Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board

Go Back   Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board > Thoroughbred Horse Racing Discussion > General Racing Discussion


Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old 11-07-2011, 09:49 PM   #1
jelly
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 832
All-sources average daily handle declines $566,715 a day at So. California

Daily handle down $566,715 a day from last year in So California.


According to figures released after racing each day, the meeting had an ontrack average attendance of 6,805. Ontrack average handle was $1,322,702 while all-sources handle averaged $6,631,285.

The 2010 Oak Tree at Hollywood Park meeting had an all-sources average daily handle of $7,198,000, according to limited data released by Oak Tree after that meeting


http://www.drf.com/news/santa-anita-...es-meet-strong
jelly is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 12:04 AM   #2
Some_One
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 1,911
Guess it wasn't the polytrack.
Some_One is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 12:09 AM   #3
PaceAdvantage
PA Steward
 
PaceAdvantage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,183
When did the boycott start?
PaceAdvantage is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 05:12 AM   #4
Jeff P
Registered User
 
Jeff P's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: JCapper Platinum: Kind of like Deep Blue... but for horses.
Posts: 5,258
Cal Racing handle took a direct hit coinciding with announcement of the bill.

Code:
Exacta Takeout:

AQU-BEL-SAR:     18.50%

CDX-KEE:         19.00%

GPX:             20.00%

DMR-HOL-GGX-SAX: 22.68%

Exacta takeout in California isn't just 22.68%.

It's 22.6 percent HIGHER than NYRA's exacta takeout - and absurdly out of line given quality of product relative to other major tracks.

When handle is analyzed by wager type the negative effect of the takeout increase is glaring. The number of races in California where the exacta pool is $100k vs. the number of races at other major tracks where the exacta pool is $200k, $300k, and $400k tells a story that can be summed up in 3 words:

Bettors aren't stupid.

The reality of those 3 words is starting to dawn on a lot of people in the industry in California - who have recently changed their minds about the takeout increase - and who are now (quietly behind the scenes) calling for a takeout reduction.


-jp

.
__________________
Team JCapper: 2011 PAIHL Regular Season ROI Leader after 15 weeks
www.JCapper.com

Last edited by Jeff P; 11-08-2011 at 05:13 AM.
Jeff P is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 05:24 AM   #5
Robert Goren
Racing Form Detective
 
Robert Goren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lincoln, Ne but my heart is at Santa Anita
Posts: 16,316
So much for the theory that higher takeout means higher purses means fuller fields means higher handle.
__________________
Some day in the not too distant future, horse players will betting on computer generated races over the net. Race tracks will become casinos and shopping centers. And some crooner will be belting out "there used to be a race track here".
Robert Goren is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 06:58 AM   #6
mannyberrios
easygoer
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 976
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Goren
So much for the theory that higher takeout means higher purses means fuller fields means higher handle.
Higher takeout means more fun at the track!
mannyberrios is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 10:14 AM   #7
andymays
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,908
Quote:
Originally Posted by mannyberrios
Higher takeout means more fun at the track!
http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-raci...rackpool-urges

Excerpt:

While the recession leveled major blows to racing’s welfare, Brackpool noted that it also provided needed impetus for change.

“Five, six years ago, the industry was in complete denial,” he said. “Structural change was needed. Last year was the first time people came up to me and said, ‘This thing is broken’—which is good. People realize now change is needed.”

He believes a new law signed by Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger may help kick start racing’s reinvention. The bill, which goes into effect Jan. 1, increases takeout on exotic wagers and clears the way for exchange wagering, or head-to-head betting, in 2012 after CHRB creates rules to regulate that form of betting.

“We offer in California the premier racing product on a year-round basis,” he said, “but we were offering our first-class product at a discount price. We’re changing the pricing model. We left win-place-show where it is. But we came up with a solution that will produce $30 million more a year. That’s a 25-to-30% increase in overnight purses.
andymays is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 10:16 AM   #8
andymays
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,908
The figures reported are all mixed up and they don't make much sense. They didn't have a good meet no matter what anyone says.

Last edited by andymays; 11-08-2011 at 10:21 AM.
andymays is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 10:45 AM   #9
jelly
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 832
Quote:
Originally Posted by andymays
http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-raci...rackpool-urges

Excerpt:

While the recession leveled major blows to racing’s welfare, Brackpool noted that it also provided needed impetus for change.

“Five, six years ago, the industry was in complete denial,” he said. “Structural change was needed. Last year was the first time people came up to me and said, ‘This thing is broken’—which is good. People realize now change is needed.”

He believes a new law signed by Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger may help kick start racing’s reinvention. The bill, which goes into effect Jan. 1, increases takeout on exotic wagers and clears the way for exchange wagering, or head-to-head betting, in 2012 after CHRB creates rules to regulate that form of betting.

“We offer in California the premier racing product on a year-round basis,” he said, “but we were offering our first-class product at a discount price. We’re changing the pricing model. We left win-place-show where it is. But we came up with a solution that will produce $30 million more a year. That’s a 25-to-30% increase in overnight purses.



