Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board

Go Back   Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board > Off Topic > Off Topic - Trading The Financial Markets


Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread
Old 11-30-2017, 06:27 PM   #1
Tape Reader
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,131
S&P top?

I’ll start. I say we are at a top or at least a short term correction.
Tape Reader is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 12-01-2017, 09:40 PM   #2
barahona44
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Diez meses en Port St. Lucie, FL; two months in the Dominican Republic
Posts: 4,355
S & P off 0.2 % today blamed on Flynn's guilty plea. I'd hate to see what will happens if a few big companies miss their earnings forecasts.

I agree with you.A lame excuse like that to explain an off-day might be a bad sign.
__________________
"But don't ask me what I think of you, I might not give the answer that you want me to. "

Fleetwood Mac, Oh Well, Part 1 (1969)
barahona44 is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 12-04-2017, 09:25 AM   #3
sour grapes
Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 248
Quote:
Originally Posted by barahona44 View Post
S & P off 0.2 % today blamed on Flynn's guilty plea. I'd hate to see what will happens if a few big companies miss their earnings forecasts.

I agree with you.A lame excuse like that to explain an off-day might be a bad sign.
a lot have people have lost their shirts calling for a top from 15k.
sour grapes is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 12-04-2017, 02:47 PM   #4
_______
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Washoe County, Nevada
Posts: 2,253
Bond yields are not signaling a recession. I understand the urge to find a reason to hate a market that has gone up for 8 years but I think you’ll see better earnings and possibly even some more p/e expansion over the next 4 quarters.

I’m not a trader but you might see a short term drop when tax reform is signed (selling the news). But otherwise I’ll wait for an inverted yield curve before I get worried. It could come next year if the Fed keeps raising short term rates. But historically the market has run up for quite a while even after the curve inverts.
_______ is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 12-04-2017, 03:23 PM   #5
lamboguy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,654
Quote:
Originally Posted by _______ View Post
Bond yields are not signaling a recession. I understand the urge to find a reason to hate a market that has gone up for 8 years but I think you’ll see better earnings and possibly even some more p/e expansion over the next 4 quarters.

I’m not a trader but you might see a short term drop when tax reform is signed (selling the news). But otherwise I’ll wait for an inverted yield curve before I get worried. It could come next year if the Fed keeps raising short term rates. But historically the market has run up for quite a while even after the curve inverts.
the yield curve has been flattening, the 30 year is only 40 basis points more than the 10 year now. in the past that has signaled a recession is on the horizon. today i don't know what it means, because there is no such thing as conventional wisdom in the markets now.
lamboguy is online now   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 12-06-2017, 05:30 PM   #6
_______
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Washoe County, Nevada
Posts: 2,253
Quote:
Originally Posted by _______ View Post
Bond yields are not signaling a recession. I understand the urge to find a reason to hate a market that has gone up for 8 years but I think you’ll see better earnings and possibly even some more p/e expansion over the next 4 quarters.

I’m not a trader but you might see a short term drop when tax reform is signed (selling the news). But otherwise I’ll wait for an inverted yield curve before I get worried. It could come next year if the Fed keeps raising short term rates. But historically the market has run up for quite a while even after the curve inverts.
On the other hand, E-Trade’s current “Don’t get mad, get even” ads do remind me a little bit too much of their 2000 campaign:


Maybe Tape Reader has a point.
_______ is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 12-06-2017, 06:26 PM   #7
_______
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Washoe County, Nevada
Posts: 2,253
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamboguy View Post
the yield curve has been flattening, the 30 year is only 40 basis points more than the 10 year now. in the past that has signaled a recession is on the horizon. today i don't know what it means, because there is no such thing as conventional wisdom in the markets now.
Hi Lambo.

The traditional yield curve has the 3 month, 6 month, 2 year, and 30 year as data points. The difference between the 10 year and the 30 is probably as important as the difference between the 3 month and 6 month. What you want to look at is when an actual short term rate exceeds the yield on an actual long term rate. You don’t want to compare one long term rate with one even longer term rate.

A flattening yield curve doesn’t always signal a recession. Half the time it signals you are coming out of a recession (when it’s flattening out from being inverted).

But thanks for sharing. Always enjoy your input.
_______ is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-01-2018, 08:55 PM   #8
Tape Reader
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tape Reader View Post
I’ll start. I say we are at a top or at least a short term correction.
I will bump this thread. What say you?
Tape Reader is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-02-2018, 12:51 PM   #9
reckless
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: near Philadelphia
Posts: 4,560
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tape Reader View Post
I will bump this thread. What say you?
I think we concluding this correction, which began on Monday(?), Tuesday(?) of this week.

Today's down market is the blow-off. You could start buying now.

But what do I know?
reckless is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-02-2018, 02:27 PM   #10
PaceAdvantage
PA Steward
 
PaceAdvantage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,176
If 1/22 was a real top, there really should have been a lot more volume...it was an average volume day at best...tough to believe that was the top that indicated a massive correction is coming.
PaceAdvantage is online now   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-02-2018, 03:48 PM   #11
reckless
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: near Philadelphia
Posts: 4,560
FWIW, since no one really cares ...

I bought some Apple, Discovery Communications, Viacom, Sinclair Broadcasting, Tegna, and General Electric late this afternoon.

We'll know by Wednesday afternoon if this was a good idea ...
reckless is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-02-2018, 03:58 PM   #12
lamboguy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Boston+Ocala
Posts: 23,654
the precious metals are going for the program as well today.
lamboguy is online now   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-03-2018, 05:10 PM   #13
Saratoga_Mike
Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 9,893
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage View Post
If 1/22 was a real top, there really should have been a lot more volume...it was an average volume day at best...tough to believe that was the top that indicated a massive correction is coming.
I thought this was an interesting post, so I went back to market peaks from two past cycles (mid to late March 2000 and early October 2007). Volume did not spike at those junctures. I'm using S&P 500 volume in both instances. Perhaps Nasdaq volume spiked in March 2000. I'll need to check that.

If the long bond moves from roughly 2.8% (currently) to 4%, I'm not sure how that's equity friendly. MV=PQ. The Fed and other central banks have ramped "M" significantly over the past 10 years, and that ramp resulted in almost no inflationary pressures. Why? V (i.e., animal spirits [confidence] were absent). What if V now returns and starts to translate into a higher P (price/inflation). Year-over-year wage growth was 2.9% last month, the highest since 2009. Nominal GDP is arguably running at 5% to 6%. Given those two data points, a 4% long bond doesn't seem crazy to me.
Saratoga_Mike is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-03-2018, 07:18 PM   #14
Ocala Mike
Registered User
 
Ocala Mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 5,005
Big bounce Monday?
Ocala Mike is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 02-03-2018, 10:20 PM   #15
PaceAdvantage
PA Steward
 
PaceAdvantage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,176
The market can go down some more and I still won't be blinking an eye...it hasn't even touched the halfway mark of the run-up that started in November of 2016. The S&P has to drop another 160+ points for that to happen...and that would erase only half of what's happened in the last year plus...

So again, this current drop is pretty much nothing...and on zero extra volume to boot...
PaceAdvantage is online now   Reply With Quote Reply
Reply




Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

» Advertisement
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:10 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 1999 - 2023 -- PaceAdvantage.Com -- All Rights Reserved
We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program
designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.