proximity poker tour 2014....

[proximity]

Originally Posted by wiffleball whizz

Happy holidays from the cookes

even though it was when the colts won a division title, i'm going to regret the day i casually mentioned the name roy cooke on this forum.

let's not mention that i spent some of the evening reading an ashley adams book....

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by proximity

even though it was when the colts won a division title, i'm going to regret the day i casually mentioned the name roy cooke on this forum.

let's not mention that i spent some of the evening reading an ashley adams book....

Forget the Ashley Adams book...here's the book you want. Get a kindle and I'll lend it to you...plus the other 50 poker books that I have on there.

http://www.amazon.com/Quantum-Poker-...=quantum+poker

[proximity]

my sincere apologies to roy cooke and ashley adams.

moving on, i log on 2+2 and pm a question to newall, death donkey, doug l, and sklansky.

q: i'm approaching the table for a brand new game of 3/6 limit hold 'em at horseshoe baltimore. where should i sit relative to aunt hortense?

one expert says to sit to her left. but another expert says to sit to her right. yet another expert says to sit straight across from her.

i'm greatly anticipating sklansky's tie breaking vote but remain as confused as ever when he replies: on her lap....

[wiffleball whizz]

Proximity enough of the platinum status let's get you that diamond card!!!!!!!! To close not to get to the promised land now!!!!

[proximity]

Originally Posted by wiffleball whizz

Proximity enough of the platinum status let's get you that diamond card!!!!!!!! To close not to get to the promised land now!!!!

see, I knew another pa member could come up with a better joke. not that I set the bar very high.

really, it could come down to that final big game on new year's eve.

being a poker winner, a total rewards diamond.... it could ALL be on the line.

I had a good week last week, but I have to put it in the rearview mirror and go back and fight my guts out again this week. I have got to focus.

sigh....

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

I don't read his columns, but I read his books, which are comprised of his columns. Yes...he doesn't talk much about pre-flop play, because pre-flop play does not make for interesting reading. Would YOU be able to write column after column about pre-flop play?

Making value bets in the latter stages of the hand -- or saving a bet here and there -- through experience and guile, may not appeal to the "modern" player...but they have a positive effect on the long-term bottom line -- and they make for interesting reading. I don't know the man, and I can't be sure if his achievements in poker are what he has reported them to be...but I have enjoyed his books...and have benefited from his advice -- in and out of the game. The fact that much of his advice has been proven wrong by the advancement of the math of the game doesn't concern me much...because I don't need the poker author to hold my hand throughout my gambling career. All I need is a little guidance and motivation at the start...and I can usually figure out the rest on my own.

The fact that something is more fun to write about doesn't mean it's the route to the winning player.

Indeed, more generally, the reason so many poker players lose is that they focus their efforts entirely on the "fun" parts of the game (making specific exploitative plays against specific players on the turn and river) and ignore the less "fun" parts (discipline, pre-flop play, bankroll management).

So he's doing his readers a disservice-- even if it is a disservice intended to make the column more readable.

[wiffleball whizz]

Originally Posted by proximity

see, I knew another pa member could come up with a better joke. not that I set the bar very high.

really, it could come down to that final big game on new year's eve.

being a poker winner, a total rewards diamond.... it could ALL be on the line.

I had a good week last week, but I have to put it in the rearview mirror and go back and fight my guts out again this week. I have got to focus.

sigh....

I'm putting it on the line myself.....not working Friday at 2am.....means I'll be gambling thur night

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

The fact that something is more fun to write about doesn't mean it's the route to the winning player.

Indeed, more generally, the reason so many poker players lose is that they focus their efforts entirely on the "fun" parts of the game (making specific exploitative plays against specific players on the turn and river) and ignore the less "fun" parts (discipline, pre-flop play, bankroll management).

So he's doing his readers a disservice-- even if it is a disservice intended to make the column more readable.

Is there even a single serious poker player out there who doesn't know the importance of discipline and bankroll management? Do you suppose that there are many players out there who are still confused about the pre-flop aspect of limit hold'em? What is there about discipline, bankroll management and pre-flop play that hasn't already been written about ad nauseam?

Here is what I think:

To know how to play a gambling game is one thing...but to go out and actually put this knowledge to proper use is something else entirely. Scores of players know how to play poker properly...and a great many of them are out there talking a great game on 2+2. I, myself, was talking a great game even as I was blowing $100K+ every year at the track...for more years than I care to admit. EVERYBODY who is serious about gambling knows how to play properly...but they can't sit down and play properly when they are put under pressure. Knowing what to do, and doing what you know, aren't the same thing.

