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12-18-2011, 08:53 AM
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#1
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Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,908
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Taking the Guesswork out of Racings most important issue!
http://www.horseracingbusiness.com/t...1#comment-1348
Excerpt:
These two are correct in their assessment. Dr. Betts perceptively mentioned the Laffer Curve, named for Arthur Laffer, who rose to fame as an economics adviser in the Reagan Administration. The Laffer Curve depicts that at tax rates of 0% and 100%, the federal government will receive no revenue whatsoever. At some point in between, government revenues will be maximized. Tax at too high of a rate and revenues will decline because people will not have the incentive to work harder; tax too low and government revenues will fall short of what is necessary.
The same principle applies for takeout percentage and handle: too high of a takeout discourages bettors and too low of a takeout provides a profit shortfall for racetracks and ADWs.
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You have to read the whole thing to get the full benefit of the article.
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12-18-2011, 08:55 AM
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#2
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Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,908
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It’s a sad commentary on California Racing when the leadership of the TOC can’t understand that they need to let the tracks compete for customers. The proposal made by the Tracks during Del Mar was a no brainer to get the ball rolling. All they wanted was to have the Exacta takeout lowered from 22.68 to 21.68 and to have a 15.43% takeout Daily Double. The Daily Double only represents about 4% of the total handle despite being offered in every race except the last. We saw what happened with small pools yesterday when the winner of the 5th race paid $173.40 but the Daily Double to the sixth race with a 10-1 shot only paid $174.20!
I don’t know what happens to some of these decision makers at the TOC. By all accounts most of them are successful intelligent people but when they get into the gambling aspect of the game they aren’t much smarter than a 5th grader.
The proposal the Tracks made during Del Mar was a first step that could revive the Double pools and attract Customers to California Racing. Does anyone know why the TOC is stuck on stupid?
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12-18-2011, 11:34 AM
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#3
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Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 832
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Andy,Nice job on the Roger stein show today 
No one in radio supports and gives the horseplayer a voice like roger!
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12-18-2011, 11:35 AM
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#4
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Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,908
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by jelly
Andy,Nice job on the Roger stein show today
No one in radio supports and gives the horseplayer a voice like roger! |
Roger is one of a kind. Thanks!
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12-18-2011, 11:38 AM
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#5
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Racing Form Detective
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lincoln, Ne but my heart is at Santa Anita
Posts: 16,316
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There is not horseman anywhere who believes that the take rate has any effect on the handle and when push comes to shove, it is the horsemen that are calling the shots.
__________________
Some day in the not too distant future, horse players will betting on computer generated races over the net. Race tracks will become casinos and shopping centers. And some crooner will be belting out "there used to be a race track here".
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12-18-2011, 11:39 AM
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#6
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Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,908
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robert Goren
There is not horseman anywhere who believes that the take rate has any effect on the handle and when push comes to shove, it is the horsemen that are calling the shots.
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You have no idea how much the TOC controls things out here. It's insane.
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12-18-2011, 12:57 PM
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 955
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That's about it. If they......well- It's a nice Sunday morning & I choose to be nice.
Andy, it's appreciated & you do a hell of a job fighting the good fight.
Last edited by Fingal; 12-18-2011 at 12:59 PM.
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12-18-2011, 01:35 PM
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 28,548
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by andymays
It’s a sad commentary on California Racing when the leadership of the TOC can’t understand that they need to let the tracks compete for customers. The proposal made by the Tracks during Del Mar was a no brainer to get the ball rolling. All they wanted was to have the Exacta takeout lowered from 22.68 to 21.68 and to have a 15.43% takeout Daily Double. The Daily Double only represents about 4% of the total handle despite being offered in every race except the last. We saw what happened with small pools yesterday when the winner of the 5th race paid $173.40 but the Daily Double to the sixth race with a 10-1 shot only paid $174.20!
I don’t know what happens to some of these decision makers at the TOC. By all accounts most of them are successful intelligent people but when they get into the gambling aspect of the game they aren’t much smarter than a 5th grader.
The proposal the Tracks made during Del Mar was a first step that could revive the Double pools and attract Customers to California Racing. Does anyone know why the TOC is stuck on stupid?
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They are not "stuck on stupid"; they are just not used to operating with the horseplayers in mind.
They want to have their cake and eat it too...which is not uncommon thinking in this industry.
Lowering the takeouts would mean a decrease in profits for the tracks in the short-run...and they don't feel that such a commitment to the horseplayers is really necessary.
After all...would the horseplayers really quit the game because of takeouts alone?
Their "research" says NO!
According to the industry...the vast majority of the players don't even know what the takeouts are!
We all heard it as clear as it could be said:
The industry considers this game to be a form of "entertainment"...and NOT a gambling game.
And as long as this thinking persists...all is lost!
__________________
Live to play another day.
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12-18-2011, 04:02 PM
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#9
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The Voice of Reason!
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Canandaigua, New york
Posts: 112,819
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Quote:
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They are not "stuck on stupid"; they are just not used to operating with the horseplayers in mind.
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This is why it is vitally important to never bet a dime on California racing, no matter how tempting it might be.
Only Support tracks that support players.
This needs to be expanded, to include any track that is running a high take out - not matter what track it is.
__________________
Who does the Racing Form Detective like in this one?
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12-18-2011, 05:42 PM
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#10
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Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,908
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The Pick 5 (14% takeout) pool with the carryover reached almost 1.5 Million today with the 183k carryover money.
The TOC and CHRB said it would never work.
That's how much they know. 
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12-18-2011, 05:43 PM
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,085
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by jelly
Andy,Nice job on the Roger stein show today
No one in radio supports and gives the horseplayer a voice like roger! |
Another eye opening segment by Andy on the Roger Stein Radio Show.
For those who would like to hear it, go to archives for Sunday,12-18-11
http://www.rogerstein.com/
rw
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12-18-2011, 06:22 PM
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#12
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The Voice of Reason!
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Canandaigua, New york
Posts: 112,819
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Thanks, rw, downloaded it for the drive to work Monday.
__________________
Who does the Racing Form Detective like in this one?
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12-18-2011, 06:29 PM
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 12,402
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robert Goren
There is not horseman anywhere who believes that the take rate has any effect on the handle...
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Oy vey.
You wouldn't get called out nearly so regularly in these threads if you didn't make such absurd claims and just added a few qualifiers to the ranting hyperbole as to make sure you aren't utterly wrong.
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12-18-2011, 06:46 PM
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#14
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PA Steward
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,543
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by johnhannibalsmith
Oy vey.
You wouldn't get called out nearly so regularly in these threads if you didn't make such absurd claims and just added a few qualifiers to the ranting hyperbole as to make sure you aren't utterly wrong.
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True that...
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12-18-2011, 07:04 PM
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#15
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by thaskalos
The industry considers this game to be a form of "entertainment"...and NOT a gambling game.
And as long as this thinking persists...all is lost!
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This is it in a nutshell. When a horse like Zenyatta runs at Hollywood Park and draws a generously reported 10,000 or so, you would think those in charge would get it...but they don't.
Take gambling away and run the races. See how many people show up.
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