Steven Roman - Dosage Index, Leaving the game

[Tom]

Try studying records over a period of time longer than a few decades. The obvious might sink in.

The "obvious sank in" in this thread a long time ago.
Talk about anal obsessive.

[whodoyoulike]

Originally Posted by Cratos

Quote from the Internet

“The title of "Doctor" belongs truly more to someone with a Ph.D. than to an M.D. Academia doesn't have problems with anyone who calls themselves Dr. So and So when their doctorate isn't a Ph.D. but consider it arrogant for a medical professional such as an M.D. to say that they are "a doctor" or tries to imply that only members of their profession has that right. ...

Bottom line...address a Ph.D. as Dr. (Last Name). They have the ultimate right to that title. Ironically, many just prefer to be called by their name.”

I didn't think to look it up on the internet. But, I guess even there you can find differing views such as the one from Wikepedia. My response was based on my opinion which I've had for a number of years.

...

United States[edit]

In the United States, the use of the title "Doctor" is dependent upon the professional setting. Holders of a doctoral level degree are generally required to disclose this in medical fields to avoid confusion between health care professionals and other Doctors of Philosophy (PhDs) or equivalent doctorate holders.[36][37][38][39] The title is also commonly used socially by those holding a doctoral-level degree;[40] however, there is a division between Letitia Baldrige and Miss Manners on its social usage by those who are not physicians.[41] Baldrige sees this usage as acceptable. In contrast, Miss Manners writes that "only people of the medical profession correctly use the title of doctor socially," but supports those who wish to use it in social contexts in the spirit of addressing people according to their wishes.[41][42] However, recent publications from the office of the President of the United States of America refer to Ph.D. level scientists as Dr. Soandso [43][44] Though lawyers in the United States do not customarily use such a title, the law degree in that country is the Juris Doctor, a professional doctorate,[45] and some J.D. holders in the United States use the title of doctor in professional[46] and academic situations.[47] ...

[johnhannibalsmith]

Here's my rule of thumb: Unless it offends you deeply to do so, refer to someone by the title that they prefer if you are aware of such a title. Most people will tell you to call them Jack or Jane if you have a non-professional relationship, but if they use the title Doctor or Mayor or Mister or Madam or whatever, then it's just a matter of courtesy to oblige them. Some think of it as an entitlement that comes with having spent more money and time at school, but most have earned the title and use it as a formal title in everyday life because that's just the way that it is. As much as it may come across as condescending to refer to oneself as doctor in a non-clinical setting, it comes off as twice as condescending to deliberately refer them to as Mister when you are well aware of the fact that they use the formal title Doctor.

Again, just my opinion on this detour.

[clocker7]

For those who maintain that the breed can't change over a relatively short period of time, here are some reference points:

http://athena.uky.edu/cgi/t/text/pag....8;passterms=1

http://athena.uky.edu/cgi/t/text/pag....3;passterms=1

[VigorsTheGrey]

Originally Posted by Cratos

I disagree in part with your criticism of Roman’s methodology.

At its inception Roman’s methodology made statistical sense and was predictable when sires were limited to covering 32-36 mares per breeding season and the big farms dominated the TC races by breeding prized stallions to their very good mares.

This is not to say that the breeding today is inferior to yesteryear’s breeding, but it is to say that it is different and doesn’t fit Roman’s Dosage model.

As you very well might know that statistics is not a science but an evolving data driven methodology underlined by many of the other sciences.

Therefore many concepts put forth in racing today for handicapping and breeding is inept because of statistical evolution and modernization or lack of supporting science.

Underlined? Don't you mean to say......data driven methodology underlying many of the other sciences?

[Cratos]

Originally Posted by VigorsTheGrey

Underlined? Don't you mean to say......data driven methodology underlying many of the other sciences?

