ASD TRACK CHATTER

[ndsc32]

Originally Posted by Track Collector

This rule is unchanged from the previous year, and "the intent" is to protect the player from a late scratch. At the same time, your are correct that a player could manipulate a selection to get in essence a risk-free play. Should it become evident that a player was doing this, the the contest administrators could take appropriate action.

Or, if Jay thinks it is a better option, we could go ahead and change the rule now to eliminate credit for the portion of the entry one does not specify.


Chris

Think you are better to change the rule now. A simple statement that if you only name one horse in an entry and that horse is scratched, you have no bet.
Just my opinion. Thanks.

[cordep17]

Originally Posted by Track Collector

This rule is unchanged from the previous year, and "the intent" is to protect the player from a late scratch. At the same time, your are correct that a player could manipulate a selection to get in essence a risk-free play. Should it become evident that a player was doing this, the the contest administrators could take appropriate action.

Or, if Jay thinks it is a better option, we could go ahead and change the rule now to eliminate credit for the portion of the entry one does not specify.


Chris

Why should we specify one horse of a coupled entry? If you specify the 1, and he finishes second behind the 1a, how could you determine the place payoff? As a coupled entry, you can't get different odds if you only pick one of them. The odds reflect them as a group, so you are missing out if you can't pick them together. It says in the rules that a bet can be cancelled untill post time, so someone who picks a coupled entry can always pull out of that bet pre race.

[Track Collector]

Originally Posted by cordep17

Why should we specify one horse of a coupled entry? If you specify the 1, and he finishes second behind the 1a, how could you determine the place payoff? As a coupled entry, you can't get different odds if you only pick one of them. The odds reflect them as a group, so you are missing out if you can't pick them together. It says in the rules that a bet can be cancelled untill post time, so someone who picks a coupled entry can always pull out of that bet pre race.

Hello cordep17,

Glad to see you have signed up for one of PACS contests!

While it is desirable to have contests mirror real-life betting as much as possible, sometimes allowances are made to encourage greater participation. One of those allowances is that MANY participants are not able to follow along in real time, due to other important commitments like their job, etc. Thus, changing or cancelling their selection at the last moment may not be an option for them.

While in this contest you are allowed to choose only one part of the entry, the payouts are still based on the wagering activity of the entire entry, just like at the track.


Chris

[ndsc32]

While in this contest you are allowed to choose only one part of the entry, the payouts are still based on the wagering activity of the entire entry, just like at the track.

TC-regarding above, at the track, if you pick the entry, and one is scratched and the other loses, you DON'T GET YOUR MONEY BACK. Your rules are not the same as that. They should be changed.

[Track Collector]

Originally Posted by ndsc32

While in this contest you are allowed to choose only one part of the entry, the payouts are still based on the wagering activity of the entire entry, just like at the track.

TC-regarding above, at the track, if you pick the entry, and one is scratched and the other loses, you DON'T GET YOUR MONEY BACK. Your rules are not the same as that. They should be changed.

Yes, the contest rules do not mirror what is done at the track, and I recognize you would prefer that we change the contest rule. Maybe for next year, but one is only risking trouble when rules are changed once a significant number of people have already "acknowledged" them. In addition, it should be Jay's decision given that he was involved with this contest in the years before it was run on the PaceAdvantage website.

I believe your real concern with the existing rule is that under certain conditions, a player could structure their selection in such a manner as to achieve a "risk-free" play. You may not be aware of it, but EVERY selection a player makes is captured in their wagering history. When a scratch occurs, it is noted and included in original selection record. Thus, it would be relatively easy to spot when a player was trying to employ this strategy, which would be dealt with accordingly.

[ndsc32]

TC-

I understand what you are saying and agree that it is a little too late to make changes to the rules. Sure, there will be some that use this rule to their advantage, but there will be those who truly only like one horse in an entry and will only name that horse. Yet if they do so constantly, there is the possibility that they will be accused of cheating. Now that would not be fair IMO.

