The New Belmont Park

[CheckMark]

Sucks that they will race full time at Belmont Park. I must get to the "Big A" before they close.

But I do agree, the new designs are looking fantastic! Looks promising for Belmont to be a host of the 2026 Breeders Cup. Maybe Woodbine could be on the list next? I can only dream...

[Redboard]

Originally Posted by denniswilliams

They can do whatever they want but people are not going back to the track. Too much road traffic, among other things. Going to the track is a past era thing. Maybe they get a large crowd for the Belmont but doubtful it will approach the size of Belmont days of the past or even typical weekend days of the '60's or '70's. Only reason I can think of that any WINNING gambler would rather bet at the track rather than online.

Belmont day will be crazy full at least for the first few years. As far as betting at the track, as Sheffwed mentioned , on track bookmakers offering fixed odds like they have in Europe would be interesting, but probably unrealistic.
As far as road traffic, there is a train that goes to Belmont, at least there was the last time I went.

The only elephant in the room, as far as I can see is, when are they going to upgrade Saratoga?

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by JustRalph

The secret will be the treatment received (custm service wise) etc in the first 6 months of re-opening. A real management challenge.

100% agree.

There's almost not doubt attendance will be up initially because people will be curious to see the new facilities. The only thing that really matters though is the sustainability of any initial boost. Is there enough of a value proposition in terms of cost and environment to get families, couples, new race fans etc... there more often?

[racenomics]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

100% agree.

There's almost not doubt attendance will be up initially because people will be curious to see the new facilities. The only thing that really matters though is the sustainability of any initial boost. Is there enough of a value proposition in terms of cost and environment to get families, couples, new race fans etc... there more often?

One thing I’ll say is it matters very little how much admission costs. Admission is free at fair grounds and $2 at Santa Anita. Lone Star and Canterbury and Emerald admission is at least $10, yet all 3 get more people than FG and the first 2 get as many, if not more than Santa Anita. It costs $15 to see my local Minor league team play.
That said I think they should keep concessions to a reasonable level, to avoid people feeling ripped off. If a family of five spent $50 on admission, lost $30 betting, and spent $25 on concessions, and had a great time, they had a great day for $100, and are likely to come back and become fans. If they felt they were treated poorly, then that’s $100 downs the drain.
It’s all about the experience.

BTW here is the link to the whole renderings: https://franchiseoversightboard.ny.g...entfinal_0.pdf

[ScottJ]

Originally Posted by racenomics

BTW here is the link to the whole renderings: https://franchiseoversightboard.ny.g...entfinal_0.pdf

Having read the whole document including Chapter 2 (Building Concept), a few observations follow.

[1] When I look at the grandstand, my first reaction was that the new Meadowlands grandstand was dropped into the middle of the Arlington grandstand. All white and a ton of glass.

[2] Like others, I was surprised that UBS Arena was built to maintain the Belmont Park identity yet the new architecture seems to ignore that point. I am not saying this is "bad" per se, but the theme that I thought was important to this development project seems to have been lost or was actually deemed to be not important at all.

[3] The plans label the "New Paddock" which is probably the last thing that I thought was broken.

[4] I sure would like to get a feel of the grandstand's angle relative to the track for sightlines. Also, it would be great to know whether EVERYONE will get visual access to the finish line.

[5] There are A LOT of dining venues being planned. Floor one, Specialty Dining and Apron Box Dining. Floor two, Track View Dining. Floor three, Flat Floor Dining and Tiered Dining Seating. Floor four, High End Dining and Suites (likely catered). What I had not considered is whether this new vision will be the dining option for UBS Arena activities that will keep these restaurants busy. This will take us right back to the racetrack pricing discussion and I hope beyond hope that all of this dining space is not wasted.

[6] The preliminary GANTT Chart shows "Ready for Belmont Stakes" on June 1st, 2026 ... and ... "Ready for Breeder's Cup" on October 1st, 2026.

[Sheffwed]

Fine with me, I think the success of Turfway is telling

Tell that to the mostly terrible winter in NY trainers though,
I hope NYRA has the guts to stick with this decision

Racing the last few winters has been abominable in NY
and I think everybody knows it

NYRA on a very good roll, great to see

[racenomics]

Originally Posted by Sheffwed

Fine with me, I think the success of Turfway is telling

Tell that to the mostly terrible winter in NY trainers though,
I hope NYRA has the guts to stick with this decision

Racing the last few winters has been abominable in NY
and I think everybody knows it

NYRA on a very good roll, great to see

Tapeta should keep a lot more NY Breds racing in the winter, a lot of them are bred for turf

[Sheffwed]

Originally Posted by racenomics

Tapeta should keep a lot more NY Breds racing in the winter, a lot of them are bred for turf

potential larger field size alone (as in present day Turfway) argues for more tapeta in winter

I get that not everyone likes Tapeta, but Turfway I believe is something like 5x up in handle over 5 years ago

NYRA could use more jumbo payout opportunities and some new trainers

who cares what current winter NY trainers might say they want, I say who cares, get lost the lot of you, racing in the winter at the Big A has been a Big Zero

there's many others who would race for big $ on tapeta at the new Belmont in winter you can be very sure

[horsefan2019]

Originally Posted by denniswilliams

They can do whatever they want but people are not going back to the track. Too much road traffic, among other things. Going to the track is a past era thing. Maybe they get a large crowd for the Belmont but doubtful it will approach the size of Belmont days of the past or even typical weekend days of the '60's or '70's. Only reason I can think of that any WINNING gambler would rather bet at the track rather than online.

Well the new building is about 1/4 the size of the old one. Guessing it offers all the amenities of today, costs way less to heat and cool and reduced maintenance. Other than the big days, the Belmont Stakes and maybe a Breeders Cup, the new building looks like it fits the attendance for modern day thoroughbred racing.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by racenomics

Tapeta should keep a lot more NY Breds racing in the winter, a lot of them are bred for turf

I'm not so sure a lot are bred for turf, at least in my experience owning a piece of a few NY Breds. It's more like they were tried and failed on dirt. So they became turf horses because the competition was weaker.

[Poindexter]

Originally Posted by Sheffwed

Fine with me, I think the success of Turfway is telling

Tell that to the mostly terrible winter in NY trainers though,
I hope NYRA has the guts to stick with this decision

Racing the last few winters has been abominable in NY
and I think everybody knows it

NYRA on a very good roll, great to see

Fwiw, Turfway Park has become my favorite track. I think I had played it once or twice prior to 2024. Now I actually look forward to it.

[Snow Chief]

O'Rourke did make a good point on At the Races about the modern glass design: getting sunlight into the north facing grandstand. Belmont was always a refrigerator once the weather turned and winter racing would even be more brutal in that regard.

I am still very partial to the brick, copper, arches aesthetic, but looking forward to this new place all the same. (I remember the quote in a New York daily from an older woman when asked about the new Aqueduct: she said that it reminded her of a "supermarket.")

One interesting handicapping-related issue, Dick Powell on same At the Races segment noted that it looks like the finish line is moving further up the stretch. It was the first I heard of this in all the discussions over the years.