Religion III

[dnlgfnk]

Originally Posted by Actor

Are you saying that only the Abrahamic religions have the concept of one true god? I seriously doubt it.

Woden's anthropomorphic properties indicate that he is composed of parts- is composite. That requires a metaphysically ultimate first principle beyond himself, because those parts (whether physical, or metaphysical [matter-form, potency-act, essence-existence]) would be ontologically prior to Woden.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Actor

Are you saying that only the Abrahamic religions have the concept of one true god? I seriously doubt it.

Only the Abrahamic religion of the bible has the correct concept of the one true God. Islam does not hold to the Trinitarian concept of the one true God. God, as portrayed in the Word of God, is Three Persons in one God.

[dnlgfnk]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Only the Abrahamic religion of the bible has the correct concept of the one true God. Islam does not hold to the Trinitarian concept of the one true God. God, as portrayed in the Word of God, is Three Persons in one God.

We're dealing in philosophy. The Trinity is Revelation, and a much steeper series of deductions before arriving at Christianity itself. Positing Woden as a possible god would have done no damage to Avicenna's theism...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avicenna

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by dnlgfnk

We're dealing in philosophy. The Trinity is Revelation, and a much steeper series of deductions before arriving at Christianity itself. Positing Woden as a possible god would have done no damage to Avicenna's theism...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avicenna

But Actor's question ignored biblical revelation. There is no philosophy or worldly religion on this little green planet that would posit Trinitarianism. This is what makes Islam's version of monotheism false.

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

There is no philosophy or worldly religion on this little green planet that would posit Trinitarianism. This is what makes Islam's version of monotheism false.

Your ignorance of other religions is as infinite as God. You want Trinity in religion including Islam,how much time have you got?


Brahma, Vishnu, and Shiva in Hinduism

Sahā Triad - Shakyamuni, Avalokitesvara and Ksitigarbha in Mahayana Buddhism

Three Pure Ones in Taoism

The triad of Al-Lat, Al-Uzza, and Manat in the time of Mohammed (Holy Qu'ran (Abdullah Yusuf Ali translation), Surah 53:19-22)

Amaterasu, Tsukuyomi and Susanoo in Shinto.

Triad of Osiris (husband), Isis (wife), and Horus (son)

The Classical Greek Olympic triad of Zeus (king of the gods), Athena (goddess of war and intellect) and Apollo (god of the sun, culture and music)

I got many more if you want Oh ignorant one.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

Your ignorance of other religions is as infinite as God. You want Trinity in religion including Islam,how much time have you got?


Brahma, Vishnu, and Shiva in Hinduism

Sahā Triad - Shakyamuni, Avalokitesvara and Ksitigarbha in Mahayana Buddhism

Three Pure Ones in Taoism

The triad of Al-Lat, Al-Uzza, and Manat in the time of Mohammed (Holy Qu'ran (Abdullah Yusuf Ali translation), Surah 53:19-22)

Amaterasu, Tsukuyomi and Susanoo in Shinto.

Triad of Osiris (husband), Isis (wife), and Horus (son)

The Classical Greek Olympic triad of Zeus (king of the gods), Athena (goddess of war and intellect) and Apollo (god of the sun, culture and music)

I got many more if you want Oh ignorant one.

Thanks, but I take a pass on your worldly wisdom which is foolishness to God, as well! Your ignorance of the the scriptures rivals that of a flea's.

None of the examples you have given represent the Trinitarian doctrine of the bible. They are only examples of polytheism, which ran rampant in the ancient world and is still alive and well today in many places. Conversely, the bible teaches strictly monotheism within a trinitarian construct -- Three Distinct Persons in One Godhead.

https://georgesjournal.net/2022/02/0...-christianity/

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Thanks, but I take a pass on your worldly wisdom which is foolishness to God, as well! Your ignorance of the the scriptures rivals that of a flea's.

None of the examples you have given represent the Trinitarian doctrine of the bible. They are only examples of polytheism, which ran rampant in the ancient world and is still alive and well today in many places. Conversely, the bible teaches strictly monotheism within a trinitarian construct -- Three Distinct Persons in One Godhead.

Many for these religions were around before Christianity.

Many for these Trinities were around before Christianity.

These other religions have scriptures as well.

Originally Posted by boxcar

Conversely, the bible teaches strictly monotheism within a trinitarian construct -- Three Distinct Persons in One Godhead.