Now that I think of it, I don't think any bets have been listed yet so changes to the rules would not affect anything. But.........it's your show and I will naturally abide by your decision. Good luck in the contest.

[Track Collector]

Hello everyone,

Just two reminders:

(1) Remember to list multiple plays on the same day by listed Post Time order.
(2) When modifying an existing play, the safest way is to use the QUOTE option. By doing do, your original posting will remain visible, and a new posting can be used to indicate your changes or any comments. Should any questions come up, your original posting can then be viewed if necessary. When you choose instead to use the EDIT option, one will notice two different timestamps, one associated with the original posting and another one associated with when that post was edited. Both timestamps need to meet the 1 minute or more before the race off time requirement. In addition, there is NO audit trail to verify what the post looked like before the edit, which can lead to unintended consequences.

Example:
-- At 3 minutes until Post Time you post a selection to Win.
-- The horse wins and the payout is $40 for a two-dollar ticket.
-- In your excitement you notice you can still edit your original posting, so you do so with a comment like "Look at that payout! Jockey Smith is the best at getting the most out of longshots".

What your original posting will show is an "edited" timestamp AFTER the race went off, thus you have made your play invalid and will lose credit for correctly predicting the outcome.

Why do you lose credit? It is because an EDITED post has no audit trail, so we have no way of knowing what the post looked like before you edited it. Even though you may honestly tell us what was changed, contest integrity remains the highest when we work only with what we see, and not what we are told.

In making any modification, the lesson is..........it is always safer to use the QUOTE option, and only use the EDIT option if you fully understand what you are doing.


Chris

[Track Collector]

Hello everyone,

Since this was asked via private message, I thought it would be a good idea to share here for all.

At the conclusion of the final contest day (07/01), scoring will be as follows:
-- Anyone who ends with an "in-play" amount great than $5.00 (even if it is based on less than 3 successful consecutive plays) will have that amount (minus $5) added to their existing bank amount. This will be done automatically for you, so you do not have to advise the scorer to "bank it".
-- For those who lose their very last contest selection, their bank amount will not require any additional adjustments, as the listed amount will already reflect the take away of $5.00 which was used to start the contest.

NOTE: The reason everyone ends up having $5.00 deducted from their existing bank is because everyone is given $5.00 to start the contest.


Chris

[Aner]

Hey Track Collector,

If this is your first trip to Prineville, you are in for a treat. Before my wife became to ill to travel, we hit Prineville many times. We would start at Grant's Pass around the 4th of July and then move on to Prn for their 4 day meet. We even attended before the Daily Racing Form even recognized the track.

You will probably be coming in from the Bend and Redmond side. After driving about 20 miles through high dessert dried out cactus, you will come to a bluff and look down on a green oasis with a meandering stream the runs through the heart of Prineville - one of the nicest views in all of Oregon. We stayed at the Best Western at the edge of town (nice and inexpensive). There is a real neat jogging trail near the motel following Ochoco Creek all the way to the other edge of town. Be sure to check out the Fireman's memorial groove.

Since the racing is at night the temperature is tolerable, but for the early races the tin roofed stadium is like a sauna bath. The bleachers have no back rests so I would recommend bringing a stadium seat for your comfort. I think the minimum bet is still $3. That leads to some interesting payouts. Since most people in that area are relatively poor and the races only come to town once a year, exotic bets pay much less than normal using favorites and much more than usual if you can stick in a long-shot. Most likely some of the exotics will pay with no one having all of the horses - even DD's sometimes pay when getting only one right. Sometimes only one bettor takes down the whole pot.

Have a great time. Great town.

[Track Collector]

Originally Posted by Aner

Hey Track Collector,

If this is your first trip to Prineville, you are in for a treat. Before my wife became to ill to travel, we hit Prineville many times. We would start at Grant's Pass around the 4th of July and then move on to Prn for their 4 day meet. We even attended before the Daily Racing Form even recognized the track.

