Donald Trump

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by elysiantraveller

Again this is more absurdity... another deflection.

I don't care what the man spends his money on.

My point was when he says brash, stupid, and insensitive things people are making excuses for it, or try explain them away, even though he defends those brash, stupid, and insensitive things repeatedly after the fact.

He says brash, stupid and insensitive things...because he has nothing of SUBSTANCE to say. What is he SUPPOSED to talk about? Do you think it's a coincidence that the man has revealed absolutely nothing concrete about exactly HOW he intends to accomplish the things that he says he wants to get done?

He has no knowledge about foreign policy, and he has no idea how to turn our economy around...but he still wants the spotlight on himself during this critical stage of the campaign trail. So...he has decided to play the role of the angered and disgusted voter, who has had it with "politics as usual"...and is sick and tired of all the hypocrisy and the incompetence that pervades our ruling establishment today. He rants and raves without going into specifics...hoping that the controversial things that he says will resonate with the voting public...causing them to rally in his favor, without demanding precise details about how he expects to accomplish the tasks that he is promising to get done.

Up until now...all Trump has done is identify the problems...while giving only scant mention to the difficulty associated with implementing the simplistic "solutions" that he is proposing. When you are the new candidate seeking office...you can get pretty far by just pointing out the mistakes of the incumbent, while promising to "do better" yourself. But the campaign eventually gets down to the nitty-gritty...and you have to present a real plan of how you expect to get these things done...and that's when the rubber finally meets the road. After back-to-back failures as presidents, the public will be less likely to believe mere promises this time...and will pay more attention to the details that Trump is trying hard to avoid giving.

So far...all Trump has done is identify the problem...but that's the easy part. Diagnosing the disease is easy. The difficulty comes in treating...and eventually curing it. And the competence of the doctor is revealed in the treatment and the cure.

The public has gotten burned twice in a row...and isn't likely to get impressed by the "amateur" this time around. But the voting public has a difficult task to perform too in this upcoming election...because "amateurs" is the only thing that the menu is offering, yet again. And that's where Trump's keen business acumen has revealed itself, IMO. He saw from the outset that the competition was weak, and he threw his own hat in the ring...counting on his brashness, and his name recognition. "In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is King"...and all that...

It's sad when you really think about it. In an election held in the world's most powerful country...you would think that the voters would be given a better caliber of candidates to choose from.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by lamboguy

the bottom line here is that the only one that really knows is THE SHADOW!

I would have given 100-1 against Trump winning the nomination and about 250-1 against him winning it all a few months ago. I was joking about giving way longer odds than that. Right now he can't be considered much of an underdog against either Rubio or Cruz. He's crushing in practically every state other than Iowa and Iowa is not considered an indication of anything. All kinds of longshots and non serious candidates win in Iowa. I'm sure the media will do all they can to spin a Cruz win there as a major upset and the end for Trump, but I'm not so sure how successful that's going to be.

[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

If Trump is the nominee and republicans are forced to choose between an insensitive big mouth that's going to be tougher on immigration, tougher on government spending, more pro business, and stronger on defense and security vs. another 8 years of Obama, Trump is going to get 95% of the people that normally vote for republicans.

Completely ignoring your erroneous conclusions (Govt Spending? have you seen his tax plan?)...

A lot will sit it out.

The "establishment" that everyone (not saying you) is so actively sabotaging will not turn out and it will be a drubbing.

[TJDave]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

The public has gotten burned twice in a row.

No. We've had back-to-back two term presidents. The public knew what it was doing.

[onefast99]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

I would have given 100-1 against Trump winning the nomination and about 250-1 against him winning it all a few months ago. I was joking about giving way longer odds than that. Right now he can't be considered much of an underdog against either Rubio or Cruz. He's crushing in practically every state other than Iowa and Iowa is not considered an indication of anything. All kinds of longshots and non serious candidates win in Iowa. I'm sure the media will do all they can to spin a Cruz win there as a major upset and the end for Trump, but I'm not so sure how successful that's going to be.

