Breeder's Cup punks NYRA again - Page 2 - Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com

cj · 08-07-2011, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andymays

All you have to do is look at the Players involved. It's not a close call.

Exactly.

toussaud · 08-07-2011, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Some_One

If NYRA does run their own day against the BC, it would be the perfect example of US horse racing shooting themselves over and over again. It'll remind me when you had the Indycar series (w/ Indy 500) and the 'Cart' series w/ U.S. 500) run on the same day just to see who had the bigger <bleep>

I do not see this working now. it would have worked 2 years ago because they didn't have dirt in socal. They have dirt now.

cj · 08-07-2011, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toussaud

I do not see this working now. it would have worked 2 years ago because they didn't have dirt in socal. They have dirt now.

At this point nobody really knows what they have surface wise.

In any case, it is a long trip to SoCal for most horses...just ask John Shirreffs. When NYRA boost purses, there will be no incentive to ship.

toussaud · 08-07-2011, 07:01 PM

I have to disagree. being a breeders cup champion and having an eclipse award is always enough to ship.

Saratoga_Mike · 08-07-2011, 07:09 PM

Can't believe it, but I disagree with CJ and agree with Toussuad -- you aren't going to outdo the allure of winning a BC race, imo.

Canarsie · 08-07-2011, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cj

At this point nobody really knows what they have surface wise.

In any case, it is a long trip to SoCal for most horses...just ask John Shirreffs. When NYRA boost purses, there will be no incentive to ship.

Now you have me thinking I don't know if that's a good idea.

Maybe this Saratoga NBC/Versus package is a prelude to having a big day on their own.

I would imagine the purses will go through the roof just from people who have layovers at JFK airport. Throw in all the people who live just under 30 minutes from there it will be a gold mine. The only loser in this will be Yonkers.

I think if they even threw this out for discussion they would be awarded a year pronto. Of course I've been wrong before but I would love to see it played out.

Bruddah · 08-07-2011, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cj

What does that matter?

NYRA is getting slots sooner or later. They will be able to up purses, and maybe even beat BC purses, if they choose to do so. The vast majority of horsemen would just as soon stay home and run for the same money. The BC races are so diluted now they are pretty much your typical stakes races these days. Euros aren't going to be big on shipping that far to run on real dirt either.

The truth is Globalization of Horse Racing is a failure. Just the cost of shipping dooms the World wide concept. The increases in purses cannot and won't allow the gamble of shipping premium horse flesh nationwide, let alone world wide.

toussaud · 08-07-2011, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saratoga_Mike

Can't believe it, but I disagree with CJ and agree with Toussuad -- you aren't going to outdo the allure of winning a BC race, imo.

take this year. i could see it working with the fringe type horses. like life at ten i could see staying around in some type of mare dirt "champion" race or maybe a miler like beau chiox or a sprinter like aprority

but like, Winstar didn't come here to paint lol.they aren't going to send sidney's candy to NY, they didn't buy sidney's vcandy to send him to belmont dirt champion day races. Tizway's breeding rights were just bought by spendthrift, they are going to go to the breeders cup classic. that's just what's going to happen. Harve De grace is going to the breeders cup.

they best they can hope for is to take some of the horses out of the fields and somewhat reduce the quality, but they aren't getting any heavy hitters.

cj · 08-07-2011, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saratoga_Mike

Can't believe it, but I disagree with CJ and agree with Toussuad -- you aren't going to outdo the allure of winning a BC race, imo.

I hear what you are saying, but that has already started losing a little luster. It doesn't carry much weight in breeding circles already, and they keep adding races diluting the fields in all. It won't happen overnight, but it is happening.

In the end, money usually wins out over "prestige".

duncan04 · 08-07-2011, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andymays

Even though California is weaker they still have the most juice. That's the bottom line. Belmont will get it in 2013 but look for Santa Anita to be the permanent home after that. I wouldn't be happy about that if I didn't live in California either.

God I hope that never happens!! Hopefully Santa Anita has their track taken care of. But with Cal racing and Stronach owned tracks thats probably a longshot!

Saratoga_Mike · 08-07-2011, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cj

I hear what you are saying, but that has already started losing a little luster. It doesn't carry much weight in breeding circles already, and they keep adding races diluting the fields in all. It won't happen overnight, but it is happening.

In the end, money usually wins out over "prestige".

For Belmont to put on a show equal to the BC (from a purse standpt), you'd need to get the horsemen to sign off on shifting huge amounts of money from everyday racing to one big day. I just don't see that happening. Granted some of the NY-based horsemen with elite stock might support such a move. Don't get me wrong, I can't stand when the BC is in Cali.

5k-claim · 08-07-2011, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andymays

Even though California is weaker they still have the most juice. That's the bottom line. Belmont will get it in 2013 but look for Santa Anita to be the permanent home after that. I wouldn't be happy about that if I didn't live in California either.

I am from Kentucky, but did visit Santa Anita for the first time ever at the last Breeders' Cup there. The experience of the BC we had at the Santa Anita facility was easily more enjoyable than the ones I have had attending at Churchill such that, coupled with the beautiful weather, I joked with my brother that they should just hold it at Santa Anita every year- not realizing that was actually the plan.

I definitely like the event on a rotation, and think it is ridiculous that New York has not been back on that rotation for a while. I also feel that giving the series a single, permanent home is a huge mistake to the prestige of the event as it would then become just a big stakes day at that particular track every year- no longer the informal end-of-year "national championship" that it currently sort of serves as. Why make this just a permanent west coast stakes day?

I believe they are blowing their gimmick by considering a single, permanent host track. Even one that I definitely loved. It is going to be a whole lot easier to forget about once it is no longer a moving target.

.

Some_One · 08-07-2011, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruddah

The truth is Globalization of Horse Racing is a failure. Just the cost of shipping dooms the World wide concept. The increases in purses cannot and won't allow the gamble of shipping premium horse flesh nationwide, let alone world wide.

Given the successes of Rocket Man, JJ The Jet Plane and Goldikova over recent history (just to name a few), that statement is just false and ignorant...you only have this perception due to the overwhelming failure of US based horses and connections, especially now that Meydan is on Tapeta.

You know what these big overseas races do? They don't have insane nomination requirements and cover all expenses for starters.

Tom · 08-07-2011, 10:24 PM

Put on a show at Belmont and let the chips fall where they may,
I will play the East Coast championship over the BC in a heart beat.

Dollars to donuts the East will get the better fields.

Robert Fischer · 08-07-2011, 10:54 PM

I'm tired of all the politics.

run them on the best RACE TRACKS

BELMONT 2012
WOODBINE 2013
DEL MAR 2014
CHURCHILL 2015