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View Poll Results: Who wins HOY? Accelerate or Justify?
Accelerate wins HOY 119 42.35%
Justify wins HOY 162 57.65%
Voters: 281. This poll is closed

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Old 01-28-2019, 11:32 AM   #496
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Wasn't this 3 month discussion started by Andy Asaro? I haven't seen him posting here for a while. He's still on the Twitter.
Don’t jinx it.
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Old 01-28-2019, 01:24 PM   #497
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Maybe we should have been debating City of Light vs. Justify?

I really wish the track wasn't such a mess and most likely working against quite a few horses in the race. But no matter how you slice it, COL was excellent.
City Of Light is 2 for 2 over Accelerate at 9 furlongs on different tracks.
I don't think there is much doubt that he is a better racehorse.
He would have won on Saturday on a fast track too.

Unfortunately, there is a tendency for some to automatically anoint
the winner of the BC Classic as HOTY. Happens every year.

This year's BC Classic was not the strongest of contests.
Justify's campaign was extraordinary. He deserved the award.
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Old 01-28-2019, 02:42 PM   #498
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Originally Posted by horses4courses View Post
This year's BC Classic was not the strongest of contests.
Justify's campaign was extraordinary. He deserved the award.
Agree.
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Old 01-28-2019, 03:08 PM   #499
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Originally Posted by horses4courses View Post
City Of Light is 2 for 2 over Accelerate at 9 furlongs on different tracks.
I don't think there is much doubt that he is a better racehorse.
He would have won on Saturday on a fast track too.

Unfortunately, there is a tendency for some to automatically anoint
the winner of the BC Classic as HOTY. Happens every year.

This year's BC Classic was not the strongest of contests.
Justify's campaign was extraordinary. He deserved the award.
I'm less certain who was better.

They were 2-1 head to head.

Not to take anything away from COL, but I'm not sure why 9F should count for more than 10F and I don't think Accelerate ran his A race Saturday. IMO, he's either over the top from the long season or didn't handle the track/trip as well as COL did right on the lead. Personally, I wish they were going to go at it a few more times after freshening up.

IMO, either way, they got the HOTY award right. You just wish Justify could have hung around for a few more races, got some more seasoning like Pharoah, and further diminished doubts about his quality.
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Old 01-28-2019, 03:33 PM   #500
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Originally Posted by classhandicapper View Post
I'm less certain who was better.

They were 2-1 head to head.

Not to take anything away from COL, but I'm not sure why 9F should count for more than 10F and I don't think Accelerate ran his A race Saturday. IMO, he's either over the top from the long season or didn't handle the track/trip as well as COL did right on the lead. Personally, I wish they were going to go at it a few more times after freshening up.

IMO, either way, they got the HOTY award right. You just wish Justify could have hung around for a few more races, got some more seasoning like Pharoah, and further diminished doubts about his quality.
It would have been great to see them face off again in 2019
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Old 01-28-2019, 03:58 PM   #501
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That effort in the Pegasus World Cup doesn't take anything away from Accelerate.
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Old 01-28-2019, 06:26 PM   #502
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Originally Posted by horses4courses View Post
City Of Light is 2 for 2 over Accelerate at 9 furlongs on different tracks.
I don't think there is much doubt that he is a better racehorse.
He would have won on Saturday on a fast track too.

Unfortunately, there is a tendency for some to automatically anoint
the winner of the BC Classic as HOTY. Happens every year.

This year's BC Classic was not the strongest of contests.
Justify's campaign was extraordinary. He deserved the award.
Just curious, which one of the races Justify won in 2018 was considered a strong contest? Or was his TC races all "not the strongest of contests" as Accelerates BCC.
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Old 01-28-2019, 07:17 PM   #503
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Just curious, which one of the races Justify won in 2018 was considered a strong contest? Or was his TC races all "not the strongest of contests" as Accelerates BCC.
Regardless of anyone's perception of the strength, or lack thereof,
of the 2018 TC races, one word sums up this horse's achievement.
Apollo.
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Old 01-28-2019, 09:07 PM   #504
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Regardless of anyone's perception of the strength, or lack thereof,
of the 2018 TC races, one word sums up this horse's achievement.
Apollo.
If you think that comparing Justify to Apollo is your reasoning for his "Achievement" which is the reason Justify should be HOY, I disagree.

Apollo was most likely a fluke. It was his only major win in racing according to Wiki. He was part of the "field" for betting purposes at the Derby. It was 1882.
Apollo did have one redeeming quality that Justify didnt have. He raced 21 times a 3 year old and 30 times as a 4 year old.