Poll just out shows Cruz and Trump neck and neck in Iowa. New national poll shows Trump pulling away. Cruz can use all the reverse psychology he wants he isn't someone I would like to see run the country.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by TJDave

No. We've had back-to-back two term presidents. The public knew what it was doing.

What is a voter who "knows what he/she is doing", supposed to do in THIS election? What do you do...when you are not offered what you WANT?

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by elysiantraveller

Completely ignoring your erroneous conclusions (Govt Spending? have you seen his tax plan?)...

A lot will sit it out.

The "establishment" that everyone (not saying you) is so actively sabotaging will not turn out and it will be a drubbing.

Have you watched any of his recent appearances?

He's filling stadiums.

We aren't at the stage where anyone is giving serious and detailed plans that could actually pass. We are at the stage where people are expressing their general views on taxes, spending, immigration, defense, trade, religious issues, entitlements, health care etc... to republicans so they can get the nomination. When this process gets down to Trump, Cruz, Rubio (or whoever) and the stage is down to 2 or 3 people, each will have more time to talk and they'll have to get more serious.

I've seen one serious plan from anyone. It was a Bush plan and I think I threw up in my mouth.

[TJDave]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

What is a voter who "knows what he/she is doing", supposed to do in THIS election? What do you do...when you are not offered what you WANT?

There are plenty of choices. Are you suggesting there is no candidate, of either party, that you could support?

[woodtoo]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

What is a voter who "knows what he/she is doing", supposed to do in THIS election? What do you do...when you are not offered what you WANT?

You can't always get what you want. But if you try sometime, you just might find. You get what you need.

And what you just might need is Trump.

[Tom]

If you can't understand why much of what he says is wrong,
there really is no point in discussing the issue much further.

On the other hand, what everyone else is DOING is wrong.
Everything our worthless government does is wrong, so why let someone new do some wrong things? Maybe his wrong things won't be as bad the current wrong things.

What have we got to lose?
We survived (barely) Obama.

You only go around once in life, grab for all the GUSTO you can get.

TRUMP....He's got GUSTO!

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by TJDave

There are plenty of choices. Are you suggesting there is no candidate, of either party, that you could support?

Sure...there are plenty of choices out there. Put Trump and Hillary on the final ballot...and a voter has to be CRAZY to complain that he/she finds no suitable presidential choice.

[raybo]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

He says brash, stupid and insensitive things...because he has nothing of SUBSTANCE to say. What is he SUPPOSED to talk about? Do you think it's a coincidence that the man has revealed absolutely nothing concrete about exactly HOW he intends to accomplish the things that he says he wants to get done?

He has no knowledge about foreign policy, and he has no idea how to turn our economy around...but he still wants the spotlight on himself during this critical stage of the campaign trail. So...he has decided to play the role of the angered and disgusted voter, who has had it with "politics as usual"...and is sick and tired of all the hypocrisy and the incompetence that pervades our ruling establishment today. He rants and raves without going into specifics...hoping that the controversial things that he says will resonate with the voting public...causing them to rally in his favor, without demanding precise details about how he expects to accomplish the tasks that he is promising to get done.

Up until now...all Trump has done is identify the problems...while giving only scant mention to the difficulty associated with implementing the simplistic "solutions" that he is proposing. When you are the new candidate seeking office...you can get pretty far by just pointing out the mistakes of the incumbent, while promising to "do better" yourself. But the campaign eventually gets down to the nitty-gritty...and you have to present a real plan of how you expect to get these things done...and that's when the rubber finally meets the road. After back-to-back failures as presidents, the public will be less likely to believe mere promises this time...and will pay more attention to the details that Trump is trying hard to avoid giving.

So far...all Trump has done is identify the problem...but that's the easy part. Diagnosing the disease is easy. The difficulty comes in treating...and eventually curing it. And the competence of the doctor is revealed in the treatment and the cure.

