Today Was The Biggest Day In Horse Racing!

[JustRalph]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

I wish you could realize how wrong you are.

Amazing isn’t it........?

Some people don’t know, what they don’t know......

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by DerbyJackpot

2.) So how do we get them to play horse races? Its simple! We introduce large horse fields(racing secretaries can do this if they get off there ass), screw the 5 horse fields its a losing money fight.
- Introduce More Jackpot Wagers With A Max of $50 wagered on the bet. This gets rid of the whales.

3.) Get rid of the Live Odds and Probables 10 to 20 minutes before Post. This will get rid of your $2 to $20 bettors betting on the favorite. This will diversify the odds

He is disillusioned about the game...but you've got to admire his sense of humor.

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by DerbyJackpot

Now I know bunch of the members on here are old timers. Whom I respect 100%... But I want to give you a 20 age group opinion on the news today.


They ruled today Banning Sports Betting was unconstitutional. This now gives rights to horse tracks to introduce sports betting at the tracks. To conclude this gives Horse Tracks many routes to improve. I'll explain why....

1.) Youth Bettors like myself see a better percentage ROI on sports betting. You can play a lock on a basketball or football game compared to playing a 5 horse field with likely chances the 4/5 shot wins... So introducing Sports Betting is going to bring youth bettors to the horse track. 100% certain

2.) So how do we get them to play horse races? Its simple! We introduce large horse fields(racing secretaries can do this if they get off there ass), screw the 5 horse fields its a losing money fight.
- Introduce More Jackpot Wagers With A Max of $50 wagered on the bet. This gets rid of the whales. Young bettors will wager on bets they see value in(I and My Drinking Buddies Do This; All 20 to 27yo) Take for example Fantasy Sports, Spend $10 to win $500,000....

3.) Get rid of the Live Odds and Probables 10 to 20 minutes before Post. This will get rid of your $2 to $20 bettors betting on the favorite. This will diversify the odds

4.) Make it where you can buy a voucher at the track. Download a app... Enter in a passcode, and upload that money onto an app and wager on your phone. Youth hate waiting in lines.

5.) Keep beer affordable, free programs, free admission


This is the biggest opportunity for the horse racing industry to revive itself to the gamblers... For a long time we have taken care of the horsemen with a welfare logic. These horsemen have no done a damn thing for horse racing. Screw them is my logic here. Take care of your customers

Thanks for reading guys.

Hey Derby

It would be great if they could make some tie in or a teaser with an actual horse race

Say someone bets on the Jets to cover against the Dolphins and if they win that bet they’re automatically entered into a win bet with the Favorite or whatever horse they choose in a Stakes race for that day

If they hit both bets they win twice as much or even more this way they now have an interest in the horse race and may venture into the dynamics of handicapping if they so chose

I think the blending of both games would make it attractive for a younger or novice player to get into the game

[Poindexter]

Originally Posted by DerbyJackpot

Horse players like yourself are alot to blame for the decline. You want to b*tch but I guarantee you you seat at home and wager on tvg and never go to the track and support it.

At least they are introducing something or at minimal going to try something to drive in new clientele.. What is wrong with that... Do you want them to just do nothing?

Yes I understand the tracks have ****ed over the players, but if those players went to the track instead you would not have increased takeouts. Its that simple. The way the market is setup now, you got JoeBlow paying JoeBlow2 in which JoeBlow3 pays JoeBlow4 and JoeBlow5 in return paying JoeBlow6,7,8,9,10.... With this logic and decline in revenue it had to be increased.


Just amazes me how you guys want to complain but don't want to try nothing new.

I mean I go to the track 1 or 2 times a week. I try to support my track. Do I use online betting? Yes on occasion.
But I understand its hard to travel to the track everyday and its easier to stay at home. But why not go there once a week or once a month.

What do you want us to say. We have seen this movie before. There will be an influx of cash, new people will be introduced to the sport. All the revenues will go to one thing exclusively, purses. Owners will have a ball. Racetracks executives will have bright smiles on their faces, there might even be a short term handle increase of 20% or more. But when all is said and done, you and your younger generation associates will get tired of losing 30 to 40% (unless you are the 1 of 100 that is able to climb the mountain) of each dollar bet on horses and will realize that the sports book is a much better deal. Sure places like Jersey will see some better stock and fuller fields for a while but the game is still broken and cannot sustain any growth for that reason. I don't subscribe to the theory that full fields make higher takeout okay. For a few it might, but for the masses they will just be making lower probability bets, losing their money faster and give up sooner.

