Track Time Difference

[RacingFan1992]

I was watching the third race at Mahoning Valley which was a 12 furlong event with a final time of 2:38 flat. My question is why is there such a degree of difference in time versus higher level 12 furlong events such as the Belmont or Brooklyn? Is it the track, weather conditions, field quality, etc? I was shocked to see it ran so slow. It was 8 seconds slower than a really slow Belmont.

[VeryOldMan]

Originally Posted by RacingFan1992

I was watching the third race at Mahoning Valley which was a 12 furlong event with a final time of 2:38 flat. My question is why is there such a degree of difference in time versus higher level 12 furlong events such as the Belmont or Brooklyn? Is it the track, weather conditions, field quality, etc? I was shocked to see it ran so slow. It was 8 seconds slower than a really slow Belmont.

I'll start but expect more informed others to chime in - it's all of the above and then some. Field quality, mostly. Modern day horses aren't bred to race 1 1/2 miles, particularly at the lower levels. A 1 1/2 mile race at MV or its equivalent is a bit of a freak show - reminds me of the marathon races run at Mountaineer. Entertaining to watch, but not to wager.

[whodoyoulike]

I don't really know in this case but, it's probably all of your suggestions above plus consider:

1) Starter Alw5000 level 4up (big difference from top 3yos);

2) track was listed as sloppy;

3) see the pp's for #3 Senor Juan which shows three at 12f races at this level (who finished 9, 2 & 2 and was 3rd choice in this race) and the fractionals were comparable to this race except for the final time which looks like everyone was fading fast in this race at the end. and

4) I have a bias against starter alw races because I feel they're usually set up for someone. I'm not saying it's fixed, I just have trouble narrowing the contenders in these races.

My suggestion is to stay away but, if you insist the fav did win at 1/1.

Do you really want to risk doubling your money on a starter alw5k 6 horse field?

[Murph]

Originally Posted by RacingFan1992

I was watching the third race at Mahoning Valley which was a 12 furlong event with a final time of 2:38 flat. My question is why is there such a degree of difference in time versus higher level 12 furlong events such as the Belmont or Brooklyn? Is it the track, weather conditions, field quality, etc? I was shocked to see it ran so slow. It was 8 seconds slower than a really slow Belmont.

I made my very first spot play and horses to watch list from this type of race I call "the mid-winter marathon." I've seen this type of race run at distances up to and over two miles.

In general the entries come from strong older geldings who have lifetime ITM%'s in the 50% range much like #4 Secret Jackpot in this race. I think the horsemen are asking the racing sec. for a race like this in these cases. They are FUN to watch and wager on and it they are usually competitive races.

A couple I recall from the old list were Thousand Palms and the IL based Edward G. Equibase may still offer the lifetime records on these two.

http://www.equibase.com/profiles/Res...183&registry=T

Older runners in the middle of the winter going long in the last race at Turfway Park late, late at night. The times are usually irrelevant because of varying tactics the trainers will use. You never know when someone will try to pull a wire job. Most look like they are run similar to a jump race without the hedges. At any class level they are well below runners trying this distance in the spring, summer and fall. Still, very strong runners with plenty of racing spirit left in them.

[Elliott Sidewater]

Beside the obvious difference in quality, the mile and a half at Belmont is a two turn race. At MVR it's a 3 turn race with only 1f run up to the first turn. Let's say that accounts for about 1.4 seconds. The surface at MVR is deeper too, and the running times for the best horses on the grounds there are slower. In summary, most of the difference is in quality, but the track layout and surface matter too.