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07-14-2020, 04:15 PM
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#46
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,733
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i just wonder if anyone here has ever bet the break or cancelled after the start of the race.
its impossible to do on the adw's we have now from your home.
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07-14-2020, 04:46 PM
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#47
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Central New Jersey
Posts: 1,467
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lamboguy
i just wonder if anyone here has ever bet the break or cancelled after the start of the race.
its impossible to do on the adw's we have now from your home.
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Yup, I witnessed a very late win bet cancellation at Freehold for Aqueduct track back in 1998 or maybe 1999. The guy was watching the race and saw his horse was not showing early speed and handed his ticket to the teller just before the 1/2 mile call (about 40 seconds into the race) and said "Cancel this". It was a $100 win ticket. It got done. I saw it happen the next day too (with the same teller). A friend told me they were allowed to cancel bets very late at Aqueduct (not many people knew about this) and hence it was similar to past posting, but technically not.
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07-14-2020, 04:49 PM
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#48
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clean money
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 23,558
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lamboguy
i just wonder if anyone here has ever bet the break or cancelled after the start of the race.
its impossible to do on the adw's we have now from your home.
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yea, I have maybe a 1,000? 'shut-outs' on late attempts and zero known successful cases.
Even worse when the feed is a slight delay to begin with.
I've read different things about a cancel-delay (on track) for tellers to correct mistakes.
I don't know whether that still exists.
If it does currently exist, it seems pretty logical that those with direct tote batch access are exploiting this to the best of their ability, and the fullest passable extent, unless it happens to be specifically blocked-out from those tote feeds in those cases.
beyond past posting
'last posting' has several obvious benefits
__________________
Preparation. Discipline. Patience. Decisiveness.
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07-14-2020, 05:05 PM
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#49
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Thornhill ON
Posts: 466
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Toronto OTB's
Several closed down due not having the adequate funds at the end of the day.
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07-14-2020, 05:07 PM
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#50
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queens, NY
Posts: 20,602
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lamboguy
i just wonder if anyone here has ever bet the break or cancelled after the start of the race.
its impossible to do on the adw's we have now from your home.
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I have, but I don't believe the money went into the public pools. It was not a major ADW.
It was about 10? years ago. I was betting using a new off shore site and had a bet queued up. I got distracted and missed the break. In frustration I hit the enter button anyway. To my shock the bet was accepted.
The next race I tried to duplicate it and it worked again.
After a few more attempts, I realized I had about 4-5 seconds after the break to get bets in. That gave me enough time to make sure my horse broke well and got the desired position before actually making the bet.
I'm an honest guy. I sent a note to the site telling them they had a flaw in their software that allowed me to past post and suggested they better fix it. It turned out, they had a person watching the satellite feed manually pressing the "close race" button.
I was getting a much better satellite feed in my location than they were getting in theirs (I guess a latency issue). They were closing the races after they had already started. They thanked me, returned the losing wagers I made when I was testing it, and automated the process a few days later.
Cheating shouldn't be able to happen because bets are time stamped, but I suppose anything is possible with hackers.
__________________
"Unlearning is the highest form of learning"
Last edited by classhandicapper; 07-14-2020 at 05:12 PM.
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07-14-2020, 05:33 PM
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#51
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,733
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when Lou Smith owned Rockingham Park, he gave the break bettors 8 seconds to punch $50 tickets. there was a group called the speed boys that came up there every summer to play the break.
the speed boys were in Maryland as well.
around 1996 there were at least 50 people sitting in Suffolk Downs betting simulcast on the break in places like Maryland, Kentucky and New York tracks. eventually the pools were shut down 2 minutes before the race even started for anyone that bet at Suffolk.
the only places that have past posting that i know of are Dover, Harrington, and The Red Mile. Dover and Harrington only have it for their own track. The Red Mile had or still has it for other harness tracks. but those places have or had very limited time to bet after the break.
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07-14-2020, 07:10 PM
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#52
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Flint Hills
Posts: 474
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Odds are a big consideration in my play. I have victimized by this gripe a lot of times. It makes me so mad I'm ready to challenge someone to a duel.
But then comes the next race, requiring a clear mind, and I move on.
Nothing I can do about it except try again.
__________________
"Better to do little well than more poorly." Appy
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07-14-2020, 07:20 PM
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#53
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,733
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Appy
Odds are a big consideration in my play. I have victimized by this gripe a lot of times. It makes me so mad I'm ready to challenge someone to a duel.
But then comes the next race, requiring a clear mind, and I move on.
Nothing I can do about it except try again.
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if you are good at making odds and you see the horse you like is 4-1 in the gate, some computer is going to see that and come in and lower the price of your horse. it will happen most of the time. if the horse is overbet in the gate, chances are the price of the horse you want will go up.
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07-15-2020, 07:25 AM
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#54
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1,725
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage
No it won't. It will be exactly the same...except it will be much easier for them to get bets in at the last second.
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The odds will never change during the race, if the betting is closed two minutes before the gates open. That will end all of the fixed race nonsense.
If the horse drops from 7-1 to 5/2 in the two minute window, so be it. The perception that the bet was made when the horse got to the lead and his odds dropped is gone.
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07-15-2020, 01:52 PM
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#55
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NJ
Posts: 3,821
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Interesting note on very, very late money from today's 2nd at Delaware. In the 2nd the was 3-1 with the field in the gate, then went up to 9-2 during the race after getting squeezed at the start and being many lengths back, then won closing like a shot down the lane when the 60-1 shot on the lead tired. The who closed just behind the went from 7-2 in the gate to 2-1 by the end of the race.
So, probably means nothing, but interesting if you think people can cancel bets after a bad break, as I've heard some hear say is possible. If they did today, it came back to haunt them.
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07-15-2020, 11:18 PM
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#57
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 487
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sea Hero
Past posting
I've been watching this happen for three weeks.
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LOL - no, you haven't.
(I didn't waste time reading the rest)
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07-15-2020, 11:29 PM
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#58
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 313
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJC922
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Be careful what you wish for. Without proper regulation any winners will be barred from fixed odds, and it will just be a product that takes losing money out of the parimutuel pools, reducing the chances of winning their too.
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07-15-2020, 11:54 PM
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#59
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,733
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iamt
Be careful what you wish for. Without proper regulation any winners will be barred from fixed odds, and it will just be a product that takes losing money out of the parimutuel pools, reducing the chances of winning their too.
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good point there. in the old days in Nevada, try banging out the racebooks on first time starters and you would have had a very short welcome.
the system today is great with pari-mutuel. you can sit at home and bet as many tracks as you want. the adw distributes your money to the various tracks and pays you. they don't limit you on the amounts you want to win either.
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07-16-2020, 02:39 AM
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#60
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PA Steward
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,501
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metro
Just how much is there to gain in those last moments before the polls close? Enough to risk all that time and effort building probably thousands of dollars worth of wagers?
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Tons.
Yes.
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