Other religions are also monotheistic within a trinitarian construct -- Three Distinct Persons in One Godhead. Christianity is nothing new in this respect and is late to the party. Welcome to religion 101.

[Light]

FYI The Christian Trinity was an add on

No early Christian believed the concept of the Trinity. It did not enter into Christianity until after the council at Nicaea in the year 325 CE. That in itself should tell you something. The bible was completed in about 98 CE. Ask yourself: if the actual writers of the bible did not believe the Trinity how did people some 225 years later come up with the idea?

The Trinity is a solution to a problem that had arisen as higher christology developed within the faith. In the synoptic gospels, Jesus is the Son of God, but not divine like the Father; Mark 10:18 even says “Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.” Then,in the second century, John’s Gospel portrays Jesus as divine and pre-existing. Because of its Jewish roots, Christians insisted that Christianity was monotheistic, yet it was coming dangerously close to being a duotheistic religion.

Around the end of the second century, Tertullian came up with an idea quite similar to the Trinity. During the third century, this developed into what we know as the Holy Trinity, which was adopted as doctrine, although against some opposition, at the Council of Nicaea.

The doctrine of the Trinity was of gradual and comparatively late formation. It had its origin in a source entirely foreign from that of the Jewish and Christian Scriptures .It was grafted on Christianity, through the hands of the Plato's followers.

The Platonic trinity, itself merely a rearrangement of older trinities dating back to earlier peoples, appears to be the rational philosophic trinity of attributes that gave birth to the three hypostases or divine persons taught by the Christian churches. This Greek philosopher’s conception of the divine trinity can be found in all the ancient [pagan] religions.

Throughout the ancient world, as far back as Babylonia, the worship of pagan gods grouped in threes, or triads, was common. That influence was also prevalent in Egypt, Greece, and Rome in the centuries before, during, and after Christ

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

Many for these religions were around before Christianity.

Many for these Trinities were around before Christianity.

These other religions have scriptures as well.

You're a pretty dense guy, Mr. Light 'n' Loafers. Quote any scriptures from any of the religions you cited yesterday that teaches that there are Three Persons in ONE God.

Also, the Trinity, while not expressly taught in the OT is, nonetheless, intimated throughout it. And the OT scriptures predate your beloved Far East world religions.

Other religions are also monotheistic within a trinitarian construct -- Three Distinct Persons in One Godhead. Christianity is nothing new in this respect and is late to the party. Welcome to religion 101.

You make the claim, so prove it. All those religions you cited are polytheistic, not monothesitic.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

FYI The Christian Trinity was an add on

No early Christian believed the concept of the Trinity. It did not enter into Christianity until after the council at Nicaea in the year 325 CE. That in itself should tell you something. The bible was completed in about 98 CE. Ask yourself: if the actual writers of the bible did not believe the Trinity how did people some 225 years later come up with the idea?

The Trinity is a solution to a problem that had arisen as higher christology developed within the faith. In the synoptic gospels, Jesus is the Son of God, but not divine like the Father; Mark 10:18 even says “Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.” Then,in the second century, John’s Gospel portrays Jesus as divine and pre-existing. Because of its Jewish roots, Christians insisted that Christianity was monotheistic, yet it was coming dangerously close to being a duotheistic religion.

Around the end of the second century, Tertullian came up with an idea quite similar to the Trinity. During the third century, this developed into what we know as the Holy Trinity, which was adopted as doctrine, although against some opposition, at the Council of Nicaea.

The doctrine of the Trinity was of gradual and comparatively late formation. It had its origin in a source entirely foreign from that of the Jewish and Christian Scriptures .It was grafted on Christianity, through the hands of the Plato's followers.

The Platonic trinity, itself merely a rearrangement of older trinities dating back to earlier peoples, appears to be the rational philosophic trinity of attributes that gave birth to the three hypostases or divine persons taught by the Christian churches. This Greek philosopher’s conception of the divine trinity can be found in all the ancient [pagan] religions.

Throughout the ancient world, as far back as Babylonia, the worship of pagan gods grouped in threes, or triads, was common. That influence was also prevalent in Egypt, Greece, and Rome in the centuries before, during, and after Christ

Pure nonsense! The Trinity Doctrine is in both Testaments, although as stated just a while ago, it is intimated in the OT, but brought forth more clearly and developed in the NT.

