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06-29-2018, 01:39 PM
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#106
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NJ
Posts: 3,816
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Quote:
Originally Posted by v j stauffer
The majority of racing fans agree with you.
The Commission, Stewards and Animal Cruelty person exonerated the assistant of any other sanctions except the days he missed while awaiting his hearing.
What do you make of the fact the owner and trainer of the horse have stated they didn't have a problem with the assistant's actions?
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I make of it that none of them want to criticize one of their "brothers" and that they're all blinded from being stuck inside the racing bubble for 40 years. They don't get how clueless they sound to the rest of the world or why racing is viewed as a joke of a sport. Incidents like this show how out of touch you and some other racing "lifers" are.
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06-29-2018, 01:46 PM
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#107
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,390
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Quote:
Originally Posted by v j stauffer
I DO NOT CONDONE ABUSE OF ANY ANIMAL BY ANY PERSON AT ANY TIME.
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Fine. But...how do we convince the bewildered public that what they saw in that disturbing video does not constitute "animal abuse"? Do we tell them what Fager Fan previously said...that the racehorse needs to be manhandled into becoming subservient to the humans, for its "own protection"? How will that play out with a public that considers this to be an overly cruel sport already?
Fager Fan may be right when he says that the "actual horseman's" input should be respected here...but does he realize that the long-term future of this sport depends upon the image that it portrays to the "clueless public"?
__________________
Live to play another day.
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06-29-2018, 02:01 PM
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#108
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thaskalos
Fine. But...how do we convince the bewildered public that what they saw in that disturbing video does not constitute "animal abuse"? Do we tell them what Fager Fan previously said...that the racehorse needs to be manhandled into becoming subservient to the humans, for its "own protection"? How will that play out with a public that considers this to be an overly cruel sport already?
Fager Fan may be right when he says that the "actual horseman's" input should be respected here...but does he realize that the long-term future of this sport depends upon the image that it portrays to the "clueless public"?
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Come on. Is THIS really going to be the catalyst that drives you from racing?
Yes, it's bad optics. I'll agree that we shouldn't have things put in front of our audience that are bad optics. But you can't always cave to optics, or cave to it completely. Sometimes it's good to try to explain. Other than you, most are having none of the explaining. I doubt there's a single horseman who got real worked up over that video. They understand.
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06-29-2018, 02:05 PM
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#109
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,284
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Quote:
Originally Posted by castaway01
Anyone watching the video can see the starter hit the horse hard enough to twist a 1000-pound animal's head sideways, and he did it numerous times. The idea that you want to analyze exactly how many times the guy's fist was closed or open when you can SEE THE IMPACT shows how desperate you are to defend your cousin, er, the starter.
I do know that if someone hit you hard enough to bounce your fat head off that gate a few times, you wouldn't be getting up. Based on the quality of your posts (Vic's posts are to be expected because while he's a great handicapper but has zero integrity) someone may have already done it.
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Why does my integrity or lack thereof have any place in your post? You don't know me. You don't know anything about me.
__________________
"Just because she's a hitter and a thief doesn't mean she's not a good woman in all the other places" Mayrose Prizzi
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06-29-2018, 02:17 PM
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#110
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,390
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fager Fan
Come on. Is THIS really going to be the catalyst that drives you from racing?
Yes, it's bad optics. I'll agree that we shouldn't have things put in front of our audience that are bad optics. But you can't always cave to optics, or cave to it completely. Sometimes it's good to try to explain. Other than you, most are having none of the explaining. I doubt there's a single horseman who got real worked up over that video. They understand.
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It isn't just this video that people find disturbing. The fact that this took place in full view, along with the nonchalant reaction of the "industry"...makes reasonable people wonder about what might be taking place beyond the camera's prying eye. Couple this with the shameless "disposal" practices by which the game deals with its unwanted horses...and there isn't much left that we could really hang our hat on in this "sport".
__________________
Live to play another day.
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06-29-2018, 02:19 PM
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#111
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 1,114
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People are fired every day for (imo) lesser stuff than what this guys doing...in the real world.
I understand its a dangerous job,but do you want someone back there losing his s*** like this?
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06-29-2018, 02:31 PM
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#112
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PA Steward
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,176
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fager Fan
I doubt there's a single horseman who got real worked up over that video. They understand.
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Yes, they understand they can do whatever the hell they want to a horse and get away with it, or maybe just be handed a slap on the wrist at most (unless your name is Dutrow).
That's what they've come to understand after decades of nonsense.
Keep defending the indefensible. It looks good on you, as always.
