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11-20-2010, 06:20 PM
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#31
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 10,166
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stillriledup
No, because the HOY is the best horse, not a horse who just wins races vs weak competition. This is why high school and college pitchers aren't eligible for the major league baseball cy young award. They're good, and they win, but they don't beat adults, so, they're not eligible.
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You realize you're describing Zenyatta, right??
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11-20-2010, 06:23 PM
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#32
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 25,607
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by tucker6
You realize you're describing Zenyatta, right??
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Um, Zenyatta just raced a 111 Beyer fig in a 5 million dollar race and lost by a nose. She's beaten grade 1 competition quite often. Maybe you missed the Breeders Cup and didn't see her.
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11-20-2010, 06:26 PM
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#33
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 3,761
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stillriledup
No, because the HOY is the best horse, not a horse who just wins races vs weak competition. This is why high school and college pitchers aren't eligible for the major league baseball cy young award. They're good, and they win, but they don't beat adults, so, they're not eligible.
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Exactly, ergo no HOY for Zenyatta.
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11-20-2010, 06:28 PM
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#34
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 10,166
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stillriledup
Um, Zenyatta just raced a 111 Beyer fig in a 5 million dollar race and lost by a nose. She's beaten grade 1 competition quite often. Maybe you missed the Breeders Cup and didn't see her.
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Is that the race she LOST?? According to you, losers don't win HOY. Remember, close doesn't count.
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11-20-2010, 06:29 PM
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#35
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Gods County, United Kingdom
Posts: 3,533
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stillriledup
No, because the HOY is the best horse, not a horse who just wins races vs weak competition. This is why high school and college pitchers aren't eligible for the major league baseball cy young award. They're good, and they win, but they don't beat adults, so, they're not eligible.
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There were no Quality Road, Blame, Haynesfield, Fly Down etc ability horses in those races ran prior to Classic,
So in 2010, Zenyatta, just won races vs weak competition and as you say, the award should not go to a horses who just wins races vs weak competition.
Last edited by Charlie D; 11-20-2010 at 06:30 PM.
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11-20-2010, 06:29 PM
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#36
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 3,761
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stillriledup
Um, Zenyatta just raced a 111 Beyer fig in a 5 million dollar race and lost by a nose. She's beaten grade 1 competition quite often. Maybe you missed the Breeders Cup and didn't see her.
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Quite often? Quite often? 
Once in the past two years is quite often?
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11-20-2010, 06:44 PM
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#37
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 25,607
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by tucker6
Is that the race she LOST?? According to you, losers don't win HOY. Remember, close doesn't count.
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No, that's not what i said. You need'nt put words in my mouth, although you're trying very hard to do just that. Please, i can speak for myself, i don't need you just randomly deciding what i said and what i didn't say.
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11-20-2010, 06:53 PM
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#38
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PA Steward
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,541
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stillriledup
Um, Zenyatta just raced a 111 Beyer fig in a 5 million dollar race and lost by a nose. She's beaten grade 1 competition quite often. Maybe you missed the Breeders Cup and didn't see her.
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111 Beyers make me yawn.
How sad and desperate we all must be for a true champion, that 111 Beyers are somehow impressive...
Last edited by PaceAdvantage; 11-20-2010 at 06:54 PM.
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11-20-2010, 06:59 PM
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#39
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Gods County, United Kingdom
Posts: 3,533
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What is sad PA imho is, the horse that won the Whitney beating QR, finished second in JCGC to Haynesfield and won Classic beating Zen, QR, Haynesfield, Lookin etc is not HOY in everybodies mind.
Zen has not got anywhere near that achievement on her CV in 2010
Last edited by Charlie D; 11-20-2010 at 07:02 PM.
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11-20-2010, 07:13 PM
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#40
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 95
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Blame gave weight (3lbs) and beating to Zenyatta in the Classic. Off level weights, I think the same horse wins.
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11-20-2010, 07:29 PM
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#41
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 3,898
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stillriledup
No, because the HOY is the best horse, not a horse who just wins races vs weak competition. This is why high school and college pitchers aren't eligible for the major league baseball cy young award. They're good, and they win, but they don't beat adults, so, they're not eligible.
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It is funny-if someone didnt know your pro Zenyatta stance, they would logically think that your entire post was an argument for Blame winning HOY.....
Zenyatta faced the equivalent of high school competition all year, was pointed for one race and couldnt beat a horse who had run against the boys all year long.....
You do realize that you think that a horse that didnt win a non restricted race all year should win HOY, dont you?????? I think one day you will wake up and wonder what the heck you were thinking......
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11-20-2010, 07:30 PM
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#42
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Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 9,893
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Relwob Owner
It is funny-if someone didnt know your pro Zenyatta stance, they would logically think that your entire post was an argument for Blame winning HOY.....
Zenyatta faced the equivalent of high school competition all year, was pointed for one race and couldnt beat a horse who had run against the boys all year long.....
You do realize that you think that a horse that didnt win a non restricted race all year should win HOY, dont you?????? I think one day you will wake up and wonder what the heck you were thinking......
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Please stop applying logic.
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11-20-2010, 08:48 PM
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#43
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 25,607
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Relwob Owner
It is funny-if someone didnt know your pro Zenyatta stance, they would logically think that your entire post was an argument for Blame winning HOY.....
Zenyatta faced the equivalent of high school competition all year, was pointed for one race and couldnt beat a horse who had run against the boys all year long.....
You do realize that you think that a horse that didnt win a non restricted race all year should win HOY, dont you?????? I think one day you will wake up and wonder what the heck you were thinking......
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More people think Zenyatta is better than Blame than people who think Blame is better than Zenyatta. My logic, trying to keep it simple and cut out all the BS, is that the better horse (or, the best horse) should be HOY.
I don't want to turn this into a rocket science debate, the better horse should be HOY.
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11-20-2010, 08:58 PM
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#44
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 10,166
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stillriledup
More people think Zenyatta is better than Blame than people who think Blame is better than Zenyatta. My logic, trying to keep it simple and cut out all the BS, is that the better horse (or, the best horse) should be HOY.
I don't want to turn this into a rocket science debate, the better horse should be HOY.
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How could anyone make that statement if Blame won their only meeting fair and square?? You're trying to make it simple by leaving out the facts and stick to emotion. HOY voters should be looking at the numbers, and if they do, Blame wins this easy.
If Fence Bored sees this, maybe he'll re-post his 2010 numbers for Blame and Zenyatta for you since you may have missed them.
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11-20-2010, 09:09 PM
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#45
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 3,898
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Stillriledup
More people think Zenyatta is better than Blame than people who think Blame is better than Zenyatta. My logic, trying to keep it simple and cut out all the BS, is that the better horse (or, the best horse) should be HOY.
I don't want to turn this into a rocket science debate, the better horse should be HOY.
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You say that more people think Zenyatta is better than Blame....where are you getting this info from and who are these people? Do you usually make all of your decisions based on what others think or from performances on the track? Do you bet the favorite in every race since most people think that horse is the best??????
Just to confirm-more people think that a horse that didnt win a non restricted all year should be HOY and you are taking that as a reason to believe it? Strange.........I still maintain one day in the not so distant future, it will hit you like a bolt of lightning that you are way, way out of touch with reality as far as Zenyatta is concerned.
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