And for your info, Jesus claimed to be equal to this Father. Jesus claimed to be fully divine.

In MK 10:18, Jesus was merely correcting the false notion that any mere mortal is good, for the man who approached him believed Jesus was only a man. He simply called Jesus "good teacher". So what? The religious establishment in Israel was full of "good teachers". The man had no clue who Jesus really was. He didn't even call him "Son of David". Or "Christ" or "Son of God".

Now, contrast that guy's ignorance with Peter's confession after Jesus asked his disciples "Who do people say I am"? After they said some think you're this, other's think you're that, etc. -- then Jesus asked them, "But who do you say I am?" (Mat 16:13-20) Not Peter's answer very carefully and how Jesus responded to Peter.

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Pure nonsense! The Trinity Doctrine is in both Testaments, although as stated just a while ago, it is intimated in the OT, but brought forth more clearly and developed in the NT.

Baloney. The word “Trinity” can be found nowhere in the Bible.

Neither the word “Trinity” nor the explicit doctrine appears in the New Testament, nor did Jesus and his followers intend to contradict the Shema in the Hebrew Scriptures: “Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord” (Deuteronomy 6:4).

Encyclopaedia Britannica

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

Baloney. The word “Trinity” can be found nowhere in the Bible.

Neither the word “Trinity” nor the explicit doctrine appears in the New Testament, nor did Jesus and his followers intend to contradict the Shema in the Hebrew Scriptures: “Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord” (Deuteronomy 6:4).

Encyclopaedia Britannica

Neither are the terms for some of the attributes that are ascribed to God, such as "omniscient", "omnipresent", "omnipotent" or "immutable" found in the bible. So what is your point?

Also, the doctrine of the Trinity does not contradict the Shema. The scriptures do not teach that there are multiple Gods, but that there are three persons in one God. And, yes, the doctrine is explicitly taught in scripture. In fact, Jesus himself affirmed the Shema.

I guess you don't believe your "best friend" when he claimed to be divine, heh? I seem to recall that you really balked at some of his very exclusive claims.

Meanwhile...I'm still waiting. You said earlier that other religions taught the Trinity. Prove that empty-headed claim.

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Quote any scriptures from any of the religions you cited yesterday that teaches that there are Three Persons in ONE God.

In Hinduism the trinity of God is similar to Christianity The Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost. These are all recognized in Vedic tradition. The "Vedas" are the Hindu scriptures.

God is the Isvara,(Brahma,God)) the Supreme controller the father of all and the cause of all causes.

He has no other origin and He is the prime cause of all causes. Brahma samhita 5.1

O conqueror of wealth, there is no truth superior to Me. Everything rests upon Me, as pearls are strung on a thread. Bg 7.7

It should be understood that all species of life, O son of Kunti, are made possible by birth in this material nature, and that I am the seed-giving father. Bg 14.4

The son (such as Krishna) is His representative who purely presents His instructions and is to be worshiped on the same level as God.

The spiritual master is to be honored as much as the Supreme Lord, because he is the most confidential servitor of the Lord. Bg ( Bhagavad Gita, the 5th Veda)


And the Holy Ghost is Paramatma (the supreme inner self) who is seated in everyone’s heart and assists the sincere in approaching Isvara, the Supreme Lord in conjunction with His Son, His pure devotee.

I, dwelling in their hearts, destroy with the shining lamp of knowledge the darkness born of ignorance. Bg 10.10 -11

[Light]

Originally Posted by boxcar

Neither are the terms for some of the attributes that are ascribed to God, such as "omniscient", "omnipresent", "omnipotent" or "immutable" found in the bible. So what is your point?

It's not my point. It's your point. You are the one who said the Trinity is taught in the Bible. I just disproved it and you have no answer but to act lobotomized as to why I disproved it.

[boxcar]

Originally Posted by Light

It's not my point. It's your point. You are the one who said the Trinity is taught in the Bible. I just disproved it and you have no answer but to act lobotomized as to why I disproved it.

The doctrine of the Trinity is taught in the bible. You're the one who came up with the lobotomized-induced reason that it's not because the word "trinity" itself is not found in the scriptures. So...going by your brain-dead reasoning, since the four terms I mentioned earlier that are used to denote some of God's major attributes, then God cannot be omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent or immutable.

So, what's up next, lightweight?