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Old 03-04-2020, 02:35 AM   #76
mmmjjjj
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thaskalos View Post
If you used your simulation program as a betting tool, and looked for overlays to wager on...how many qualified plays would you find per day? What would your betting results be?
Thas everyday is different
8-10 plays come up regularly
And on busy days more

Sometimes the simulation plays are real
And sometimes I use them to find value on
Other contenders


The betting game and the handicapping game are two different
Animals.

U have to be extremely patient and disciplined to succeed

But the betting results from my end have
Been very positive for a long time( even though
A lot of people will
Make those claims). Guess u have to use ur instinct
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Old 03-04-2020, 12:26 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by mmmjjjj View Post
So we live in a world where these horses were priced this high

7– bourbon honey— 10-1– I got him 4-1
4– double revs edge—10-1— got him 4-1
8– too short—- 10-1 Got him—- 5-2

If I was using your lines, these would have been the results.

Bourbon Honey went off at 7-2, no bet.
Double D's Revenge went off at 3-1, no bet
Too Short went off 9-2, bet, lost

Forget contests for a minute. Where is the value in this in a parimutuel system like most of us are playing? The vast majority of us can identify bad morning lines. It is easy. That is why they are bad and the horses don't go off near those prices.

I'm generally curious, not trying to be a jerk here. (Unless you keep addressing me by my first name again like we're long lost buddies or something, then we'll go another route. ) It doesn't matter what the results were really, one day and a few bets doesn't mean squat. I'm more interested in how this helps anyone.

Last edited by cj; 03-04-2020 at 12:28 PM.
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Old 03-04-2020, 02:07 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cj View Post
If I was using your lines, these would have been the results.

Bourbon Honey went off at 7-2, no bet.
Double D's Revenge went off at 3-1, no bet
Too Short went off 9-2, bet, lost

Forget contests for a minute. Where is the value in this in a parimutuel system like most of us are playing? The vast majority of us can identify bad morning lines. It is easy. That is why they are bad and the horses don't go off near those prices.

I'm generally curious, not trying to be a jerk here. (Unless you keep addressing me by my first name again like we're long lost buddies or something, then we'll go another route. ) It doesn't matter what the results were really, one day and a few bets doesn't mean squat. I'm more interested in how this helps anyone.
I'm not sure how you know these are "bets". He didn't say you should bet or not bet them depending on whether they are higher than his estimated line---he's just giving us projected odds and telling us we have to figure it out (see the logic in posts 36, 37, and 44). So basically, nothing of use.
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Old 03-04-2020, 02:34 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by castaway01 View Post
I'm not sure how you know these are "bets". He didn't say you should bet or not bet them depending on whether they are higher than his estimated line---he's just giving us projected odds and telling us we have to figure it out (see the logic in posts 36, 37, and 44). So basically, nothing of use.
That is why I said "If I was using..."

He sets what the price should be according to him, then I just figured don't bet underlays and do bet overlays.
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Old 03-04-2020, 02:37 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by castaway01 View Post
I'm not sure how you know these are "bets". He didn't say you should bet or not bet them depending on whether they are higher than his estimated line---he's just giving us projected odds and telling us we have to figure it out (see the logic in posts 36, 37, and 44). So basically, nothing of use.
ok replay


CJ -- forgive me didn't know that me calling u by your first name was such an insult ,
even though its been posted on a million websites

how it helps ??

ok info first

1--- you have to stop assuming that every viewer that comes on here has ur insight and your experience

2--- if it so easy to identify bad lines and attach prices to them
why are none of u supposedly real players putting them out here and helping the others.

3---- the prices( my line) i put up are the highest the horses should ever be according to my sims(simulations)
doesn' t mean i will not take a lower price if need be on race day (because i know the real value ).
again don't mean to sound harsh but are you going to give out your exact lines to viewers everyday
if we do live in this parimutuel system world

4---i got 6-1 on (doubles d's revenge )yesterday . for the purpose of the viewers and getting their edge i will
not have to explain this one. hint -- where do you go and get early prices if u have an edge such as this

5--- yes one day does squat but i have more than 400,000 races behind me with positive returns so that statement
holds no value

6-- why forget the contests , there are players who make a good living just playing them so why ignore
these players

7----why have we taken the stand of , well we all know they are bad lines so we deal with it . why???
question -- you make figs and if they were off by ten points on major contenders day in day out
would anyone purchase your product ??

ok how it becomes of extreme value in my opinion

1--i put up a line -- assuming it is a true line and i am correct close to it

what do you do ??

you re write the race with the percentages that is left and assign the other contenders new odds parameters

eg - my line 3-1 that is 20 percent take( all in track take an everything) give or take a few percentages . so now you are left with 80 percent to be divided
by your other contenders . assign them odds according to your interpertation of how u view the race

2- you do a race\(from ur analysis) and both of your contenders are sitting at 4-1 each . on my lines one or ur contenders is 8-5
and your trying to cut down on money when playing a pick 3,4,5,6. don't u just throw him out knowing in advance that my sims are correct .

3--- i get u to look into the future for the horizontals so you the player could save lots of money( very helpful especially on big racing days ). never mind the fact that it is extremely
difficult to get the race results correct .