I remember when people used to say no horse can win the Derby without a certain Dosage, or a Beyer under a certain #. Never made sense then either.
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Old 01-28-2019, 09:19 PM   #505
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Just curious, which one of the races Justify won in 2018 was considered a strong contest? Or was his TC races all "not the strongest of contests" as Accelerates BCC.

It wouldn't matter... Justify didn't lose any of the weak ones.


There was just a single Thoroughbred in the land with as many or more wins, who was undefeated in 2018, and that runner didn't even try graded stakes company all year.

Then again, unlike Accelerate, that one did manage to win on Saturday.


Why is this no-brainer so difficult for so many people????


My God, Seattle Slew's 3yo campaign was of similar duration, and he lost a race, while there were muuuuuuuuuuuuch better older candidates in the wings than there are today, and 'Slew was also a no-brainer for HOY honors.


HOY 2018 was DECIDED before mid-June of 2018. It's that simple.
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Old 01-28-2019, 11:11 PM   #506
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My God, Seattle Slew's 3yo campaign was of similar duration, and he lost a race, while there were muuuuuuuuuuuuch better older candidates in the wings than there are today, and 'Slew was also a no-brainer for HOY honors.


HOY 2018 was DECIDED before mid-June of 2018. It's that simple.

Some of the same people that didn't think highly of Slew don't like Justify now and didn't think much of Pharoah either. That sentiment is primarily the result of the speed figures they look at.

I get the argument (not in Slew's case because they were so obviously wrong about him at the time given his Derby trip and subsequent race record), but so much of figures is pace/trip/race flow related and these horses are so much more lightly raced coming into these Triple Crown races than years ago. So IMO, they should be judged differently than the horses from years ago. IMO, Triple Crown horses will now tend to develop a little later (as Pharoah was doing until he got stopped). So we won't get to see the stream of 120s they might have earned if they stayed healthy and kept developing unless they come back at 4-5.
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Old 01-28-2019, 11:16 PM   #507
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Originally Posted by horses4courses View Post
City Of Light is 2 for 2 over Accelerate at 9 furlongs on different tracks.
I don't think there is much doubt that he is a better racehorse.
He would have won on Saturday on a fast track too.

Unfortunately, there is a tendency for some to automatically anoint
the winner of the BC Classic as HOTY. Happens every year.

This year's BC Classic was not the strongest of contests.
Justify's campaign was extraordinary. He deserved the award.
Right on the money... May never get the privilege to see such a combination or confluence of events or circumstances ever again as they relate to the Triple Crown races. It was truly something very special.
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Old 01-28-2019, 11:21 PM   #508
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Originally Posted by classhandicapper View Post
Some of the same people that didn't think highly of Slew don't like Justify now and didn't think much of Pharoah either. That sentiment is primarily the result of the speed figures they look at.

I get the argument (not in Slew's case because they were so obviously wrong about him at the time given his Derby trip and subsequent race record), but so much of figures is pace/trip/race flow related and these horses are so much more lightly raced coming into these Triple Crown races than years ago. So IMO, they should be judged differently than the horses from years ago. IMO, Triple Crown horses will now tend to develop a little later (as Pharoah was doing until he got stopped). So we won't get to see the stream of 120s they might have earned if they stayed healthy and kept developing unless they come back at 4-5.
True enough.

The best chance of seeing a champion 3 year old going on to exceptional feats
at 4, 5, and beyond, would be if the horse happened to be gelded.

Stallions earn so much more now - and at much less risk to the animal.

Pharoah was pretty amazing at 2, though.
He did keep improving as he went along.
Touch of a freak about him.
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Old 01-29-2019, 10:07 AM   #509
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Regardless of anyone's perception of the strength, or lack thereof,
of the 2018 TC races, one word sums up this horse's achievement.
Apollo.
And if not for American Pharoah, it would have been 39 years since it was done.

A lot of good horses ame close but could not do it.
Still it has only been done 13 times.

The BC Classic HAS to be won every years.
But whatever comes along. Greatest 3yo since Apollo!

In 10 years, Accelerate will be immortalized on a Trivial Pursuit Card.
Justify's name will live on forever.
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Old 01-29-2019, 11:16 AM   #510
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I'm less certain who was better.

They were 2-1 head to head.

Not to take anything away from COL, but I'm not sure why 9F should count for more than 10F and I don't think Accelerate ran his A race Saturday. IMO, he's either over the top from the long season or didn't handle the track/trip as well as COL did right on the lead. Personally, I wish they were going to go at it a few more times after freshening up.

IMO, either way, they got the HOTY award right. You just wish Justify could have hung around for a few more races, got some more seasoning like Pharoah, and further diminished doubts about his quality.
I would bet on City of Light at any distance up to 9F. He is the faster horse in my book to that distance, beyond sure he was not as good.
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