Gamblers have accumulated enough knowledge; what they now need to do is acquire some wisdom to go along with it. All the poker players that I know are out there reading every single book that they can get their hands on, hoping to stumble on the latest poker strategy which promises to take them to the promised land...as if the accumulation of more knowledge is the pathway to ultimate gambling riches. It's a dead end...IMO. Gambling isn't really a game of "information"; it's mainly a game of self-discovery. The poker player's worst enemy is HIMSELF...but he knows very little about himself -- choosing instead to spend all his time studying the cards in his hand...or his opponents around him. And yet...the damage that others do to him pales in comparison to the damage that HE does to himself. WE are the ones who ultimately defeat ourselves...and we all know that. But we don't know enough about ourselves to ascertain what makes us tick...and why we do what we do.

"Know thyself", proclaimed the world's wisest man...who is reputed to have won many millions of drachmas in the illegal poker games of ancient Athens.

The morbidly obese man who wobbles down the street isn't in that state because he doesn't know how to lose weight. He is in that state because he doesn't know enough about himself to understand why he still overeats, in spite of his condition...and his better judgement.

[ReplayRandall]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

I, myself, was talking a great game even as I was blowing $100K+ every year at the track...for more years than I care to admit.

Thask, you didn't "blow" $100K a year and talked a great game. You were on the threshold of beating the races, but never quite getting over the hump, so to speak. I will venture to estimate that you put through the windows per year anywhere from $1.5 to $2 million a year. That made your $100K loss only a minus 5-7.5% loser to the vig. When you're betting that much and that often, it takes only one decent outlier to put you over the top. Anyone who can play everyday at that level, reducing the vig from 18% blended, down to 5% is one heck of a handicapper. Too bad you couldn't get today's rebates back in those high-rolling days of the past.........Been there, done that.....

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

Thask, you didn't "blow" $100K a year and talked a great game. You were on the threshold of beating the races, but never quite getting over the hump, so to speak. I will venture to estimate that you put through the windows per year anywhere from $1.5 to $2 million a year. That made your $100K loss only a minus 5-7.5% loser to the vig. When you're betting that much and that often, it takes only one decent outlier to put you over the top. Anyone who can play everyday at that level, reducing the vig from 18% blended, down to 5% is one heck of a handicapper. Too bad you couldn't get today's rebates back in those high-rolling days of the past.........Been there, done that.....

Yes, I agree...but that's not the point that I was trying to make. Dilanesp talked about those smart players on 2+2, who could destroy Roy Cooke in limit hold'em...and the point I was trying to make is that you can't tell what kind of poker player someone is by what comes out of his keyboard. TALKING a great game is much easier than PLAYING a great game...and no one knows this better than I.

[ReplayRandall]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

Yes, I agree...but that's not the point that I was trying to make. Dilanesp talked about those smart players on 2+2, who could destroy Roy Cooke in limit hold'em...and the point I was trying to make is that you can't tell what kind of poker player someone is by what comes out of his keyboard. TALKING a great game is much easier than PLAYING a great game...and no one knows this better than I.

2+2 may have "legit" unknown pokerstars and gamblers that post their talented exploits, but I find "holes" in many of their stories that deflate their authenticity. Therefore, I don't read 2+2 any longer, choosing to read a more honest site like PA. Don't get me wrong, as you've said yourself many times, anyone on this site can pose themselves to be whoever and whatever they fantasize to be. In the end, there are many more "real deal" horse players, gamblers and investors on this site, bar none..........Kudos to Mike for creating, cultivating and monitoring such a great website. He deserves what he earns...

[proximity]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

.... Gambling isn't really a game of "information"; it's mainly a game of self-discovery. The poker player's worst enemy is HIMSELF...but he knows very little about himself -- choosing instead to spend all his time studying the cards in his hand...or his opponents around him......

the heart of maybe the best post in paceadvantage history.

we know very little about ourselves.... and many times we're driven to gambling in the first place because we're afraid of what we might find out.

great post thaskalos.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by ReplayRandall

2+2 may have "legit" unknown pokerstars and gamblers that post their talented exploits, but I find "holes" in many of their stories that deflate their authenticity. Therefore, I don't read 2+2 any longer, choosing to read a more honest site like PA. Don't get me wrong, as you've said yourself many times, anyone on this site can pose themselves to be whoever and whatever they fantasize to be. In the end, there are many more "real deal" horse players, gamblers and investors on this site, bar none..........Kudos to Mike for creating, cultivating and monitoring such a great website. He deserves what he earns...

The people I was referring to played online, and their winrates were recorded by Table Ratings to the last dollar.

And I have seen some of them play.

[dilanesp]

Thas:

Come to Commerce Casino sometime and I will identify at least 25 full time players who know all about postflop strategy and lose or win less due to discipline, bankroll management, and preflop leaks.

So yes, players don't know that, partly because people with platforms like Roy Cooke don't say it.

[ReplayRandall]

Originally Posted by dilanesp

The people I was referring to played online, and their winrates were recorded by Table Ratings to the last dollar.

And I have seen some of them play.

Thanks for your explanation....BTW, were those winrates before the US online shutdown in 2011, or are they current?