Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board

Go Back   Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board > Thoroughbred Horse Racing Discussion > Advance Deposit Wagering (ADW)


Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old 02-23-2013, 01:29 AM   #1
mikejlb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: so calif
Posts: 121
Rep Power: 18 mikejlb is on a distinguished road
Twin Spires

Today is Friday, Feb 22, 2013. I put in a conditional wager today at FGX at 5/2 odds at 0 MTP. The horse won but they left it green all day and didn't pay it. The closing odds on my bet was 5/2 and I do not know what zero to post time odds were. I called Twin Spires this evening and the lady sent my bet to a higher support level because she did not know what went wrong. She called me back and told me that higher level person said that my condition was 5/2 and odds at 0 MTP was 7/2 and I told her that means the bet goes because it's higher than 5/2 minimum odds. She said she would call me back again after talking to someone again. The next call she read off some military times and told me I had past posted the bet so it didn't go. I asked why the system didn't kick it back with an error message that "betting was closed" and she said the computer system was down for a time today. I told her the system wouldn't accept any bets if it was down. She said they would credit my amount bet and cancel the bet.

I can understand why they don't want to pay because the pool has settled and it's too late unless they care about "good will". She will email me some post times and what time I made the bet but I really don't think I'll collect on this one. I realize that zero minutes to post the odds might have been lower than 5/2 and then my bet wouldn't have gone but then I would have seen "Failed" in the records. I thought about asking you guys if anyone else bet that race and remembered the 0 MTP odds but they have already stated 7/2 so and they just aren't going to pay regardless of conditions or past post records that might be in my favor. The moral of the story might be to use 1 minute to post or greater rather than zero MTP.
mikejlb is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-24-2013, 10:10 PM   #2
PaceAdvantage
PA Steward
 
PaceAdvantage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 64,917
Rep Power: 190 PaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond repute
I don't understand why these places don't allow for the option to continue PAST the 0MTP mark...we all know races sometimes go off WELL AFTER the 0mtp point...why don't these conditional betting systems such as the one TwinSpires uses continue to monitor the pool after 0mtp, when the horse might drift up and trigger the conditional bet?
PaceAdvantage is online now   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-25-2013, 12:01 AM   #3
duncan04
Let's go Reds!!
 
duncan04's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,975
Rep Power: 12 duncan04 is on a distinguished road
You got refunded your bet. Live and learn. lol
__________________
The less you bet the more you lose when you win!!
duncan04 is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-25-2013, 09:06 AM   #4
dkithore
Registered User
 
dkithore's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Thailand
Posts: 599
Rep Power: 14 dkithore will become famous soon enough
Mikejlb,

I commend you for trying to do the right thing. It appears that there is a lack of clarity, competence and accountability among other things on their part.

I want to learn how to do it too but worried about what you are experiencing nay happen to me too.

DK
dkithore is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-25-2013, 12:11 PM   #5
TexasDolly
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 495
Rep Power: 17 TexasDolly is just really niceTexasDolly is just really niceTexasDolly is just really niceTexasDolly is just really niceTexasDolly is just really nice
Quote:
Originally Posted by duncan04
You got refunded your bet. Live and learn. lol
It didn't sound like his bet was deducted in the first place ,so what did they refund ? Or did they actually pay him his fair price ?
TexasDolly is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-25-2013, 03:42 PM   #6
LAP_520
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Catskill Mtns, Delaware County in NYS
Posts: 2,849
Rep Power: 11 LAP_520 is on a distinguished road
"and she said the computer system was down for a time today."

I can confirm that Twinspires was down on FRIDAY, Feb 22nd, 2013.....that is after I waited 15 minutes on the telephone to Twinspires to see why I could not log back in after "Session expired" appeared ... then "login you enter is not accepted" message appeared.

Finally, a person took my call and said the server was down throughout the Nation...if I wanted to make a bet, he would transfer me to an agent ..but no guarantee the bet would be made....

Funny thing is -----that this is the same day that someone or a group hit the Rainbow 10 cent Pick 6 for 3.59 million dollars...(.the bet was made at Meadowlands.)

About half an hour later, I was able to log into Twinspires.


My thinking is they were having issues with the server all day long and it finally froze......