These quotes are just amazing!
jelly is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 10:51 AM   #10
andymays
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,908
Doesn't this press release conflict with what was in the DRF article?

http://www.paulickreport.com/news/th...-handle-gains/

Excerpt:

In addition to on-track increases, Santa Anita’s overall business showed improvement as well. All-source average daily handle was up five percent compared to 2009 and the all-source handle was up 22 percent when compared to the same dates that were run at Hollywood Park in 2010.
andymays is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 11:09 AM   #11
Robert Goren
Racing Form Detective
 
Robert Goren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lincoln, Ne but my heart is at Santa Anita
Posts: 16,316
Quote:
Originally Posted by andymays
http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-raci...rackpool-urges

Excerpt:

While the recession leveled major blows to racing’s welfare, Brackpool noted that it also provided needed impetus for change.

“Five, six years ago, the industry was in complete denial,” he said. “Structural change was needed. Last year was the first time people came up to me and said, ‘This thing is broken’—which is good. People realize now change is needed.”

He believes a new law signed by Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger may help kick start racing’s reinvention. The bill, which goes into effect Jan. 1, increases takeout on exotic wagers and clears the way for exchange wagering, or head-to-head betting, in 2012 after CHRB creates rules to regulate that form of betting.

“We offer in California the premier racing product on a year-round basis,” he said, “but we were offering our first-class product at a discount price. We’re changing the pricing model. We left win-place-show where it is. But we came up with a solution that will produce $30 million more a year. That’s a 25-to-30% increase in overnight purses.
They continue to believe that takeout has little or no effect on handle. That is not only true in California but across the country. Judging by the posts on this forum by horsemen, they think all they have to do is come up with right gimmick wager (like pick 5s) and everything will be fine. Heaven forbid that anyone suggest that lower the take out will actually increase revenues to sport. To them, that is dumbest idea they have ever heard and will fight it tooth and nail. They don't even want to "waste" slot money in the racinos on the bettors.
__________________
Some day in the not too distant future, horse players will betting on computer generated races over the net. Race tracks will become casinos and shopping centers. And some crooner will be belting out "there used to be a race track here".
Robert Goren is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 11:22 AM   #12
Robert Goren
Racing Form Detective
 
Robert Goren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lincoln, Ne but my heart is at Santa Anita
Posts: 16,316
They claim the numbers are up, but when you look at the actual numbers they are down. Hum! They consider a career change and go to work for the defense department counting dead enemy soldiers.
__________________
Some day in the not too distant future, horse players will betting on computer generated races over the net. Race tracks will become casinos and shopping centers. And some crooner will be belting out "there used to be a race track here".
Robert Goren is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 11:22 AM   #13
andymays
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,908
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Goren
They continue to believe that takeout has little or no effect on handle. That is not only true in California but across the country. Judging by the posts on this forum by horsemen, they think all they have to do is come up with right gimmick wager (like pick 5s) and everything will be fine. Heaven forbid that anyone suggest that lower the take out will actually increase revenues to sport. To them, that is dumbest idea they have ever heard and will fight it tooth and nail. They don't even want to "waste" slot money in the racinos on the bettors.
You guys know this quote was from 2010 right? Brackpool is obviously no Nostradamus.
andymays is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 11:25 AM   #14
andymays
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,908
Using comparative days from 2009 they are probably down somewhere in the neighborhood of 4%-7% on Santa Anita races only. The figures they used in this instance most likely include wagers made on out of state races. By the way California is just doing what other jurisdiction do by putting the best spin on a bad situation but in California everything is watched more closely.
andymays is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 11-08-2011, 12:12 PM   #15
rwwupl
Registered User
 
rwwupl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,085
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff P
Cal Racing handle took a direct hit coinciding with announcement of the bill.

Code:
Exacta Takeout:

AQU-BEL-SAR:     18.50%

CDX-KEE:         19.00%

GPX:             20.00%

DMR-HOL-GGX-SAX: 22.68%

Exacta takeout in California isn't just 22.68%.

It's 22.6 percent HIGHER than NYRA's exacta takeout - and absurdly out of line given quality of product relative to other major tracks.

When handle is analyzed by wager type the negative effect of the takeout increase is glaring. The number of races in California where the exacta pool is $100k vs. the number of races at other major tracks where the exacta pool is $200k, $300k, and $400k tells a story that can be summed up in 3 words:

Bettors aren't stupid.

The reality of those 3 words is starting to dawn on a lot of people in the industry in California - who have recently changed their minds about the takeout increase - and who are now (quietly behind the scenes) calling for a takeout reduction.


-jp

.

Clear and to the point.

California racing rests on the pari-mutuel racing handle. Handle is in decline because the core pari-mutuel bettor has found that the bets in California are not attractive as compared to other options.

California racing is losing market share and pari-mutuel handle and all the decision makers know it .


More winning bettors would start a comeback for California racing, and put an end to the self serving interests of a few.

"Take out " is the obvious key to sending home a few more winners among the most unappreciated person in racing, the wagering customer.

The takeout is too damn high, and the task of finding the "optimum" take is frustrated by the few who do not respect the big picture for the good of all.

Yes , despite all the negatives,there is a flurry of things going on (behind the scene) between the decision makers, that I believe will produce many changes, and our favorite game will be better off for them .

I agree, "bettors are not stupid"

Keep the faith, and continue to support the effort for change.

Roger Way
rwwupl is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Reply




Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

» Advertisement
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:46 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 1999 - 2023 -- PaceAdvantage.Com -- All Rights Reserved
We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program
designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.