to serious gambling. The way I play, one race can make all the difference...and complete concentration is a must.

If you see a guy with a mountain of losing tickets heaped on his desk, who is constantly whispering into a mini-recorder...then you've spotted me. You are welcomed to come over and say hello...but please don't be offended if I initially appear inhospitable. I am a much friendlier guy in "normal" surroundings.

[raybo]

I've told my story several times here, but it is not typical of your average pony player. I discharged from the military in '77 and took a job as a draftsman for a custom millwork company shortly after. One of the guys who worked in the custom shop had been gambling for years, horses and casino (Las Vegas) games. He was also one of the smartest, most absolutely logical, and most profit motivated people I have ever known. By '78 we had become good friends, in his words, "you are the only one in the company I can have an intelligent conversation with". I didn't even know he was a big gambler at that time, I thought he just did it to have good time. Man, was I wrong, this guy was a devout gambler, and spent almost every waking moment outside of work studying and honing his skills. One day I caught him looking at the Daily Racing Form, on lunch hour. I'd never seen one before, or even known what it was. Well, he refused to give me much info about it, or PPs in general. Later after work I asked him why he was so shut mouth about it, and he told me that the game would chew you up and spit you out if you didn't have the right mental, emotional, and psychological characteristics. I mentioned it a few times after that, just because he had aroused my curiosity, I really didn't care for gambling due to my upbringing, but he wouldn't budge. A couple of months later he came into my office and dropped a stack of subsections from the newpaper in Ft Worth (Times Herald) on my drafting table and said, study them. They were horse racing results, that's all, just results. It was well over a month later before he introduced me to the Form. Well, except for 2 day trips to Louisiana Downs, at which I wagered a total of $100 ($50 bankroll each day), I did nothing but study racing for the next 20 years, and collaborated with my "mentor" that whole time. He kept telling me, don't wager significant amounts until you can make a consistent profit on paper. It took that whole 20 years to reach that point. But, when I finally "went live", I started out profitable and have remained that way ever since.

My mentor became one of my employees eventually, when I was promoted to production manager, and at the age of 50, after working for what you would consider low blue collar wages (never more than $17 per hour), he simply stopped working, with over $350k in various money markets and stocks and bonds (I never knew he was an investor either - LOL). He didn't start drawing Social Security until he reached 65, 15 years later, and never worked that whole time, he just invested and gambled. I was his boss and only 3 years younger than him, making a whole lot more money than he ever made, and I couldn't retire until age 62. That tells you how smart and wise he was, and still is.

If not for him, I have no doubt that I would never have bet a dime on racing, or anything else for that matter. And, if not for him and his philosophy and guidance, never would have become profitable in horse racing. I have never bet any other game, and have only bought 2 lottery tickets in my whole life. Recently I did bet, for the first time, one quarter horse race and one harness race, hitting small superfectas in both of them, straight off the tote board, no handicapping at all, just watching the betting action and structuring my tickets soundly. I have been a superfecta bettor, exclusively, until I created my Black Box program a couple of years ago, which I now use for cash flow in support of my superfecta play. I'm a specialist, and wouldn't have it any other way.

[jahura2]

58 yrs old here and have been going to the track here in Central Ky. since I was 13. Learned from a couple of great mentors that bet full time and are profitable but I do not have the constitution for that, and besides i need to work full time to provide for the family. I will never "master" the game as Thask mentioned, but am constantly learning from experiences and other players. I love the handicapping process, form, Bris, timeform are all in play. I most of all love the solitary aspect and have done much better since eliminating all social distractions. To top it all off, I love the sport itself, spent a year on the backside at Keeneland grooming for John Ward and learned a whole other side of the game. It just drew me in more.
I consider myself a good player with lots of room for improvement. I no longer play "action" bets and stick to WP bets, exactas and and p3's (sometimes). Have finished on the positive side the last 3 years due to my increased patience which has been the key for me.
I don't bet cheap tracks and stick to the likes of GP, AQU, Belmont, KEE,Saratoga, FG and OP. Have never quite got the feel for SA and Del Mar.
As hard as the game is and with as many highs and lows I will play 'til the day I drop!

[Inner Dirt]

Never got the feel for Del Mar and Santa Anita? I lost the feeling for them. I used to live in Southern California. Santa Anita and Del Mar were decent before they put in the poly tracks, but the poly tracks produced too many races where the outcomes were unexplainable. I can handle one or two of those a card but more than that and it is time to stay away. Santa Anita went back to dirt but the place became a graveyard for anyone who was part of the early pace no matter how slow or unpressed they were. They would not lose by a lot but someone would nail them late. Del Mar is scheduled to go back to dirt this year. They used to only race in the summer but have more dates since Hollywood Park closed.