I don't subscribe to the theory that racing has an exposure problem. I subscribe to the theory that racing has a retention problem. You cannot retain a customer long term when you are charging them over 30% in takeout and sportsbetting will charge them 4.5% to 6.5%(if they go to -115). They have to be excessively wealthy or extremely irrational to stay in this game. Now there are exceptions, carryover situations etc. but for the most part most people playing this game are hemorrhaging money (and no I am not talking about whales or sharps or those getting huge rebates).

Do I have a problem with what Jersey did. Hell no. Sportsbetting should have been legal for at least the last 20 years. About time. Do I have a problem with them having the state legislators giving them this hand out. Not at all. But I do think if they blow it this time and they likely will, this will be the last lifeline they will ever see. Sports betting certainly doesn't need Monmouth Park, but Monmouth Park certainly needs sports betting.

I cannot speak for others, but I am not bitching. I have a vision for this sport that it can go toe to toe with sports betting and any other gambling game. It can be a far superior game. As I always state, eliminate rebates, and make the takeout 8% wps, 10% exacta, 12% exotics. That will put racing on a level field with all of them. Everybody will have their preferences, but ultimately racing will succeed. The more mainstream gambling becomes, the more people that gamble., the more people will find horse racing. Give them a price they can afford and they stay in the game, but rip them off and they had for the exits really quickly. It really is that simple.

So I would like to ask you as a young person that likes to gamble on horses, what in this post do you disagree with and why.

[DerbyJackpot]

Originally Posted by Poindexter

What do you want us to say. We have seen this movie before. There will be an influx of cash, new people will be introduced to the sport. All the revenues will go to one thing exclusively, purses. Owners will have a ball. Racetracks executives will have bright smiles on their faces, there might even be a short term handle increase of 20% or more. But when all is said and done, you and your younger generation associates will get tired of losing 30 to 40% (unless you are the 1 of 100 that is able to climb the mountain) of each dollar bet on horses and will realize that the sports book is a much better deal. Sure places like Jersey will see some better stock and fuller fields for a while but the game is still broken and cannot sustain any growth for that reason. I don't subscribe to the theory that full fields make higher takeout okay. For a few it might, but for the masses they will just be making lower probability bets, losing their money faster and give up sooner.

I don't subscribe to the theory that racing has an exposure problem. I subscribe to the theory that racing has a retention problem. You cannot retain a customer long term when you are charging them over 30% in takeout and sportsbetting will charge them 4.5% to 6.5%(if they go to -115). They have to be excessively wealthy or extremely irrational to stay in this game. Now there are exceptions, carryover situations etc. but for the most part most people playing this game are hemorrhaging money (and no I am not talking about whales or sharps or those getting huge rebates).

Do I have a problem with what Jersey did. Hell no. Sportsbetting should have been legal for at least the last 20 years. About time. Do I have a problem with them having the state legislators giving them this hand out. Not at all. But I do think if they blow it this time and they likely will, this will be the last lifeline they will ever see. Sports betting certainly doesn't need Monmouth Park, but Monmouth Park certainly needs sports betting.

I cannot speak for others, but I am not bitching. I have a vision for this sport that it can go toe to toe with sports betting and any other gambling game. It can be a far superior game. As I always state, eliminate rebates, and make the takeout 8% wps, 10% exacta, 12% exotics. That will put racing on a level field with all of them. Everybody will have their preferences, but ultimately racing will succeed. The more mainstream gambling becomes, the more people that gamble., the more people will find horse racing. Give them a price they can afford and they stay in the game, but rip them off and they had for the exits really quickly. It really is that simple.

So I would like to ask you as a young person that likes to gamble on horses, what in this post do you disagree with and why.

I'm for lowering takeouts.... If states don't lower takeouts for at least a year after injecting more outside revenue into the game, they are giving the biggest "**** You" I've ever seen. At this point I will never bet another dollar on American Racing.... I'll go 100% Hong Kong and Japan.

But anyway you look at it the first year a sports book is available at the track there revenue is going to be up at least 25%.

But like you said horse racing is a far superior game and has unlimited opportunities which have been screwed up time and time again. Better yet they have made it almost impossible to make a buck at the track. You are literally donating almost $3 of your entertainment or gambling dollars for every $10 spent. Thats ****ing ridiculous ayy! The customers at this point are there bitches. Excuse my french but thats how the industry looks at there customers right now... So I'm hoping positive things are attempted here. If not I'm done with them.

