Religion II

[Show Me the Wire]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

Seriously? How exactly is it a pain or burden to be an atheist? Unless you like to shove it in everyone's face and constantly get into confrontations. Just live your life and nobody will bother you.

It seems to me it would be quite easy to live as an atheist today. Are they rounding up atheists and shipping them off to reeducation camps? Did I miss that?

Acting like the village idiot has always been a burden.

[Greyfox]

Originally Posted by hcap

Considering the "religious" preachers, ministers and priests much publicized sexual scandal, there's a whole lot of celebrating going on. Along with a whole lot of religious hypocrisy. At least atheists don't bullshit about sex as much those who accuse mankind of being evil sinners.
'

You make it sound as if sexual hypocrisy is a rampant epidemic among theologians and various ministries.
Only a very small subset of those who you speak of are guilty of that, yet people such as yourself, in this instance, overgeneralize and smear the entire group.
You normally know better than to do that hcap.
You are usually fairer with your comments than the ones in that post.

[hcap]

Originally Posted by Greyfox

You make it sound as if sexual hypocrisy is a rampant epidemic among theologians and various ministries.
Only a very small subset of those who you speak of are guilty of that, yet people such as yourself, in this instance, overgeneralize and smear the entire group.
You normally know better than to do that hcap.
You are usually fairer with your comments than the ones in that post.

I know hypocrisy about sex is the special province of those who proclaim their God given "purity". Yes politicians get caught, whereas religions types get dammed

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by hcap

Considering the "religious" preachers, ministers and priests much publicized sexual scandal, there's a whole lot of celebrating going on. Along with a whole lot of religious hypocrisy. At least atheists don't bullshit about sex as much those who accuse mankind of being evil sinners.
'

The only reason the clergy get into the news is because they are clergy who got caught with their pants down. But this doesn't mean that the majority of clergy are hypocrites. It it only takes a relatively few rotten apples to spoil the barrel and get the godless world's attention. Therefore, this doesn't change the fact that the faithful preachers of the gospel do indeed remain faithful in practice to what they're preaching.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by Greyfox

A group that believes in anything, including "nothing" is part of a religion of belief in what they are espousing.

A person who says, and apparently wrote:
"The atheist carries a bigger burden than any other religious group."


You said "burden."

I asked what burden are you talking about?

Thanks for the clarification.

The burden is the ad hominem argument. If a candidate is openly atheist then his opponent will surely point that out to a mostly religious electorate. He will imply that the atheist's ideas are invalid simply because he is an atheist and the religious electorate will believe it.

That's the burden which the atheist candidate has to overcome. It's easier to lie and shout "praise Jesus."

[Actor]

Originally Posted by boxcar

QUOTE=Actor;2164810]And what part of "other" don't you get in your 1231?

... my 1231?

[Actor]

Originally Posted by Show Me the Wire

Oh woe to you. It is a very good thing that admitted atheists are not electable. Atheists are contrary to the the foundation of the U.S.

About 12 years ago or even maybe longer a I composed a lengthy post in response to a poster, who wished the President would be an atheist. I am not going to recreate the entire post, only the highlights.

America was founded on the idea individual rights and liberties come from God, their Creator.

[I]We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with inherent and inalienable rights; that among these, are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness; that to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed; that whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles, and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness."/I] Declaration of Independence

Without a Creator men do not have inherent or inalienable rights. Any rights not issuing from the Creator (God) can only come from the person or persons who can impose their wills through physical power and/or might..

An atheist by definition rejects the idea any rights or liberties come from a Creator, as like you, Actor, as they deny the existence of a Creator and that there is any purpose to life. Knowing this why would anybody knowingly vote for someone who rejects the foundation America is built upon?

America is founded upon the Constitution, not the Declaration of Independence. See the First Amendment of said Constitution.

The Declaration of Independence was drafted by Thomas Jefferson who was a declared deist. He was most likely an atheist but to say so was political suicide in those days just as it is today.

BTW are you aware that when Jefferson founded the University of Virginia he insisted that there be no Department of Theology because it would be a "Department of Nothing?"

Without a Creator men do not have inherent or inalienable rights. Any rights not issuing from the Creator (God) can only come from the person or persons who can impose their wills through physical power and/or might..

I agree 100%. This is why America's military spending is greater than the next 25 military powers combined. Rights derive from men who, in their own self-interests and the interests of their posterity, gather together enough physical power and/or might to defend those rights/interests. The founding fathers did not believe in the "inalienable rights" of others, particularly black slaves and native Americans.

[Actor]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

Seriously? How exactly is it a pain or burden to be an atheist? Unless you like to shove it in everyone's face and constantly get into confrontations. Just live your life and nobody will bother you.

How many atheists have knocked on your door and asked to talk about evolution?

[Show Me the Wire]

Originally Posted by Actor

America is founded upon the Constitution, not the Declaration of Independence. See the First Amendment of said Constitution.

The Declaration of Independence was drafted by Thomas Jefferson who was a declared deist. He was most likely an atheist but to say so was political suicide in those days just as it is today.

America was not founded on the Constitution. America is founded on the idea contained in the Declaration of Independence that men have inalienable rights from a Creator God. The Constitution is the law of the land. And it was written to revise the Articles of Confederation ratified by the Continental Congress.

Also, the first right in the Bill of Rights based on the idea of inalienable rights is the establishment clause.

Would you like to try again? Jefferson may have been a deist, so what?

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

... my 1231?

Did I get the post number wrong? It was the post wherein you used the phrase "OTHER religious groups"! So...why are you equivocating by denying that atheism is a religion?

[Show Me the Wire]

Actor stated:

he founding fathers did not believe in the "inalienable rights" of others, particularly black slaves and native Americans.

Agreed. They did not see them as equals.

[Show Me the Wire]

Originally Posted by Actor

How many atheists have knocked on your door and asked to talk about evolution?

Put a sign on your door "No Solicitors". I know I had to do that to get rid of those pesky atheists.

[PaceAdvantage]

Originally Posted by Actor

How many atheists have knocked on your door and asked to talk about evolution?

Exactly...so I'm not getting why it would be such a burden to be an atheist.

Never answer your door to the unexpected and your problem is solved

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

How many atheists have knocked on your door and asked to talk about evolution?

None. Which goes to prove that that atheists don't feel any burden to share their version of the good news.

[Show Me the Wire]

A question for you Actor.

Do you agree with the District court ruling invalidating the Presidential order restricting people from, select countries entering the U.S. on the grounds of violating the establishment clause?