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07-23-2009, 12:19 PM
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#1
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Journeyman
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 31
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Do bettors really care about takeout?
From Saturday, last leg of the early pick-4 sequence:
Track-----P-4 pool---WPS Pool----p4 pool / WPS pool-- p4 takeout
Mon 37,000 115,000 32% 15%
Bel 162,000 326,000 50% 26%
Hol 172,000 194,000 89% 20.4%
LosAl 112,000 33,000 339% 20.4%
Arl 25,000 185,000 14% 25%
Wbine 60,000 113,000 53% 25%
I took a look at a few other dates and it wasn't much different than the above. I'm sure there may be some factors to consider and though comparing the p4 pool to the race representing the last leg's WPS pool is perhaps flawed, it's a pretty striking differential.
All I conclude for certain is that people love the LosAl pick4.
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07-23-2009, 12:29 PM
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,336
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The majority of average bettors couldn't tell you the takeout rates for any of the pools. I would bet many don't even know the takeout is different for different wagers.
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07-23-2009, 12:32 PM
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,352
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Calhoun
Do bettors really care about takeout
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Only those with a functioning brain in their head.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Calhoun
comparing the p4 pool to the race representing the last leg's WPS pool is perhaps flawed
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Just a little.
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07-23-2009, 12:43 PM
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#4
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Journeyman
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 31
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by ryesteve
Just a little.
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How so?
Or are you just demonstrating skill at parsing a quote to serve it up?
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07-23-2009, 12:51 PM
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#5
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Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 2,277
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bettowin
The majority of average bettors couldn't tell you the takeout rates for any of the pools. I would bet many don't even know the takeout is different for different wagers.
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The inexperienced player doesn't know or care about the take out and all the experienced players just want to whine about it. If the experienced player has a strong opinion on a horse, no matter the track or take out, he's going to play his opinion. Most are "hard core gamblers" that must bet and be in "action".
If they could control their gambling and betting, they could change the take out and Racing management by not playing those tracks which are too high. This is something Racing Management knows and counts on happening. That's why they ignore all the pitiful crying that (we) handicappers do.
Last edited by Bruddah; 07-23-2009 at 12:54 PM.
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07-23-2009, 02:23 PM
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#6
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Racing Form Detective
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lincoln, Ne but my heart is at Santa Anita
Posts: 16,316
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They do care. All tracks are too high. Horse players have voting with their feet for years. Attendance is way down. Handles are at same levels as years ago despite inflation. The track owners don't care. If a track doesn't make money, they just turn it into a housing development. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink!! 
__________________
Some day in the not too distant future, horse players will betting on computer generated races over the net. Race tracks will become casinos and shopping centers. And some crooner will be belting out "there used to be a race track here".
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07-23-2009, 02:42 PM
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,336
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robert Goren
They do care. All tracks are too high. Horse players have voting with their feet for years. Attendance is way down. Handles are at same levels as years ago despite inflation. The track owners don't care. If a track doesn't make money, they just turn it into a housing development. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink!! |
I also think takeout is too high but that isn't the major reason people have left the game. IMO, the major reason is the proliferation of casinos and lotteries where horseracing was the only game in town. People are going to casinos in droves where the slot takeout is much more than in horseracing and the lottery takeout is obscene but people keep playing.
Not to mention betting on horses actually takes some thinking 
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07-23-2009, 02:56 PM
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#8
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Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,908
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I any Bettor doesn't care about takeout then they should.
It makes a huge difference at the end of the year!
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07-23-2009, 03:24 PM
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,988
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Everyone cares about the takeout. Whether a bettor knows about takeout and its effects on his bankroll doesn't mean as much as the fact that this particular bettor lost all his money and that was partially due to takeout. If a bettor taps out and isn't participating in the betting pools anymore what's the difference if he actually knows about takeout? As far as we all are concerned, he's not there and he's not betting because he has nothing left to bet. Whether or not he knows where every dollar he lost went, he knows he lost and that's all that matters.
A bettor who's tapped isn't going to get his money back by doing research to find out where every one of his dollars ended up, all he knows is that he's broke.
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07-23-2009, 03:47 PM
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#10
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Lacrimae rerum
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: at my house
Posts: 7,308
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Quote:
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People are going to casinos in droves where the slot takeout is much more than in horseracing and the lottery takeout is obscene but people keep playing.
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Not that games of chance and games of skill have too much in relation to each other so far as what draws people to them...but slots not only don't have a much higher takeout than racing, they generally have a lower takeout than racing -- as do most all Casino games.
For the lottery there is a direct relation between takeout and per capita lottery dollars, i.e. the states with the lowest lottery takeout generate more revenue than the states with higher lottery takeout.
Everybody is sensitive to price, whether they know it or not.
Last edited by chickenhead; 07-23-2009 at 03:49 PM.
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07-23-2009, 04:42 PM
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,352
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Calhoun
How so?
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Because one has very little to do with the other. Those pools tend to draw from very distinct populations of betters. It's not as if each individual bettor is allocating his bankroll between pk4 bets and straight bets according to what the respective takeouts are.
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07-23-2009, 04:44 PM
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,352
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bettowin
People are going to casinos in droves where the slot takeout is much more than in horseracing
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What casino sets up their slots so that they only return 70 cents on the dollar?
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07-23-2009, 05:25 PM
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#13
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Deftly Rated
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 1,103
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It is my belief that more players are oblivious to the take than are aware of it.
The serious player is very cognizant of track takes, the recreational player doesn't have a clue.
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07-23-2009, 05:26 PM
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#14
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Hajck Hillstrom
It is my belief that more players are oblivious to the take than are aware of it.
The serious player is very cognizant of track takes, the recreational player doesn't have a clue.
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As cangamble has said before, they may not be aware of specific takeouts, but they know they are losing money and quick.
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07-23-2009, 05:45 PM
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sioux Falls, SD
Posts: 1,028
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by ryesteve
What casino sets up their slots so that they only return 70 cents on the dollar?
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Exactly. Instead they advertise 98 & 99% return slot machines. No wonder a lot of folks go to Vegas!
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