[AskinHaskin]

Originally Posted by DerbyJackpot

Now I know bunch of the members on here are old timers. Whom I respect 100%... But I want to give you a 20 age group opinion on the news today.


They ruled today Banning Sports Betting was unconstitutional. This now gives rights to horse tracks to introduce sports betting at the tracks. To conclude this gives Horse Tracks many routes to improve. I'll explain why....

1.) Youth Bettors like myself see a better percentage ROI on sports betting. You can play a lock on a basketball or football game compared to playing a 5 horse field with likely chances the 4/5 shot wins... So introducing Sports Betting is going to bring youth bettors to the horse track. 100% certain

2.) So how do we get them to play horse races? Its simple! We introduce large horse fields(racing secretaries can do this if they get off there ass), screw the 5 horse fields its a losing money fight.
- Introduce More Jackpot Wagers With A Max of $50 wagered on the bet. This gets rid of the whales. Young bettors will wager on bets they see value in(I and My Drinking Buddies Do This; All 20 to 27yo) Take for example Fantasy Sports, Spend $10 to win $500,000....

3.) Get rid of the Live Odds and Probables 10 to 20 minutes before Post. This will get rid of your $2 to $20 bettors betting on the favorite. This will diversify the odds

4.) Make it where you can buy a voucher at the track. Download a app... Enter in a passcode, and upload that money onto an app and wager on your phone. Youth hate waiting in lines.

5.) Keep beer affordable, free programs, free admission


This is the biggest opportunity for the horse racing industry to revive itself to the gamblers... For a long time we have taken care of the horsemen with a welfare logic. These horsemen have no done a damn thing for horse racing. Screw them is my logic here. Take care of your customers

Thanks for reading guys.

Even if you were a real entity, and not merely an ad for a pointless website, your logic is conceptually flawed.


Horse racing is to sports betting what slot machines are to horse racing - people want fast action, and the idea of sitting around for 3 hours awaiting one result is a relative snooze-fest.

"More jackpot wagers" are what have just about buried horse racing over the last few decades - so that is a complete step in the wrong direction.


And now, the granddaddy of 'em all:

If you don't post the odds after 15 or 20 minutes to post, no one wagering less than $21 will wager on the favorite (from that moment on??) ????

It sounds as if you needed the entire bunch of drunks to come up with that monumental absurdity.

Either that, or you don't understand parimutuel wagering.



I'm dying to know whether "Get rid of the live odds and probables" means we keep displaying the odds as they were with 16 or 21 mtp, or do we leave the screen blank?

Your silly post surely had no purpose beyond advertising that useless website given that you seem wholly unaware of modern day racing venues already utilizing technology which lets you wager on your phone or on a provided, hand-held device for that purpose.

Affordable beer, free programs, and free admission have long been available to the vast majority of players who play the horses every day, online.


You seem woefully out of touch with all things horse racing.

Those horsemen ARE "horse racing" - they are the ones putting on the show (thus the reason they get to approve or deny simulcast contracts, etc.). Track Management is the middleman with no product and no service to sell, they instead are just standing around with their hands out each and every day, at each and every track in North America.

The group that hasn't done a damn thing for horse racing includes track management teams from every track in the land.


There is simply no way that events of chance which go start-to-finish in 3 hours could possibly revive anything in a setting where events of chance already go start-to-finish in 90 seconds. That would be akin to expecting horse racing to somehow revive slot machine gambling in any way.

Now it is true that state lawmakers may initially decide that only pre-existing dens of iniquity may adopt this new form of gambling, and that may artificially support some factions which optimize all that is left on either side. Eventually, though, the logic will mirror that of casino gaming, where governing bodies will say: "well why should this grand new opportunity be limited to race tracks, which no longer pay the government much of anything? Instead why don't we approve it for every cigar shop and gin joint in our state, and screw horse racing?"


Just how many *hits* to that junky website did you anticipate drawing with your sudden flashes of brilliance shared above?

[cato]

we just need to find the DNA of Pete Rozelle, get it cloned ASAP and put him/it in charge of racing as the commissionser/czar of racing. Failing that - hire any strong creative business person as the commissioner/czar of racing with complete power.

That's pretty much why the NFL and NBA are where they are and why racing is wher it is from a popularity and economic perspective + why it has been virtually impossible to make positive, universal changes in racing....

[JustRalph]

Originally Posted by cato

we just need to find the DNA of Pete Rozelle, get it cloned ASAP and put him/it in charge of racing as the commissionser/czar of racing. Failing that - hire any strong creative business person as the commissioner/czar of racing with complete power.