[mountainman]

57...a second generation horseplayer..started handicapping at 10 and wagering at 12

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by mountainman

57...a second generation horseplayer..started handicapping at 10 and wagering at 12

And your advice to a struggling beginner?

[mountainman]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

And your advice to a struggling beginner?

lol...I've learned more here from guys like you than they could ever learn from me...

[zico20]

I am 46 years old. I started going to the track when I was 5 with my dad, a lifelong horse player. I never bet every race at Fairmount, my home track. I just fell in love with horse racing at an early age and never felt compelled to bet. I could just go and watch, which still holds true today. I love handicapping races even though I know I won't bet.

I went to college in south Florida in the early 90s. I was poor, like all college kids. I was at Hialeah and had a few hundred bucks in my pocket. I was going to put 200 to win on a horse that I thought could not lose. He was even money. I heard one guy talking to another. He said the trifecta was all 2-4-5 straight. The 2 was my horse. So I put 200 to win and played a 40 tri 2-4-5. The 2 won by 6, the 4 was second by about 7 and the 5 was 3rd by 8 or so lengths. The trifecta paid 51.00 dollars and I walked out of there with over a grand thanks to that guy. I could not believe you could bet 40 dollars and win a grand. Ever since that day I started playing trifectas until the superfecta came about. Today, all I play are supers with some trifecta and the occasional win bet.

My patience level is second to none. I can go to the track at 11.00 AM and stay til midnight and not make a single bet. Unless I love a race I generally do not bet. The only track I follow is Fairmount. There are a few tracks I won't ever bet because I could not pick a winner if they ran 1000 match races. I look over every card and see if there are any potential races where I can play the super numerous times.

My method will never change. I like betting supers, that is where the money is at. Picking 6 winners in a row for me is next to impossible, hence I don't play horizontal wagers.

[ReplayRandall]

Zico, how did Fairmount come up with their 2 day-a-week 2015 racing schedule of Tues and Sat.?

[illinoisbred]

I am 58 years old. I've been going to races since a small child in the early 60's...Arlington, Hawthorne,even a few trips to the extinct Washington Park.Started playing in earnest in 1982 after spending the winter in New Orleans at Fair Grounds in the company of someone who at that time was seriously playing the game. I've made my own speed figures since 82..just for the Chicago area tracks. Probably around 1990,I began making pace figures too after scratching my head why so many big figure horses lose. Pace figures became a work in progress for many years..constantly tweaking them in an attempt to improve them and my results. The last 15 years or so I've been incorporating form cycles into the equation more and have had some good years,bad years,fantastic meets,abyssmal meets. I sincerely believe it's tragic just how far Arlington Park has fallen in stature from what it was in my youth. I detest polytrack..don't play many races on it and am at the point I'm slowly severing the ties that bind..moving away from my comfort zone to play other tracks. I've played Oaklawn for the past 2 seasons and love it! Thinking about taking on Indiana Downs or Grand this year to bump up my activity. Seriously considering a move away from the Illinois product to a different circuit in a year or 2 from now.

[Robert Goren]

I am 66 years old. Started betting between junior and senior year in high school. Picked a winner in the third race I bet and have never been behind since. My Dad went to the track a lot and through him I met some horsemen and a few other gamblers including Roy Landis who raised 8 kids by betting horses on the Nebraska circuit in 1950s and 1960s. I learn quite bit from those old gamblers and horsemen although I had to a lot of separating the wheat from the chaff. I work as part-time teller during college. During those college years I saw some gamblers doing new things that a few years later there were books written about including a guy who did something very close to what Beyer was later to write about. I never thought I could making a living betting the horses. Way too much stress for me to handle and I knew it. It has always been a time intensive hobby for me. I have always been a handicapper as oppose to a system player. The few attempts to develop a system with one or two exceptions were bad. One was a multi-regression I did that work pretty well until training methods changed in the late 1980s. It basically picked horses who ran a lot of times during the year. Nebraska was a pretty good to me when I was making my own speed ratings, because there I believe only one other person doing it, until Beyers got printed in the DRF. I started keep track of trainer moves and that was a lot of my profit. I also developed a knack for spotting something fishy in the PPS. I made a little money when youbet first started with that. I got promotion at work and did not bet the ponies much for several years when online poker was halted and my health force me into retirement.. I now bet a little, very little actually on NYRA races. I am currently working on a project which discovers "smart" money being bet and how it effects the chances of horse to win. It has been slow going. I have always been more of a "theory" man than a bettor.

[Stoleitbreezing]

I'm 31 years old and have been playing the horses since I was 16. I grew up in IL and was hooked on the sport of kings when a school brought in a program from Balmoral Park and told me to pick a winner. He took me to the track a couple of times and I loved the experience. After that I started going by myself and hit my first trifecta before I hit the exacta. I've been a regular horse player since, and enjoy the derby trail every year.