Last edited by LAP_520; 02-25-2013 at 03:45 PM.
LAP_520 is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-25-2013, 03:56 PM   #7
Robert Goren
Racing Form Detective
 
Robert Goren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lincoln, Ne but my heart is at Santa Anita
Posts: 16,316
Rep Power: 31 Robert Goren has a spectacular aura aboutRobert Goren has a spectacular aura aboutRobert Goren has a spectacular aura about
I had problems with Twinspires on Friday too.
__________________
Some day in the not too distant future, horse players will betting on computer generated races over the net. Race tracks will become casinos and shopping centers. And some crooner will be belting out "there used to be a race track here".
Robert Goren is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-25-2013, 07:44 PM   #8
turninforhome10
Registered User
 
turninforhome10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 2,815
Rep Power: 12 turninforhome10 is on a distinguished road
I use the windows media feed to output to a twin monitor I have in order to have one monitor dedicated to the feed and one to my software. The time difference between the windows media feed and the live track feed is about 30 seconds up to 2 mins. So try this. Use Twinspires classic and twinspires express, open up feeds from both of them and notice the big delay.
turninforhome10 is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-25-2013, 08:48 PM   #9
Robert Goren
Racing Form Detective
 
Robert Goren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lincoln, Ne but my heart is at Santa Anita
Posts: 16,316
Rep Power: 31 Robert Goren has a spectacular aura aboutRobert Goren has a spectacular aura aboutRobert Goren has a spectacular aura about
There is lot of things about conditional betting that aren't clear. (In fact there is alot thing about MTP that aren't clear either.) Is the bet sent at the first instant that the MTP goes to zero or is it after the first odds change after the MTP flips to zero? Does this vary from ADW to ADW? These are answers you should know if you do conditional betting.
__________________
Some day in the not too distant future, horse players will betting on computer generated races over the net. Race tracks will become casinos and shopping centers. And some crooner will be belting out "there used to be a race track here".

Last edited by Robert Goren; 02-25-2013 at 08:50 PM.
Robert Goren is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-25-2013, 08:59 PM   #10
PaceAdvantage
PA Steward
 
PaceAdvantage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 64,917
Rep Power: 190 PaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond reputePaceAdvantage has a reputation beyond repute
Whenever the conditional software gets around to noticing it's 0mtp, it checks your bet. If the odds say bet, it bets. If not, your bet gets cancelled.

I contend that you should be able to tell the system to CONTINUE monitoring the odds PAST 0mtp...the software doesn't care if it doesn't know the race has started...if odds should trigger a bet after the race starts, the bet will simply be rejected...

It's very doable, but there are complications apparently with this sort of "betting after 0mtp"
PaceAdvantage is online now   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-25-2013, 10:41 PM   #11
cj
@TimeformUSfigs
 
cj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 44,274
Rep Power: 121 cj has a reputation beyond reputecj has a reputation beyond reputecj has a reputation beyond reputecj has a reputation beyond reputecj has a reputation beyond reputecj has a reputation beyond reputecj has a reputation beyond reputecj has a reputation beyond reputecj has a reputation beyond reputecj has a reputation beyond reputecj has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage
Whenever the conditional software gets around to noticing it's 0mtp, it checks your bet. If the odds say bet, it bets. If not, your bet gets cancelled.

I contend that you should be able to tell the system to CONTINUE monitoring the odds PAST 0mtp...the software doesn't care if it doesn't know the race has started...if odds should trigger a bet after the race starts, the bet will simply be rejected...

It's very doable, but there are complications apparently with this sort of "betting after 0mtp"
Some of them can be set to try after post, but it seems once a bet is rejected it can't be resent. Needless to say there is nothing that can be done with bets that are accepted but then later fail to meet the conditions either.
cj is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-25-2013, 11:32 PM   #12
horses4courses
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 13,543
Rep Power: 0 horses4courses horses4courses horses4courses horses4courses horses4courses horses4courses horses4courses horses4courses horses4courses
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage
Whenever the conditional software gets around to noticing it's 0mtp, it checks your bet. If the odds say bet, it bets. If not, your bet gets cancelled.
I agree that conditional wagering could, and should, be set up more effectively.
However, there is a small distinction to point out with what you say.
There is no bet when you have set up the conditional wager.

No money has been deducted from your account balance until a bet is struck within the odds parameter at 0 mins to post.
There is no cancel, as there was no bet in the first place.

