Can anyone explain this ride by Irad yesterday

[cj]

And no, I'm not claiming a fixed race. I just don't get it. I want to know what the plan was here.

And the stewards really should give the public an explanation but they won't.

Race starts about the 4:01.55 mark. He is on the 4 horse. For some context the pace was glacially slow.

YouTube

[JustRalph]

Didn’t want the horse on the lead apparently. But the horse lost 5L or so being held back. Lost by about 5 too.......

I would be furious if I bet em

[the little guy]

Irad is not an aggressive rider. I don't think it was reasonable to expect his mount to be in front ( not that you said that at all ). It's only particularly glaring, however, because he seemed to be the only rider ( besides Cancel who won a ton of races by being aggressive but seems to have forgotten that ) that was blissfully unaware that they were crawling. Saez and Manny "sent" horses with no speed given the slow pace.

To me, the weird thing was 3:1 on Irad's horse. Granted he's always overbet, I don't see how that horse was shorter than the eventual place and show runners.

That race is a good example of the danger of deciding how to ride before a race is being run as opposed to letting the manner in which it is being run decide how you ride. Irad should have tried to go forward but he simply doesn't ride like that. He wins an awful lot of races, and is highly skilled, but he's not aggressive with speed horses. He is aggressive with herding.

[v j stauffer]

What I'll never understand is why when a jockey, a professional athlete, does a lousy job it's automatically race fixing. Can't he just suck? Or his horse suck? Or the trainer? There can be a million explanations as to why what happened did. Maybe they decided to change tactics? And yes I said "they". As a jockeys agent I can tell you that instructions from trainers can be completely opposite what a jockey or me as a handicapper thinks is best. However, blow that off, do what you want and it will land you unemployed from that barn for a long time? Irad's ride I'll admit was a puzzlement. But is it any more of a puzzlement when Tom Brady throws three interceptions? Mike Trout strikes out 4 times? LeBron score 8 and fouls out. Are those major scandals? Or are they playing a game that damn tough and impossible to always be great at?

[thaskalos]

Did anyone allege "race fixing" in this thread? All I saw was a display of controlled bemusement.

[v j stauffer]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

Did anyone allege "race fixing" in this thread? All I saw was a display of controlled bemusement.

Perhaps I was reacting to all hub-bub on Twitter.

[castaway01]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

What I'll never understand is why when a jockey, a professional athlete, does a lousy job it's automatically race fixing. Can't he just suck? Or his horse suck? Or the trainer? There can be a million explanations as to why what happened did. Maybe they decided to change tactics? And yes I said "they". As a jockeys agent I can tell you that instructions from trainers can be completely opposite what a jockey or me as a handicapper thinks is best. However, blow that off, do what you want and it will land you unemployed from that barn for a long time? Irad's ride I'll admit was a puzzlement. But is it any more of a puzzlement when Tom Brady throws three interceptions? Mike Trout strikes out 4 times? LeBron score 8 and fouls out. Are those major scandals? Or are they playing a game that damn tough and impossible to always be great at?

If you don't think sports bettors question it when a quarterback with three interceptions for the season suddenly throws three in a half, or when a guy averaging 25 a game in the NBA suddenly goes 2 for 17 from the field, you're not paying attention (baseball example doesn't work because even .300 hitters go 0 for 4 many times in a season). Not saying it's "fair" but when there's gambling involved everything gets questioned.

[classhandicapper]

IMO, he made 2 mistakes.

1. He didn't try to take advantage of the slow pace once he was in position to do so.

2. The horse reacted a little negatively to the extra restraint once he decided to take back off the pace.

He turned a positive into a negative.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by the little guy

That race is a good example of the danger of deciding how to ride before a race is being run as opposed to letting the manner in which it is being run decide how you ride.

As you said on the show, the ride on Tom's D'Etat in the Stephen Foster today was an example of what you should do. Most people probably thought By My Standards was going to get the early jump, but TDE broke well and took advantage of the better position and expected moderate pace to get the jump. It probably didn't matter, but the race was OVER once the early positions were reversed.

[PaceAdvantage]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

Perhaps I was reacting to all hub-bub on Twitter.

Lulz.

[PaceAdvantage]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

What I'll never understand is why when a jockey, a professional athlete, does a lousy job it's automatically race fixing.

Hey Mr. Exposed Nerve Twitter Man...cj's first sentence specifically says he's not claiming it's a fixed race.

Reading is FUNdaMENTAL.

[sammy the sage]

He did as he was TOLD....period...trainer's often run horses in races TO TRAIN or get INTO shape or WHATEVER....if THAT race fixing???

Been that way SINCE....I don't know...FOREVER maybe....anyways...it is what it is...

One of the reasons I know longer partake in every day racing....can-not handicap trainer INTENT...

my two cents...

[Stevecsd2]

#4 Kid is Frosty was coming off of a 229 day layoff. All the other horses had raced within the last 40 days. That could account for some of it.

[SG4]

Irad & other NY jocks are guilty of over-wrangling back horses all the time, and understandable (albeit frustrating) if indeed just riding to instructions. The issue with this ride is he wasn't holding this horse back early & trying to be patient, they had already gone 1/4 of a mile in a 6f sprint & then he decides he wants to be off the pace? That makes no sense. He might be deemed a patient rider, but I think in general when he makes the lead like this he's no dummy in keeping his position & going on with it. The aggressive pull back at that point in the race given the slow pace is curious at best.



Furthermore, obviously there's no lip-reading or audio, but he appeared agitated with another jockey(s) yelling towards them right after the race on the gallop-out, also strange to see. Certainly didn't look like he was saying nice ride, see you for dinner at King Umberto.

[JustRalph]

Originally Posted by the little guy

That race is a good example of the danger of deciding how to ride before a race is being run as opposed to letting the manner in which it is being run decide how you ride.

This makes perfect sense for what you see in the vid.

Insightful