Very few of us here care what conclusion the stewards or whomever investigated this thinks. We don't care what the horsemen think. They've never cared about us anyway, for the most part, so why should we care what they think?
We all have two eyes and one brain. And the vast majority of folks in this thread think what they saw was way beyond reasonable. Even the ones that know the difference between a flank and a hind quarter.
The fact that I can't recall ever seeing something like this in over 30 years of watching and betting on races also tells you it's way beyond reasonable.
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06-29-2018, 02:41 PM
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#113
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Philadelphia area
Posts: 9,609
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One problem here is the "eye of the beholder". Everyone on here (people involved in the sport in some way, shape or form) with the exception of a few seem to be bothered by the behavior of this asst. starter (including myself) ...therefore, this bothered response is legit.
However, there are people who are bothered by the sport itself such and the everyday behaviors that take place such as tugging on reins, the whip, etc...
PETA would no doubt have a blast with this incident, simply because they are against the sport totally. When an incident like this occurs, it gives them a "told you so" moment for them to defend their stance. So...personally I don't believe PETA needs to be bought into this matter at all, since it didn't go on blind eyes and deaf ears...the incident was recognized and a consequences were dealt out.
It was obviously a knee-jerk reaction by the asst. starter. Maybe he was injured in some way during the jostling (such as pinching his finger, or banging his elbow) and he acted out upon instinct without thinking.
Again, I'm not defending the behavior. I just making a case that it could have been the first time this individual acted on impulse resulting in this incident.
__________________
A wet track can cause handicapping havoc!!
Last edited by coachv30; 06-29-2018 at 02:43 PM.
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06-29-2018, 02:53 PM
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#114
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The Voice of Reason!
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Canandaigua, New york
Posts: 112,455
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It should certainly be his last time.
He should be selling tip sheets at the entrance.
At least if he wacks a customer,they can wack him back.
__________________
Who does the Racing Form Detective like in this one?
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06-29-2018, 03:31 PM
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#115
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 3,641
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coachv30
Again, I'm not defending the behavior. I just making a case that it could have been the first time this individual acted on impulse resulting in this incident.
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I don't think ANYONE is defending the behavior. It is indefensible.
What I think the problem is that the starter is given his job back w/out serious strings attached (counselling, anger management, demotion to job on premises that does not involve live animals, etc.)
In the long run, this kind of poor decision making by GM, trainer, owner..... not doing him or anyone else any favors. When somebody goes off like that--- whether it be in a marriage or a job---- it's time to address that there is a PROBLEM.
Problems with impulse control don't always show up until they show up. Its just that they do tend to repeat, and you can't take that chance.
Last edited by clicknow; 06-29-2018 at 03:33 PM.
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06-29-2018, 03:37 PM
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#116
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clean money
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 23,512
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Delaware and racing as a whole did a poor job of presenting the story through the media.
Most of what I can find is a from the perspective of a triggering shocking story. The only positive that I can find is that they got the owner to recant his complaint.
The official statement that was issued was lacking.
This is all before actually considering the incident itself.
__________________
Preparation. Discipline. Patience. Decisiveness.
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06-29-2018, 06:50 PM
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#117
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clicknow
I don't think ANYONE is defending the behavior. It is indefensible.
What I think the problem is that the starter is given his job back w/out serious strings attached (counselling, anger management, demotion to job on premises that does not involve live animals, etc.)
In the long run, this kind of poor decision making by GM, trainer, owner..... not doing him or anyone else any favors. When somebody goes off like that--- whether it be in a marriage or a job---- it's time to address that there is a PROBLEM.
Problems with impulse control don't always show up until they show up. Its just that they do tend to repeat, and you can't take that chance.
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Overreaction.
Again, a ton of old guys with no hands-on horse experience making ill-informed opinions.
Counseling? Demotion? Good grief.
You all act as though your mama never spanked ya. Is she still your mom, or was she put up on criminal charges or demoted?
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06-29-2018, 06:59 PM
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#118
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PA Steward
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,176
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fager Fan
Overreaction.
Again, a ton of old guys with no hands-on horse experience making ill-informed opinions.
Counseling? Demotion? Good grief.
You all act as though your mama never spanked ya. Is she still your mom, or was she put up on criminal charges or demoted?
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Go **** yourself. You only keep posting because you're getting off on pushing buttons.
You don't know shit...you've displayed that time and again on MULTIPLE TOPICS all over this board.
Except for flanks and hind quarters of course.
Genius.
Last edited by PaceAdvantage; 06-29-2018 at 07:02 PM.
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06-29-2018, 07:03 PM
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#119
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PA Steward
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,176
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This entire message board is INFESTED with nothing but assholes lately.
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