Bell betters

[Ray2000]

My last chance to bet at an ADW is 45 seconds before some guy's last chance at a Wagering Hub ?

That SUCKS


https://harnessracingupdate.com/2021...-to-questions/

[lamboguy]

Originally Posted by Ray2000

My last chance to bet at an ADW is 45 seconds before some guy's last chance at a Wagering Hub ?

That SUCKS


https://harnessracingupdate.com/2021...-to-questions/

that's life in the big city, if you don't like it, find another game I am told

[Ray2000]

One simple industry wide change is all that's needed.

Close all pools at 1 MTP.

[mike_123_ca]

Originally Posted by Ray2000

One simple industry wide change is all that's needed.

Close all pools at 1 MTP.

Define "1 MTP" in the harness world...The damn jugheads are still in the paddock when the toteboard says 1 MTP. The actual post time is arbitrarily determined by some pinhead 10-12 minutes later.

[Ray2000]

Agree, the dumb MTP system prevents sending in queued bets with conditional minimum odds.

Change my solution to "Close all pools when the starter calls for the horses."

[Sea Biscuit]

Originally Posted by mike_123_ca

Define "1 MTP" in the harness world...The damn jugheads are still in the paddock when the toteboard says 1 MTP. The actual post time is arbitrarily determined by some pinhead 10-12 minutes later.

They believe that delaying the race makes for better handles.

[Gorrex]

No bettor has 45 seconds extra past post to make a wager. Post-Time is quite accurate (except when the judges just forget to press the button).

The comment in the article is about the lag time on TV signals however, that isn't entirely true either.

Satellite TV does have a lag time of up to 45 (Dish etc..).
Streaming through ADWs has a lag time of 1-5 seconds normally.
Other streaming services have different levels of lag time but generally in the 10-20 second range.

As far as odds data...
ON TRACK Tote Boards can be up to 30ish seconds behind actual tote data depending on exact software/hardware used. Some older tote boards have physical limitations of how fast they can update/change even if the software can handle it.

On Track video is similar.. can be anywhere from 0-30 seconds AFTER tote updates. This again highly depends on the software and systems the video companies use to process the tote data. (Note the times on TV above are in addition to this lag timelive video to remote video.. so dish on top of a bad video package can be a minute after actual tote updated odds)

Data displayed on ADWS can be anywhere from 2-90 seconds after tote updates. This entirely depends on the implementation of that specific ADW's software and isn't a tote issue.

All in all.. Much of the odds lag you see today is being caused by the entities consuming the tote data and not the tote systems themselves.

So.. who has the actual upper hand? Most of the time you are right, the computer guys do because they properly consume the tote data and their software is capable of handling rapid changes.

Most of the "A" tracks have upgraded their on track gear enough they can handle it. Tracks with LED tote boards etc.. So on track you're doing good with them. Finally some ADW bettors do just as well as on-track or computer guys for seeing final adjustments.

Lastly.. the one thing those guys have over most is the ability to predict final odds instead of wait for it. They arent holding their bets to see the odds in most cases. They are holding their bets so that others do not see the impact of their wagers on the odds. Look for ways to predict the final odds more than waiting on them.

Last I checked AmWager was still by far the fastest ADW on updating odds (2 seconds average vs average of 45 for others) and the only one showing a calculated predictive odds type. (TRU odds on our PRO platform)

[Ray2000]

Jason


Are you saying (at AmWager) as the horses approach the gate as seen on your video, with 10 seconds to go before the real time bell, I can still press "Place Wager" and it will go through?

[Sea Biscuit]

Here is Al Stanley's Experience with the Bell Bettors. Please note that this was in an era where there were no ADWs.


Plz click on image to enlarge it




Bell_Betting_7.png

[Sea Biscuit]

Originally Posted by Sea Biscuit

Here is Al Stanley's Experience with the Bell Bettors. Please note that this was in an era where there were no ADWs.


Plz click on image to enlarge it




Attachment 30317

The image did not come right on my first try. Here is try #2


Bell Betting 12.png

[Gorrex]

Yes, on AmWager and any ADW you can bet until the race is actually posted. That is true at any location. The tote networks are optimized for latency and post is generally the highest priority function. I don't have recent timing but it's extremely low.

If you bet immediately before the lock you could get shut out as it does take some time < 1 second generally to transmit the bet and tote process it. 10 seconds is way more than enough.


If you are watching video at the host track you are seeing post message on video anywhere from 0-30 seconds after it happened. (most now near the 0)

If you are watching streaming on ADW you are seeing post 1-5 seconds after you would have seen it on track. (all US/NA ADWs fairly equal)

If you are watching on other streaming devices it could be anywhere from 10-20 (each service has its own timing etc..)

If you are watching video on Dish (at home or OTB/Track).. you are seeing post up to 45 seconds after you would have seen it on track. (largely due to distance to the satellites and old encoding methods). This latency varies a lot.

[Gorrex]

And to clarify further.

You will see the race closed / post message on AmWager before you see it on video. Similar to odds updates our UIs show that within 1-2 seconds of our tote system posting a race. That isn't an early post, that's the delay in the video.

[vegasone]

You would be surprised how much lag there is even in your house between rooms if you have a few TVs

[Gorrex]

The streaming used on ADWs currently is one thing in racing that is actually bleeding edge. RCN's newest streaming is among the lowest latency/lag streaming out there. (Which I believe all ADWs use now)

It's far superior to satellite or "normal" streaming.

There are a few random ones such as Phenix that can beat it and deliver sub-second latency but that's both rare and not entirely needed.

That said the actual video latency/lag does vary between tracks heavily. I believe this is largely due to the on-track video equipment prior to the signal being handed off to RCN.