4- you could easily make a second income using point #4 above by using advanced methods to get 500 to 600 monthly
( now that may not seem much to you but for alot of players it is )

5- i get u o re-evaluate your analysis from where u sit and ask, how is this lunatic saying that
this specific horse is going to be no higher than 4-1, when from where i sit he looks long 8-1 or so.

6- i provide a mirror for truths that certain individuals may not have access to
( now if u are a pro ) and u know who u are , this is probably of no value to you, except to say
please stop putting this info out there!!!!!!!


7-- yes some big prices are easy to spot but what about horses that are closely matched in odds but one has a distinct advantage over the others
what do you do then??

8--- get u to see horses that are high in m-lines that apparently will go
favourties and get u the player to analyze way ahead of time with a cool head. is this really a favourtie here/??
because we all know how emotional this game can be


anyway that is it
depending on where u sit there will be value to what i am saying

and if u cant see it then well what can i say
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Old 03-04-2020, 02:44 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmmjjjj View Post

CJ -- forgive me didn't know that me calling u by your first name was such an insult ,
even though its been posted on a million websites

how it helps ??
Not insulted, just feels weird when the other person in anonymous. I can't even explain why, just felt very odd.

I'll read the rest a bit later, heading out the door.
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Old 03-04-2020, 03:16 PM   #82
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march 04

had a friend going to turf paradise today so did the sims and
here is what i found

(castaway) so sorry you feel there is nothing of value here
no problem( you have it all figured out )



turf paradise

race 3-- doc curlin is (5-2) ml but should be real strong chalk here !!!
3-5 my line
even though there are 3 contenders opposing him that on paper appear formidable

on the sims he is clear choice and not too obvious on paper
so this is what the linesmaker should be telling you

race 4-- diachi (3-1) made him the ml fav here but everyone should know
that its impossible for him to be in the top 2 choices , so his price is going north here

#1 and #9 will assume the role of he two chalks



race 5---#6 (2-1) so he is basically saying that he has a 25 percent chance of winning . but how can this be if there is so much opposition coming from my arrows . the line has to go north here and big time so u will get lucky to see
5-1
why because #1 #2 #5 all have to draw money and the #4 even though he hasn' t tried turf is going major chalk !!!

race7

the lines on the first 4 contenders are much more even keeled than
the ml suggests

it is the seperation of contenders that is the real key in racing and here
is where it is put on display

even though the #6 will probably take role of favoruitism

#1 #4 #7 all are drawing 7-2 value here ( 16 percent take)

so basicallly from where i sit there is no true seperation so it may be a race
to not get involved in even if from where u sit u may think there is a bigger
edge on your figs


race 8

#4 (2-1) ml is going super chalk here as my sims got him (1-1)

but is he ?? well that is an entirely different question

thats it gl
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Old 03-05-2020, 12:02 AM   #83
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One question, what bets were made at Turf?
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Old 03-05-2020, 12:23 AM   #84
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One question, what bets were made at Turf?
Jay what is your real question??
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Old 03-05-2020, 12:30 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by mmmjjjj View Post
Jay what is your real question??
What bets were made?
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Old 03-05-2020, 12:35 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by jay68802 View Post
What bets were made?
Why is that important
Do u want to know if I won today
Or out of the horses I listed do u want to know
If I bet any
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Old 03-05-2020, 12:48 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by mmmjjjj View Post
Why is that important
Do u want to know if I won today
Or out of the horses I listed do u want to know
If I bet any
It is important because this is a betting game. And yes, what bets you made, if any.

And don't be afraid, I can garentee you that I have posted more losing bets here than you have.
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Old 03-05-2020, 01:08 AM   #88
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Originally Posted by jay68802 View Post
It is important because this is a betting game. And yes, what bets you made, if any.

And don't be afraid, I can garentee you that I have posted more losing bets here than you have.
Jay I get it and there is no fear
Don’t take this the wrong way but whatever
I say next will be taken out of context
If I put up my real bets people will say “ya ok buddy “ nice try
If I say nothing people will say see “he is a fake”

Doesn’t really matter what I did what matters is did u
Get enough insight to make it work for u.

Please reread post #80 once again and u will
Figure it out


It’s really quite simple
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Old 03-05-2020, 01:53 AM   #89
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I read one of your posts.

On Monday at Parx in the 8th you had the as a overlay. The horse flagged for me also. Not from the morning line, but because he had some of the best figures in the race. Did I like the odds he went off as? No, but i still bet him.

“ya ok buddy “ nice try.
“he is a fake”.

Most of the people here do not care about this. We are handicappers trying to learn something. All you end up doing is adding to the forumn wih your picks.

I have great interest in what you are doing. But untill you apply what you are doing before a race, and say what you are betting before a race, why should I take you far as anything but "a fake"?

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Old 03-05-2020, 10:26 AM   #90
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If the guy has an uncanny ability to point out morning line discrepancies then that IS your betting advantage.
Figure out if you can strategize a play on what you do like given this information in advance. Some people can play exchanges, others cannot.

The other day mmmjjj pointed out 8-1 ML horse should be 8-5 and went favored at 9-5.
If you really liked the horse and were going to sit on your hands and wait for 8-1 .... then you snoozed past two nice horizontal plays.
The DD paid $44 for 5-2 with 9-5 .....
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