You are correct; it is the science behind the data and not the data behind the science. Thanks for the correction

[Fager Fan]

Originally Posted by johnhannibalsmith

Here's my rule of thumb: Unless it offends you deeply to do so, refer to someone by the title that they prefer if you are aware of such a title. Most people will tell you to call them Jack or Jane if you have a non-professional relationship, but if they use the title Doctor or Mayor or Mister or Madam or whatever, then it's just a matter of courtesy to oblige them. Some think of it as an entitlement that comes with having spent more money and time at school, but most have earned the title and use it as a formal title in everyday life because that's just the way that it is. As much as it may come across as condescending to refer to oneself as doctor in a non-clinical setting, it comes off as twice as condescending to deliberately refer them to as Mister when you are well aware of the fact that they use the formal title Doctor.

Again, just my opinion on this detour.

If someone were to correct me to call them a doctor, then it's likely I won't oblige the rudeness.

[johnhannibalsmith]

Originally Posted by Fager Fan

If someone were to correct me to call them a doctor, then it's likely I won't oblige the rudeness.

I wasn't really thinking of that scenario in my example, but okay.

[The Judge]

Russian Fox Experiment turned wild foxes into fluffy tailed,multi- colored dog like creatures by breeding, fox's who seem to be less aggressive than others where bred to one another. Dog like appearances and behavior took a surprisingly short time period.

Check U-tube more than one- the one I like foxes were. Black and white. They became spotted fluffy tailed and dog like.

[PaceAdvantage]

Originally Posted by whodoyoulike

I think the use of Dr. when you have a PhD is usually acceptable only in certain situations e.g., within an educational organization, an official response regarding some question or presenting a paper on a topic within his field of study, etc. To use this title on a website such as on here (horse racing) would be inappropriate IMO.

If he was your next door neighbor, would you always address him as Dr. everytime you see him?

Now, a person with an MD IMO would be okay to address him as Dr. everytime you acknowledge him. A person with a PhD in Music would cause needless confusion being addressed as Dr. in most situations.

I guess many of you have never known a PhD...

Like I said, some of you are piling on just for the sake of it...this is a ridiculous discussion. It's commonplace to refer to most people who hold doctorate degrees as DOCTOR, whether medical or otherwise (psychologists come immediately to mind). Lawyers are one of the lone exceptions I can think of (Juris Doctor degree).

[reckless]

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage

I guess many of you have never known a PhD...

Like I said, some of you are piling on just for the sake of it...this is a ridiculous discussion. It's commonplace to refer to most people who hold doctorate degrees as DOCTOR, whether medical or otherwise (psychologists come immediately to mind). Lawyers are one of the lone exceptions I can think of (Juris Doctor degree).

Is it the same as this... my favorite Seinfeld scene, of many.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7APrz5K1YI

[PaceAdvantage]

Originally Posted by reckless

Is it the same as this... my favorite Seinfeld scene, of many.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7APrz5K1YI

Pretty good....pretty...pretty....pretty...pretty good...

[Parkview_Pirate]

Roman's "manifesto" is well written, but we can only make assumptions on its purpose. If his goal is to provide a wake up call to industry insiders, then I'll cut him some slack on a couple of comments.

His views on race day meds though, IMHO, are spot on - if any progress is made towards eliminating drugs in racing via his views, we'll all owe him thanks.

[Lemon Drop Husker]

If we all made a contribution to horse racing like Steve, then the racing world would be a much better place.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by Cratos

In all due apologies you are very wrong about PhDs being common outside of the review of their academic peers. PhDs recipients are the quintessential “thinkers” of the world and thought of as such no matter what endeavor that they become involved in.

Of ALL the things you said in this thread, Cratos, this is the most wrong. (It's basically the informal fallacy of "appeal to authority".)

MANY of the people brought up on charges of snake oil medicine and related fraud changes every year have doctoral degrees. Having a doctoral degree proves NOTHING about the actual truth of what a person says, when you are outside of the "doctor's" particular academic or vocational specialty.

But thank you for proving my original point-- which was you were deliberately using "DOCTOR Roman" to make this guy sound more credible than he was.