The public has gotten burned twice in a row...and isn't likely to get impressed by the "amateur" this time around. But the voting public has a difficult task to perform too in this upcoming election...because "amateurs" is the only thing that the menu is offering, yet again. And that's where Trump's keen business acumen has revealed itself, IMO. He saw from the outset that the competition was weak, and he threw his own hat in the ring...counting on his brashness, and his name recognition. "In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is King"...and all that...

It's sad when you really think about it. In an election held in the world's most powerful country...you would think that the voters would be given a better caliber of candidates to choose from.

Well said Gus!

[classhandicapper]

I'm still seeing a scenario where Trump, Cruz, and Rubio are the top 3 and when/if Trump starts slipping he throws his support to Cruz.

1. Cruz has been very careful not to go negative on Trump

2. Trump likes Cruz and seemed very open to making him the VP, a supreme court nominee, or being given another major role while in Iowa the other day.

3. They are splitting the conservative base now

If Trump starts slipping (like Carson for instance), he won't embarrass himself. He'll drop out and throw his support to Cruz. Cruz will get a LOT of the current Trump vote and be very well positioned.

[zico20]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

He says brash, stupid and insensitive things...because he has nothing of SUBSTANCE to say. What is he SUPPOSED to talk about? Do you think it's a coincidence that the man has revealed absolutely nothing concrete about exactly HOW he intends to accomplish the things that he says he wants to get done?

He has no knowledge about foreign policy, and he has no idea how to turn our economy around...but he still wants the spotlight on himself during this critical stage of the campaign trail. So...he has decided to play the role of the angered and disgusted voter, who has had it with "politics as usual"...and is sick and tired of all the hypocrisy and the incompetence that pervades our ruling establishment today. He rants and raves without going into specifics...hoping that the controversial things that he says will resonate with the voting public...causing them to rally in his favor, without demanding precise details about how he expects to accomplish the tasks that he is promising to get done.

Up until now...all Trump has done is identify the problems...while giving only scant mention to the difficulty associated with implementing the simplistic "solutions" that he is proposing. When you are the new candidate seeking office...you can get pretty far by just pointing out the mistakes of the incumbent, while promising to "do better" yourself. But the campaign eventually gets down to the nitty-gritty...and you have to present a real plan of how you expect to get these things done...and that's when the rubber finally meets the road. After back-to-back failures as presidents, the public will be less likely to believe mere promises this time...and will pay more attention to the details that Trump is trying hard to avoid giving.

So far...all Trump has done is identify the problem...but that's the easy part. Diagnosing the disease is easy. The difficulty comes in treating...and eventually curing it. And the competence of the doctor is revealed in the treatment and the cure.

The public has gotten burned twice in a row...and isn't likely to get impressed by the "amateur" this time around. But the voting public has a difficult task to perform too in this upcoming election...because "amateurs" is the only thing that the menu is offering, yet again. And that's where Trump's keen business acumen has revealed itself, IMO. He saw from the outset that the competition was weak, and he threw his own hat in the ring...counting on his brashness, and his name recognition. "In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is King"...and all that...

It's sad when you really think about it. In an election held in the world's most powerful country...you would think that the voters would be given a better caliber of candidates to choose from.

I like your post Thas, however, there is no indication that the public will change tunes this time around. Remember, the voting public is overall very stupid and misinformed. Obama railed on McCain that another four years would be like Bush having another four years. Trump will play the same card with Hillary.

Trump is just going to play the same game Obama did and hope it works again. One more Muslim terrorist attack will sink Hillary and give Trump the presidency if he is the nominee.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

Sure...there are plenty of choices out there. Put Trump and Hillary on the final ballot...and a voter has to be CRAZY to complain that he/she finds no suitable presidential choice.

Count me as crazy. That's no choice.

If I literally had a gun to my head I would pull the level for Clinton, but I'd expect God to send me to hell for being so unprincipled and weak. She is an incompetent lying corrupt sleazeball that will do or say anything for money and power. She'd sell the country down a shithole for a dollar.

If Trump is the alternative to her, it's going to depend on my mood and how he behaves over the next year. I'll probably vote for the libertarian.