Robert B. Lewis Entries

[dilanesp]

One of the weird things about this discussion is that it's not like there's this gigantic reserve of California stakes class 3 year olds not trained by Bob Baffert.

[Andy Asaro]

Twitter

[GMB@BP]

Amazing how some people so casually accuse riders of race fixing, as was done in that linked post.

[Tessablue]

Sky Kingdom is probably the most famous and blatant Baffert team-up, but it's not all that uncommon. Medina Spirit was clearly aiding Life is Good in the 2021 San Felipe, to the point that people talked about it as a betting angle before the Derby. Azul Coast was later ridden to help Medina Spirit in the 2021 Awesome Again by floating Tripoli, the second favorite, wide (watch the 6):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NtMegrnHofY

Armagnac was throttled back off of Messier and Taiba in last year's SA Derby, and Ax Man was held early in the 2020 San Diego, which gave Maximum Security the lead (watch the 2, who was previously a speed horse):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6lA2thjQUE

.

This is just off the top of my head. I don't know why anyone would bother betting this race.

[the little guy]

The history of racing is littered with races where a trainer ran two speed horses in a race and didn't send one after the other. What it's not littered with is the opposite.

CJ suggested the Sky Kingdom race and I don't disagree. Not burying one speed with another is logical. Heck, Brad Cox got second in last year's Pegasus by not sending Knicks Go against Life is Good. He got second instead of nothing.

As an aside, you're not allowed to yell at me later for bringing you out of a five plus year shell of no posting:-) Always nice to see you.

[Tessablue]

Ha, well, I can't resist the opportunity to stir up trouble! I'd argue there's a difference between not sending and pulling a speed horse five lengths back off a sharp start, but I can see the argument that figuring out which stablemate will be sent is just another handicapping consideration. Still, one might suggest that there's a greater issue at hand here if horses are so consolidated amongst top trainers that this has become a relatively common bit of calculus.

Good to see you too. At least give me Azul Coast, though

[the little guy]

Years blend into each other, but didn’t Bob do the same thing with Medina Spirit in the Classic against Knicks Go ( which enabled him to get second )? Different trainers would likely use similar tactics. However, it’s also fair to say it can ( at the very least ) be a bad look. You throw in the current environment where Bob is getting blamed for everything going back to the Lindberg baby, and I guess this is what you get. In some ways I can see why some will say Bob brought it on himself with his reckless behavior, but that doesn’t mean there isn’t a sane and reasonable side.

To me, the problem with the hand wringing over the four horse Bobfest, is that there are no CA horses traveling to the other jurisdictions to avoid Bob. Seems to me that for whatever reasons, no other trainers out West have any significant Derby prospects. It’s not like they don’t have other horses, they just aren’t seemingly on the TC trail.

[Robert Fischer]

Twitter

__________________
Preparation. Discipline. Patience. Decisiveness.

[Andy Asaro]

Originally Posted by GMB@BP

Amazing how some people so casually accuse riders of race fixing, as was done in that linked post.

They're following instructions.

[Andy Asaro]

Originally Posted by the little guy

Years blend into each other, but didn’t Bob do the same thing with Medina Spirit in the Classic against Knicks Go ( which enabled him to get second )? Different trainers would likely use similar tactics. However, it’s also fair to say it can ( at the very least ) be a bad look. You throw in the current environment where Bob is getting blamed for everything going back to the Lindberg baby, and I guess this is what you get. In some ways I can see why some will say Bob brought it on himself with his reckless behavior, but that doesn’t mean there isn’t a sane and reasonable side.

To me, the problem with the hand wringing over the four horse Bobfest, is that there are no CA horses traveling to the other jurisdictions to avoid Bob. Seems to me that for whatever reasons, no other trainers out West have any significant Derby prospects. It’s not like they don’t have other horses, they just aren’t seemingly on the TC trail.

Shut up and bet.....right Andy?

[Brisk Urging]

Last 10 years 5 Horse of the Year, 6 Derby winners and 6 BC Classic winners were all primarily based there toss in 2 TC winners..

Best dirt horses still reside in Cali

[Robert Fischer]

Dominant trainers who frequently run uncoupled entries also build loyalties from a few of the top jocks in the colony.
Even the most moral supertrainers, and billionaire owners are going to see loyalties form.
Another thing we don't speak of.



The amateur sleuths do really a bad job with their Twitter conspiracy theories. It's good to see rides and such questioned, but beyond occasional failure to persevere, it's strictly entertainment.

The knowledgeable people with a voice in the industry tend to view the glass half full, and are wise enough not to rant against the top owners and trainers on things that mostly can't be proven, and can only hurt the game.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by the little guy

To me, the problem with the hand wringing over the four horse Bobfest, is that there are no CA horses traveling to the other jurisdictions to avoid Bob. Seems to me that for whatever reasons, no other trainers out West have any significant Derby prospects. It’s not like they don’t have other horses, they just aren’t seemingly on the TC trail.

It's not that they don't have them due to some random distribution of talent "this year". They don't have them because the wealthiest owners are giving so many of the best prospects to a handful of trainers. In CA, Baffert gets almost all of the best dirt prospects.

Fix that and we might get a 5-6 horse field instead of a 4 horse field and we wouldn't have as many discussions about riding tactics.

I'm with you on the Bob hate. I think it's overdone. But this is a problem with no easy solution. I can't even toss out a suggestion for people to rip apart that's consistent with my beliefs about business. It's just not good for anyone other than maybe Baffert and his owners that he gets so many of the best horses.

[Sheffwed]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

It's not that they don't have them due to some random distribution of talent "this year". They don't have them because the wealthiest owners are giving so many of the best prospects to a handful of trainers. In CA, Baffert gets almost all of the best dirt prospects.

Fix that and we might get a 5-6 horse field instead of a 4 horse field and we wouldn't have as many discussions about riding tactics.

I'm with you on the Bob hate. I think it's overdone. But this is a problem with no easy solution. I can't even toss out a suggestion for people to rip apart that's consistent with my beliefs about business. It's just not good for anyone other than maybe Baffert and his owners that he gets so many of the best horses.

this would never happen in Hong Kong, the most successful racing jurisdiction in the world

where there's a will, there will be a way

conclusion: for whatever reason, there's no will

so instead we get racing dominated by banned trainers, it's a f***ing disaster

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by the little guy

To me, the problem with the hand wringing over the four horse Bobfest, is that there are no CA horses traveling to the other jurisdictions to avoid Bob. Seems to me that for whatever reasons, no other trainers out West have any significant Derby prospects.

This.