That's pretty much why the NFL and NBA are where they are and why racing is wher it is from a popularity and economic perspective + why it has been virtually impossible to make positive, universal changes in racing....

Racing is ruled by state governments. Individual entities with their own interests at heart.

Federal oversight will probably never happen because the states would fight it, and probably win in court. Then of course even if you could survive Federal over-sight the Feds would want so much money it could never work.

There is no way to save racing. Government, as usual, is the albatross around the neck of the game.

What’s left of The game is filled with scoundrels and crooks. The good guys have left or passed on.

[castaway01]

Originally Posted by DerbyJackpot

I'm for lowering takeouts.... If states don't lower takeouts for at least a year after injecting more outside revenue into the game, they are giving the biggest "**** You" I've ever seen. At this point I will never bet another dollar on American Racing.... I'll go 100% Hong Kong and Japan.

But again, we've seen this before. When tracks got casinos, they got billions of dollars in revenue. Billions. Which of those tracks cut takeout? None of them.

And Hong Kong takeout is just as high as takeout here, so you're not saving anything by making that move.

I'm also with the group who says this is all going to go online sooner rather than later. Talking about liberal states, conservative states---it's GREEN that matters, not red or blue. Once one state starts online sports betting and increases revenue, the others will follow. That's simple logic.

The one positive of this is that it will enable people to go to a track and bet on sports and racing at the same time. If you find that fun, that's awesome, good for you. But improving the product for those of us who want to bet on horses? There's no reason to believe it.

[castaway01]

Originally Posted by cato

we just need to find the DNA of Pete Rozelle, get it cloned ASAP and put him/it in charge of racing as the commissionser/czar of racing. Failing that - hire any strong creative business person as the commissioner/czar of racing with complete power.

That's pretty much why the NFL and NBA are where they are and why racing is wher it is from a popularity and economic perspective + why it has been virtually impossible to make positive, universal changes in racing....

NFL teams need each other to play against, and to share in that billion-dollar TV contract. Racetracks are independent entities. What you're saying is like asking for the fast food czar to come in and control how McDonald's, Burger King, and Wendy's do business and get them to work together. Do you think McDonald's is going to give the fast food czar power over them?

[Tom]

Originally Posted by cato

we just need to find the DNA of Pete Rozelle, get it cloned ASAP and put him/it in charge of racing as the commissionser/czar of racing. Failing that - hire any strong creative business person as the commissioner/czar of racing with complete power.

That's pretty much why the NFL and NBA are where they are and why racing is wher it is from a popularity and economic perspective + why it has been virtually impossible to make positive, universal changes in racing....

The heck with Rozelle, we need Pete ROSE!
Who else knows more about sports betting than Pete~!

[Tom]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

He is disillusioned about the game...but you've got to admire his sense of humor.

Can't wait for the UNICORN races!

[DerbyJackpot]

Originally Posted by castaway01

But again, we've seen this before. When tracks got casinos, they got billions of dollars in revenue. Billions. Which of those tracks cut takeout? None of them.

And Hong Kong takeout is just as high as takeout here, so you're not saving anything by making that move.

I'm also with the group who says this is all going to go online sooner rather than later. Talking about liberal states, conservative states---it's GREEN that matters, not red or blue. Once one state starts online sports betting and increases revenue, the others will follow. That's simple logic.

The one positive of this is that it will enable people to go to a track and bet on sports and racing at the same time. If you find that fun, that's awesome, good for you. But improving the product for those of us who want to bet on horses? There's no reason to believe it.

Referencing full fields in Hong Kong not takeouts. They are lower than US tracks I do believe though

[DerbyJackpot]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

Hey Derby

It would be great if they could make some tie in or a teaser with an actual horse race

Say someone bets on the Jets to cover against the Dolphins and if they win that bet they’re automatically entered into a win bet with the Favorite or whatever horse they choose in a Stakes race for that day

If they hit both bets they win twice as much or even more this way they now have an interest in the horse race and may venture into the dynamics of handicapping if they so chose

I think the blending of both games would make it attractive for a younger or novice player to get into the game

I love the idea! I actually though Jersey was going to experiment with this? Could of sworn i read an article with something similar to what you said.

[Tom]

Finger LAkes used to have Pick the PRos and Ponies on Sunday.
You pick two races and two games.

Nothing was close to the chicken wings and Sunday racing died.