I recently moved to South Eastern Wisconsin after I got married, but I'm still close enough to make the trip to the OTB in Illinois or attend the Arlington Park meeting. I follow the sport daily and just last year got involved in a syndicate and have a minority interest in a 3YO filly set to debut in IL later this year.

I would consider myself more of a speed guy and prefer the longshot front runners then the closers. I continue to try to improve my game researching meetings and reading books, but still have more to explore. My best races are maiden and slop races and look for my key in those races.

Most of my "track buddies" are from the older crowd and its somewhat sad the younger generation is few and far between when I make it to the track or to the parlor. I hope the industry figures out a way to attract and advertise to my generation and younger to keep the game relevant before its too late.

[zico20]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

Zico, how did Fairmount come up with their 2 day-a-week 2015 racing schedule of Tues and Sat.?

This is the way they have started out for a while now. Then when summer hits they go to three days a week til then end of August or so when they revert back to two days a week. The IL racing board only give FP so many dates and it needs to be spread out over 6 months. I wish they would have more than 8 races a card, but the horse population doesn't support it.

I don't bet much money during the early part since a lot of horses have not ran in months. Yes, I know which trainers have their horses ready and which ones don't, but hitting tris is tricky at this time of the year. Plus the field sizes get much smaller when they go to three days a week. Same as in Sept. when they drop back down. Field sizes go back up. Hitting tris becomes more difficult.

In the summer, field sizes have averaged 6 horses for quite a few years now. Usually two horses are easily tossed in the summer, leaving 4 horses to contend for three spots. Picking the winner in 4 of 8 races is usually quite obvious. And it isn't always the favorite. Lots of time the second choice looks like a clear winner.

One last thing. Trifectas pay incredible at Fairmount. I hit a ton of tris that pay 25-30 bucks for a two dollar bet. At other tracks these tris would pay 10-15. Mountaineer comes to mind. I don't know why this is. Maybe the barn money doesn't bet tris like they do at other smaller tracks. Yes, there is the occasional 12 tri at FP, but those are generally 5 horse fields with a 1-5 winner. My only regret is that there isn't enough money in the pools to make a killing. I never bet more than 40 dollar straight tris. If Fairmount had bigger pool sizes I would play 200 straight sometimes. Yes, they are that easy if you do the work.

Fairmount runs more 25 trifectas in a week than the entire state of New York runs in a calendar year. I hope it continues this year with Hernandez gone.

[Stoleitbreezing]

Originally Posted by zico20

This is the way they have started out for a while now. Then when summer hits they go to three days a week til then end of August or so when they revert back to two days a week. The IL racing board only give FP so many dates and it needs to be spread out over 6 months. I wish they would have more than 8 races a card, but the horse population doesn't support it.

I don't bet much money during the early part since a lot of horses have not ran in months. Yes, I know which trainers have their horses ready and which ones don't, but hitting tris is tricky at this time of the year. Plus the field sizes get much smaller when they go to three days a week. Same as in Sept. when they drop back down. Field sizes go back up. Hitting tris becomes more difficult.

In the summer, field sizes have averaged 6 horses for quite a few years now. Usually two horses are easily tossed in the summer, leaving 4 horses to contend for three spots. Picking the winner in 4 of 8 races is usually quite obvious. And it isn't always the favorite. Lots of time the second choice looks like a clear winner.

One last thing. Trifectas pay incredible at Fairmount. I hit a ton of tris that pay 25-30 bucks for a two dollar bet. At other tracks these tris would pay 10-15. Mountaineer comes to mind. I don't know why this is. Maybe the barn money doesn't bet tris like they do at other smaller tracks. Yes, there is the occasional 12 tri at FP, but those are generally 5 horse fields with a 1-5 winner. My only regret is that there isn't enough money in the pools to make a killing. I never bet more than 40 dollar straight tris. If Fairmount had bigger pool sizes I would play 200 straight sometimes. Yes, they are that easy if you do the work.

Fairmount runs more 25 trifectas in a week than the entire state of New York runs in a calendar year. I hope it continues this year with Hernandez gone.

I like playing this track as it generally plays to my strength which is early speed and it also seems to be one of the most formful tracks i've handicapped. Like the previous poster you can get a lot of value playing the 2nd or 3 favorite. If betting heavy on a 3-1 or 7/2 is your thing, playing Fairmount is a good idea.

I only played this track live a couple of times on my way back from a trip to Churchill downs. Its been a few years since then, but I remember there being bars on the teller windows and the place being sort of a mess. Hopefully that has changed since then. Still a fun time though.