You will probably be coming in from the Bend and Redmond side. After driving about 20 miles through high dessert dried out cactus, you will come to a bluff and look down on a green oasis with a meandering stream the runs through the heart of Prineville - one of the nicest views in all of Oregon. We stayed at the Best Western at the edge of town (nice and inexpensive). There is a real neat jogging trail near the motel following Ochoco Creek all the way to the other edge of town. Be sure to check out the Fireman's memorial groove.

Since the racing is at night the temperature is tolerable, but for the early races the tin roofed stadium is like a sauna bath. The bleachers have no back rests so I would recommend bringing a stadium seat for your comfort. I think the minimum bet is still $3. That leads to some interesting payouts. Since most people in that area are relatively poor and the races only come to town once a year, exotic bets pay much less than normal using favorites and much more than usual if you can stick in a long-shot. Most likely some of the exotics will pay with no one having all of the horses - even DD's sometimes pay when getting only one right. Sometimes only one bettor takes down the whole pot.

Have a great time. Great town.

My apologies to everyone for the thread drift.

Hi Aner,

This will be my 4th visit to Prineville, and they are my current "most favorite" track to visit. Yes, they still have the $3 minimum wagers and listed payouts.

Thanks for the touring tips. Another common stop is the OTB within Lava (Bowling) Lanes in Bend. Like all Oregon OTB sites, they have that annoying 5% betting surcharge on ALL wagers. They also do not allow phone/internet wagering, so one just has to work around that.

Late Summer I plan to attend the races in Burns, OR. After that, all the OR tracks will have been "collected".

Best of luck for the balance of the AsD Parlay contest. At this very moment, you are "in-effect" the leader that we are all chasing!


Chris

[ndsc32]

Chris, I have been trying to put in an entry parley for 6/26 and I get a message that my IP address has been banned by the administrators. What gives?

ndsc32

[cj]

Originally Posted by ndsc32

Chris, I have been trying to put in an entry parley for 6/26 and I get a message that my IP address has been banned by the administrators. What gives?

ndsc32

But you can post this? Makes no sense to me.

[Track Collector]

Originally Posted by ndsc32

Chris, I have been trying to put in an entry parley for 6/26 and I get a message that my IP address has been banned by the administrators. What gives?

ndsc32

NOTE: This is for everyone, as I have already responded to ndsc32 privately.

I have experienced this myself from time to time. It must be one of those system quirks that mysteriously come, and then go. If one can not get on after a while, I would contact Mike (PaceAdvantage).

If at any time folks can not post selections in the designated thread, you are welcome to send them to me by either private message or e-mail.


Chris

[cj]

Originally Posted by Track Collector

Hello everyone,

Since this was asked via private message, I thought it would be a good idea to share here for all.

At the conclusion of the final contest day (07/01), scoring will be as follows:
-- Anyone who ends with an "in-play" amount great than $5.00 (even if it is based on less than 3 successful consecutive plays) will have that amount (minus $5) added to their existing bank amount. This will be done automatically for you, so you do not have to advise the scorer to "bank it".
-- Anyone who ends with an "in-play" amount of $5.00 will have $5.00 deducted from their existing bank amount.

NOTE: The reason everyone ends up having $5.00 deducted from their existing bank is because everyone is given $5.00 to start the contest.


Chris

Just my opinion on his, and I'm certainly not asking for a rule change, just for this to be considered in future contests. This is a parlay challenge. You should not be able to bank money that was not earned by meeting the minimum rules of the parlay. It will just encourage hitting one big winner and not playing at the end. If you need to have three wins for a parlay, there is ample time and opportunity to hit them unless you lose the first bet of the last day.

I'd like to hear others thoughts on this.

[cj]

Originally Posted by Track Collector

-- Anyone who ends with an "in-play" amount of $5.00 will have $5.00 deducted from their existing bank amount.

NOTE: The reason everyone ends up having $5.00 deducted from their existing bank is because everyone is given $5.00 to start the contest.


Chris

I'm also a little confused here. Didn't we pay back the $5 the first time we banked, just as we pay it back every time we bank? It would seem an unfair deduction to those with an in play amount of 5.

Obviously those with an in play amount >5 should have the 5 deducted since they are in effect banking.