Hey Yonkers

[slammer895]

The inside pp bias at Yonkers is crazy. ML 12-1's get bet down to 8/5 and win. Here is a suggestion. Bring back Post Draw at Post Time like they experimented with at the old Freestate Raceway.
Wagering would close at post time and then they would have a ping pong ball lottery to determine pp's.

[pandy]

Not a bad idea. As John Campbell said in that recent interview at the Jug (which is online via USTA), the half mile tracks should try different things instead of the same old...

[mrroyboy]

Well I generally agree with all you are saying but I think it's a matter of handicappers knowing the tracks. Half mile tracks like Yonkers are different than 5/8 tracks etc. Just part of the game.

[pandy]

Originally Posted by mrroyboy

Well I generally agree with all you are saying but I think it's a matter of handicappers knowing the tracks. Half mile tracks like Yonkers are different than 5/8 tracks etc. Just part of the game.

From a business standpoint, they should make changes because the highest tracks for handle are all one mile or 7/8 tracks, Balmoral, Cal Expo, Meadowlands, Mohawk, and Woodbine.

[mrroyboy]

I agree.

[wiffleball whizz]

The 12/1s that are bet down to 8/5 are the ml maker getting cute.....guy been around yr fur 30 years........right or wrong pandy.....? Drucker gets cute

[pandy]

Well, most of the time when a 12-1 goes off at 8-5 it is a bad line but it is not intentional.

[wiffleball whizz]

Originally Posted by pandy

Well, most of the time when a 12-1 goes off at 8-5 it is a bad line but it is not intentional.

Really pandy?!?!? 8,7,6,8,8,7 and dropping with first time sears and Gil Garcia Herrera and 12/1ml

[pandy]

Originally Posted by wiffleball whizz

Really pandy?!?!? 8,7,6,8,8,7 and dropping with first time sears and Gil Garcia Herrera and 12/1ml

Sometimes the guy who makes the line is actually making the line using entries or early proofs of past performances.

[slammer895]

Yesterday 4 horse won. 10-1 ML Went off at 7-5.

[pandy]

Originally Posted by slammer895

Yesterday 4 horse won. 10-1 ML Went off at 7-5.

This is the reason why you shouldn't pay too much attention to morning lines.

[mrroyboy]

Anything with Sears or Brennan and Herrera that is 10-1 on the morning line means the line maker is on ACID.

[Just a Fan]

Originally Posted by slammer895

The inside pp bias at Yonkers is crazy. ML 12-1's get bet down to 8/5 and win. Here is a suggestion. Bring back Post Draw at Post Time like they experimented with at the old Freestate Raceway.
Wagering would close at post time and then they would have a ping pong ball lottery to determine pp's.

Originally Posted by pandy

Not a bad idea. As John Campbell said in that recent interview at the Jug (which is online via USTA), the half mile tracks should try different things instead of the same old...

I remember the Post Draw at Post Time (I thought it was Rosecroft, but you could be right). It didn't last long, and I have to assume that's because the handle plummeted. I assume people didn't like betting on something when they didn't have all the info that they were accustomed to having.

In a way Campbell is right that tracks have to be willing to try different things. The problem is that (IMO) horseplayers in general really, really dislike change, even when the change is designed to make races more competitive. For example, YR has tried the 1 1/16 races several times, which make all the sense in the world in terms of making the races more interesting. But I think many fans are turned off trying to look at the final times and last 5/16 times, and trying to understand how they correlate to the traditional mile times and last 1/4's.

Or from the TB world, racing on synthetic surfaces, which often remove some of the track biases that can make the racing too predictable... you would think handicappers were being asked to bet on an entirely different breed of animal, the way people cry and moan about how synthetics are different from dirt. There's nothing "wrong" with racing on synthetic tracks, it just has its own nuances, and the most successful players pick up on those trends and use them to their advantage, while everybody else just whines about how things aren't how they used to be, and how such-and-such never would have lost if the race was on dirt.

When horse racing becomes too predictable, it becomes less appealing to bet, because its hard for any horseplayer to build some sort of an edge over the pool of other bettors. I think that's what has happened to harness racing, particularly on a half mile track.

[Sea Biscuit]

Originally Posted by slammer895

The inside pp bias at Yonkers is crazy. ML 12-1's get bet down to 8/5 and win. Here is a suggestion. Bring back Post Draw at Post Time like they experimented with at the old Freestate Raceway.
Wagering would close at post time and then they would have a ping pong ball lottery to determine pp's.

The bias would end if they introduce the Madison gate back into action at all 1/2 mile tracks

[slammer895]

Originally Posted by Just a Fan

I remember the Post Draw at Post Time (I thought it was Rosecroft, but you could be right). It didn't last long, and I have to assume that's because the handle plummeted. I assume people didn't like betting on something when they didn't have all the info that they were accustomed to having.

In a way Campbell is right that tracks have to be willing to try different things. The problem is that (IMO) horseplayers in general really, really dislike change, even when the change is designed to make races more competitive. For example, YR has tried the 1 1/16 races several times, which make all the sense in the world in terms of making the races more interesting. But I think many fans are turned off trying to look at the final times and last 5/16 times, and trying to understand how they correlate to the traditional mile times and last 1/4's.

Or from the TB world, racing on synthetic surfaces, which often remove some of the track biases that can make the racing too predictable... you would think handicappers were being asked to bet on an entirely different breed of animal, the way people cry and moan about how synthetics are different from dirt. There's nothing "wrong" with racing on synthetic tracks, it just has its own nuances, and the most successful players pick up on those trends and use them to their advantage, while everybody else just whines about how things aren't how they used to be, and how such-and-such never would have lost if the race was on dirt.

When horse racing becomes too predictable, it becomes less appealing to bet, because its hard for any horseplayer to build some sort of an edge over the pool of other bettors. I think that's what has happened to harness racing, particularly on a half mile track.

It was definitely Freestate (formerly Laurel Raceway). They tried it for up to six races on a card but never on open, invitational or stakes races. The reason it stopped was because it shutdown to become a CarMax. Rosecroft expanded from a 1/2 mile track to a 5/8. They also built it into a Eurotrack with banked turns and I think was one of the first tacks to use pylons. Freestate and Rosecroft had some cool stakes races. The Potomac, Terrapin, Senatorial and Presidential.