I know.... I'm nitpicking. It's the bookmaker in me.
__________________
You may want to consider
putting me on ignore.
horses4courses is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-26-2013, 10:23 AM   #13
BetPTC
Registered User
 
BetPTC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 263
Rep Power: 10 BetPTC is on a distinguished road
Premier Turf Club is the company that pioneered CONDITIONAL WAGERING and we believe our system is still the best. Just as an example, at BetPTC.com you can place a conditional straight wager (wps) based on conditions. For example, you can place a WIN/PLACE wager based on the win odds. Other sites do not allow this.

As for the minutes to post, we offer the following settings:

MANUAL
20 MTP
18 MTP
15 MTP
12 MTP
10 MTP
5 MTP
3 MTP
2 MTP...

Starting at 2 MTP you can set increments at the 30 second level, all the way down to -2 MTP

1:30 MTP
1:00 MTP
0:30 MTP
0:00 MTP
-0:30 MTP
-1:00 MTP
-1:30 MTP
-2:00 MTP

If you want to experience a wagering site that caters to ALL levels of players, offers real CASH BACK on each and every bet, and offers the best conditional wagering experience on the web, please check out BetPTC.com, Racing's Best Kept Service. Enter promo code "PACE" and get a $100 new member bonus.

*unfortunately, accounts are not available in CA, NV, NJ, TX or IL.
__________________
PREMIER TURF CLUB
"Racing's Best Kept Secret"
www.betptc.com
U.S. licensed and regulated in the state of Oregon
Over $300 Million in wagers handled since 2007
Online and phone wagering on over 180 tracks
1-877-880-0588

The only ADW offering same-day, instant cash back on wagers.
BetPTC is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-26-2013, 11:27 PM   #14
Hosshead
It's A Photo-Ying & Yang
 
Hosshead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,292
Rep Power: 19 Hosshead is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by BetPTC
Premier Turf Club is the company that pioneered CONDITIONAL WAGERING and we believe our system is still the best. Just as an example, at BetPTC.com you can place a conditional straight wager (wps) based on conditions. For example, you can place a WIN/PLACE wager based on the win odds. Other sites do not allow this.

As for the minutes to post, we offer the following settings:

MANUAL
20 MTP
18 MTP
15 MTP
12 MTP
10 MTP
5 MTP
3 MTP
2 MTP...

Starting at 2 MTP you can set increments at the 30 second level, all the way down to -2 MTP

1:30 MTP
1:00 MTP
0:30 MTP
0:00 MTP
-0:30 MTP
-1:00 MTP
-1:30 MTP
-2:00 MTP

If you want to experience a wagering site that caters to ALL levels of players, offers real CASH BACK on each and every bet, and offers the best conditional wagering experience on the web, please check out BetPTC.com, Racing's Best Kept Service. Enter promo code "PACE" and get a $100 new member bonus.

*unfortunately, accounts are not available in CA, NV, NJ, TX or IL.
Can you specify: " Must Be Favorite " or " Must Not Be Favorite" ?
Seems like an easy thing to do.
_______________________________________________
Hosshead is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-28-2013, 08:26 PM   #15
mikejlb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: so calif
Posts: 121
Rep Power: 18 mikejlb is on a distinguished road
They sent a pdf file showing the the time the race went off but that is really irrelevant because the time is in military time 17:06:34 or 5:06 pm. The 5th FGX on Feb 22 went off at 7:06 pm. I don't think the problem is about past post at all because I had my bet down 2 hours early. I think someone screwed up and they did a lousy job of making excuses.

The advice about saying "live & learn" is the best advice. I learned something about Twinspires and withdrew my money. I'm a small bettor and they won't miss me and that's ok too because I don't care.

Some of these places could learn a lot about business from the old books that we used before internet. When you hit the bookie with a good week he didn't whine or try to cheat you, instead he bought you a drink and felt good for you. That is called good will. In the meantime there's a lot of places to bet and we really don't have to tolerate someone insulting our intelligence.
mikejlb is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Reply




Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

» Advertisement
» Current Polls
Most useful Factor
Driver - 15.28%
11 Votes
Trainer - 30.56%
22 Votes
Class Rating - 18.06%
13 Votes
Post Position - 11.11%
8 Votes
Earnings - 4.17%
3 Votes
Speed Rating - 16.67%
12 Votes
2yr Win% - 1.39%
1 Vote
Qualifiers - 2.78%
2 Votes
Total Votes: 72
This poll is closed.
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:46 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 1999 - 2020 -- PaceAdvantage.Com -- All Rights Reserved -- Best Viewed in a modern browser @ 1280x720 Resolution Or Higher
We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program
designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.